Moving to portugal and Brexit...
May 21st 2017, 7:18 am
#91
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Mar 2013
Location: central Portugal
Posts: 4,111
Re: Moving to portugal and Brexit...
When we group people to protect them, we need to ensure that they remain the core group we needed to protect in our society.
The winter fuel payment was brought in to protect the vulnerable old people against the dramatic rise in fuel costs, but when does a policy that's designed to benefit become a right? I'm not saying all old people should loose the winter fuel payment. However there's an interesting spilt between Corbin's believe that "Paul McCartney should get the winter fuel allowance" and the new Tory policy that it should be targeted to those who need it more.
The winter fuel payment was brought in to protect the vulnerable old people against the dramatic rise in fuel costs, but when does a policy that's designed to benefit become a right? I'm not saying all old people should loose the winter fuel payment. However there's an interesting spilt between Corbin's believe that "Paul McCartney should get the winter fuel allowance" and the new Tory policy that it should be targeted to those who need it more.
As I pointed out earlier, successive Govts from both sides have treated the older generation extremely unfairly.
May 21st 2017, 7:21 am
#92
Resident Cynic
Joined: Aug 2013
Location: Suffolk,UK; Alentejo, Portugal
Posts: 14,970
Re: Moving to portugal and Brexit...
When we group people to protect them, we need to ensure that they remain the core group we needed to protect in our society.
The winter fuel payment was brought in to protect the vulnerable old people against the dramatic rise in fuel costs, but when does a policy that's designed to benefit become a right? I'm not saying all old people should loose the winter fuel payment. However there's an interesting spilt between Corbin's believe that "Paul McCartney should get the winter fuel allowance" and the new Tory policy that it should be targeted to those who need it more.
The winter fuel payment was brought in to protect the vulnerable old people against the dramatic rise in fuel costs, but when does a policy that's designed to benefit become a right? I'm not saying all old people should loose the winter fuel payment. However there's an interesting spilt between Corbin's believe that "Paul McCartney should get the winter fuel allowance" and the new Tory policy that it should be targeted to those who need it more.
The problem with all of these "targeted" benefits is that the administrative costs are crippling, so the "obvious" choice of limiting payments to those in need actually means that you spend money in limiting them AND the benefits don't reach the people intended.
May 21st 2017, 12:31 pm
#93
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 379
Re: Moving to portugal and Brexit...
The problem is the targeting. It has been proven that means-tested benefits do no reach the people in need - in particular older people, as there are an estimated 1m eligible people who have not applied for pension credit. If the fuel benefit is handled the same way then most pensioners will lose it, not just "the rich". In my view it should be scrapped and added to the basic pension - then those who are above the thresholds will pay tax on it, reducing the net cost without the need for extra overheads (PS, I'm not eligible, in case you're wondering).
The problem with all of these "targeted" benefits is that the administrative costs are crippling, so the "obvious" choice of limiting payments to those in need actually means that you spend money in limiting them AND the benefits don't reach the people intended.
The problem with all of these "targeted" benefits is that the administrative costs are crippling, so the "obvious" choice of limiting payments to those in need actually means that you spend money in limiting them AND the benefits don't reach the people intended.
Corbyn's idea of a fair society that includes 'Paul mcartney' - who i'm sure has contributed more into the UK system financially than he could ever take out if he lives and receives his pension and heat allowance until the age of 10000 - is not only fair but also as the poster states makes perfect economic sense - the cost of implementing selective systems is huge and pointless
This appaling UK attitude of singling out a single or tiny group of people as justification for 'robbery' especially of those most in need must end
The gutter press and Tories have a lot to answer for
Last edited by carvoeiro; May 21st 2017 at 12:34 pm.
May 21st 2017, 1:49 pm
#94
Forum Regular
Joined: Sep 2016
Location: Nr Vila Velha Ródão & Southampton
Posts: 254
Re: Moving to portugal and Brexit...
The problem is the targeting. It has been proven that means-tested benefits do no reach the people in need - in particular older people, as there are an estimated 1m eligible people who have not applied for pension credit. If the fuel benefit is handled the same way then most pensioners will lose it, not just "the rich". In my view it should be scrapped and added to the basic pension - then those who are above the thresholds will pay tax on it, reducing the net cost without the need for extra overheads(PS, I'm not eligible, in case you're wondering).
The problem with all of these "targeted" benefits is that the administrative costs are crippling, so the "obvious" choice of limiting payments to those in need actually means that you spend money in limiting them AND the benefits don't reach the people intended.
The problem with all of these "targeted" benefits is that the administrative costs are crippling, so the "obvious" choice of limiting payments to those in need actually means that you spend money in limiting them AND the benefits don't reach the people intended.
The flip could be, by making winter fuel payments linked to pension credits it might encourage more pensioners who deserve PC but never claimed it, to get both.
Last edited by BEVS; May 21st 2017 at 10:03 pm. Reason: Hard to see & it was politely requested not to do this which you have totally ignored.
May 21st 2017, 2:01 pm
#95
Resident Cynic
Joined: Aug 2013
Location: Suffolk,UK; Alentejo, Portugal
Posts: 14,970
Re: Moving to portugal and Brexit...
Try applying for a means-tested benefit - see whether you like answering questions on your income, outgoings and anything else they want to a complete stranger. People look on it as asking for charity - and their pride (perhaps misplaced) stops them even asking. The government know this - it helps heep the budget down.
