Re: NCR llockdown
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stokkevn
Out in the sticks..... Local mall ( 25km away ) tried to stop me going in as I am 64, I explained that the EO stated Senior Citizens are deemed to be over 65 years old, luckily I did take a copy of the EO with me, long faces all round when they saw they were wrong and I suggested to their manager that he and his staff should go on a training....

Seems that the writ of Manila doesn't apply in your part of the sticks. I think you are, like Manila, under GCQ. Under which Seniors must stay at home except for essential activities, like going to work, shopping etc. I think that would effectively include any shopping..not just grocery. Plenty of seniors can now be seen in the various shops in our local Mall. Exercising also to be seen around here. Rappler is reporting this afternoon that the same goes for those areas under the modified GCQ, in case you are under that.

EO ?. In the Philippines you become a senior at 60. Tuesday my wife was initially refused entry to a local mall, the conversation went " what year were you born" 1960, " you are sixty so you can't come in " I'm 59 until October so yes I can. Anyway the rules have changed again, now still not allowed out under MGCQ.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

Well, the rule for both GCQ and MGCQ is that Seniors must stay at home except for essential activities..and that must include at least shopping and medical needs. This Rappler article explains it clearly. Interesting that for a few days Seniors under the MGCQ were even back to pre Quarantine normal, until it was amended.

https://www.rappler.com/nation/26287...r-modified-gcq

Never any problem for me being out since March with Supermarket, Mall entrances and one road check here in Paranaque.

As you're having a problem it's worth having the Rappler article available to show to people at mall entrances.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

It is the lack of proper guidelines, the president will give out one set of guidelines with the caveat that LGUs will give out their own version of his EO, so basically saying everything in his EO will be over ridden by local guidelines. Then I have asked the local LGU for their guidelines and they just refer to the presidents EO except there may be some differences which when you ask the PNP and the local health dept they are on different planets.The next village requires travel permits that our village say are not required and don't issue. Problem now solved as there is a track that circumnavigates the next village checkpoint. Status quo restored in Ph.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

In Manila it seems that the rules in the various cities are pretty much the same. Also in Cebu, as the silly banning of couples on motorbikes was the subject of a formal application for change, which was turned down by the President. Mostly on the basis that he wants uniform rules across the country!

https://newsinfo.inquirer.net/128678...le-back-riding

Yet from posters here it looks like when you get away from the capital and the bigger cities they're applying many of their own rules under either General or Modified CQ.

I'm sure the President, being very much a Senior, but an active one, would not be happy that people over 60 are being turned away at Malls in some places. In fact I recall that in the early days of the emergency Quarantine here in Manila he told groceries to allow Seniors to by pass the long lines at groceries. The grocery I frequent the most here allowed just that.

Pity they don't have a hotline for Quarantine complaints.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

Access for Seniors at supermarkets in Marikina went off to a confusing start. At the beginning of the lockdown after waiting patiently in line for 20 minutes a security guard came out and shouted that seniors were not permitted to enter. I'm nearly 73 and I got away with saying I was born in 1961. Two days later it was announced that Seniors, PWD's and frontliners had priority access. Since then I go and sit at the priority entrance and gain entry within a minute.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

A lot to do with saying Seniors "must stay at home'...which is the memorable bit,,,then following it with the exemption for essential outings. Which obviously wasn't and still isn't taken in by many. Better saying something like "must usually stay at home, except for....". Behind that I think there are some wrong preconceptions here about the fitness and capability of many Seniors, especially Expats. The previous poster got away with claiming 14 years younger!.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

Just seen a report on the "rapid testing" last week of residents living in the two streets mentioned above. It yielded 78 positives out of 1678 people tested. With the caveat that those 78 will be retested to confirm, that would add to the 119 positive cases already recorded in the containing barangay. And over half the new positives were asymptomatic. Not surprising, given the area is densely populated with narrow roads etc. where it's very difficult to properly socially distance.

The thing is that just about every city in MM has these areas. If the DOH and local authorities can do rapid testing in most of them that will improve things a lot. But if not the whole Metro area will be treated for a long time as a large region where the virus is not under control with travel restrictions maintained to adjoining provinces.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

Watched the latest BBC news, which this morning was mainly about a messy situation there in England with primary schools, Not all years now going back in the near future. Being left up to head teachers. Same messy situation here really with education..probably even more serious. The President said no vaccine, no face to face classes. His spokesman later "clarified" that that meant no physical classes until Quarantines ended. Presumably a lot sooner...unless no large second wave. Meanwhile lack of good internet means the combination of worksheets plus online won't, if ever it could be, even a close substitute. Anyway parents want and need to get back to work. And the economy needs them to do so too, Kids with rich parents will manage somehow but the poor will be further disadvantaged. Think social distancing needs to be looked at in a wider context here with education together with the data on children. It's well established they are less infected, but not clear how infectious they could be.

Seems to me that in general social distancing is not being considered in context. Old style Jeepneys are not yet allowed back. The extra buses are nowhere near enough.and on the right routes...some people are now experiencing 4 hour commutes, according to reports. But inside there's usually plenty of mixing with outdoor air. When they are back with social distancing will they be worth running? If not will their operation be subsidised by a government still dealing with a virus outbreak and which has already paid a lot out to the poor over the past few months.?

Re: NCR llockdown
 

Some questionable Quarantine experiences in Paranaque today:

First, at the regular grocery, extra busy on Independence day, found they now had put in a "Frontliners" checkout beside the usual Senior one. Frontliners defined in writing and pictures as Doctors, Nurses, Police and Army!! Problem was there were few of them in the line and they were joined by many Seniors, who either did so by habit as it also said "Priority" or who didn't like the long Seniors line building up next door. Many Seniors were there as they don't have to wait to get in. Whether the Frontliners can also just walk in I couldn't find out. Anyway, as usual there were some ineffective attempts by various staff to sort out the Frontliners line and someone who looked like a doctor went to complain at a higher level. Nothing came of that.

Then, off to a nearby dental clinic to get an X ray for my wife. Asked for P1,600! The same X ray was only P300 in January. The receptionist had no explanation for the increase. Then, went to another dental clinic at another Mall and there was asked P450 for the X ray ..well, it is a new clinic in a Mall....plus P350 for COVID -19 precautions ie payment for a new protective gown, the same as the one the Dentist there had on. I was told it was the washable type. But despite buying it you don't take it away after. Interestingly my wife said that at the first clinic she didn't see anyone around wearing a gown of any sort.

Lastly, got a take out from Jolibee. Before ordering you fill out a small form with date/time, name and phone number. and submit it. With no explanation of why they want it. Are they, or whoever decided on it, really serious it will enable contact tracing?

Re: NCR llockdown
 

When my wife ordered a pizza at the shopping mall a few weeks ago, we got the same bit of paper, so it was 'Father Xmas', date and time was 01.01.1900 at 00:00 and a fictitious phone number. Everything accepted. So I assume some other poor bugger is now getting texts/calls offering delivered pizza at huge price.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

The British PM is considering reducing the minimum social distancing rule there from 2m down to 1m. I wasn't aware it was up at 2m and so am thinking the Philippines went sensibly for 1m. Just thinking of those lines outside groceries! Most other countries also seem to be at 1m though Taiwan is at 1.5m inside.

The UK restaurant, pubs and bar trade organisations have said keeping the 2m rule will force large scale closures. Here those businesses in he NCR should know today whether they can operate at a maximum of 50% capacity. Also with table spacing, diner separation. Then the questions over the next few months are...Will customers feel safe enough to come in? Afford to come in? Will they enjoy the experience? If not, even with rent reductions, many establishments will close. Many low paid jobs at risk in the NCR especially.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

I think you're confused Raffin. The social distancing here in Fils is in fact 2m same as UK.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

https://www.gmanetwork.com/news/news...story/?just_in

A midnight announcement that Manila staying on GCQ for at least a further fortnight. Then the Palace spokesman saying they want to be under 40,000 cases by July.. Sounds a useful aim until you realize it could be achieved by simply holding back on testing! Surely unintentional, but this is exactly a line the US President has pushed a number of times..

The Covid-19 PR doesn't look too good here...the daily statistics of cases are split into fresh and delayed, and when the latter is greater, as it often is, this is cited as a reason to put less importance on the total. Also look out for a tendency to stress the number of recoveries. But it's a young population here. And IATF members don't seem to be showing up to be questioned. Much of this is In line with what is happening in the US and the UK.

Seems many politicians worldwide don't know what best to do in the next few months with Covid and the economy until a successful vaccine is available. Better they admitted that more often rather than pretend they do.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

Interesting to read that as over the last 3 months I haven't seen any official mention of 2m nor any use of 2m in signs, practice etc around our part of Manila at least. Always say 1m or look about 1m. I looked at the executive order from Malacanag on March 13 and it doesn't give a figure. But I did find this news item on guidelines for public transport:

https://www.philstar.com/headlines/2...under-gcq-dilg

Though It's always possible that an LGU does it's own thing. Where did you get the idea of 2m from? Grocery lines here on some days have been very long and awkward for operators to manage. If people had been standing 2m apart they would have have been almost impossible.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

In Davao it has always been and still is 2m or 6ft

Re: NCR llockdown
 

Davao is probably the best managed city in the Philippines.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

https://pia.gov.ph/news/articles/1042001

Not officially. Read through this and you will just see "at least 1 meter".. I just saw one news item where Sara Duterte "advised" 2m.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

At my local Palawan there are signs dotted all over the place referring to Covid 19 precautions.. One reads one metre.. Another two metres... And a third states six feet. Just take your pick I guess..

Regards
​​​​​​.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

P11,
Good to learn that you are alive and kicking

Re: NCR llockdown
 

An update on going to a private dentist, having got your X-ray. If you find one in business you first need to fill out a form....it will probably be done online as generally here they are not at their clinics. Mostly about your health, dental situation (you have to be in some pain etc), and you sign a disclaimer. You also commit to pay for extra COVID precautions. You send the completed form back to your dentist and arrange an appointment. As it happened my wife was just given a plastic hair cap and foot protectors. I wasn't allowed in. The bill was about the same as pre COVID.

Restaurants in Paranaque now allowed to open at 30% capacity, with dividers and need customers to fill in a contact tracing form.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

Not surprised as the EO of this country's leader back in March did not give a distance...although 1m is by far the most common one around. Never mind the lining up etc Some video of shoppers in Oxford St a few days ago showed not even 1m being observed, But the scientists will have a distance in mind and its real importance comes in areas like education and transport.

In the UK it's being taken seriously. A reporter on the BBC said that changing the distance from 2m down to 1m would mean that English classrooms could safely accommodate 20 rather than 15 students. Applying similar thinking here a 2m distance applied to state schools would probably mean splitting most classes into an impossible 3 groups, but with 1m you can scrape 2. Even so face to face contact will be very limited and they will still need those Chinese transistor radios!

Re: NCR llockdown
 

https://www.rappler.com/nation/26440...s-june-22-2020

Modern jeepneys to be allowed back and soon it looks like UVs will be too. But what about the transport workhorse,.. the traditional jeep? We have two parked up near our house for 3 months now. The driver of the nearest one runs the engine every few days. He has no other job. Some weeks ago a Solon floated the idea of recruiting them for contact tracing work! Really? He's obviously not in the poorest of them, but from reports many seem to be in a very bad state.

I think the authorities have generally been very slow to bring back mass road transport in Manila by trying much too hard to achieve their desired social distancing. As shown best by the late U turn on motorcycle backriding. Not taking into account the poor social distancing for people waiting for other forms of transport and the sheer inconvenience to the poor.

Traditional jeepneys when going along have plenty of outside air flow and perhaps when stationary this could be suplemented by fans? Compare that with the enclosed UVs. They could be restricted to 50% maximum capacity, like the modernized. And allowed to charge a bit more. But the plastic sheeting in the modernized jeepneys looks impossible to put in the traditional ones, and maybe this alone will stop them being brought back in the next few months...or even ever. Which may be a nice unintended outcome for the authorities. They have long been annoyed with the opposition of the traditional jeepney owners and drivers to the modernization programme.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

Just need to take some 1 meter wide cardboard boxes and tape them on the seats. Of course people going down the aisle will cross into the zone of other people. To reduce physical contact Jeepneys should allow only one person in the aisle at any one time and wait at the stop longer.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

They also need to implement designated stops rather than either side of a junction because the passenger is to lazy to cross the road.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

Yes, that could well work, together with some other simple measures, Though the owners may not bother if they think that income reducing capacity limits are going to be in place for a long time with no further government financial assistance. And they know the long term agenda is to get rid of traditional Jeeps and bring in the modernized ones. To get an idea of the transport deficit and the numbers of drivers etc who will lose their jobs I tried and failed to get a number for the traditional Jeeps, but it must be in the thousands in Manila alone. With all the restrictions in place there\s patently nowhere near enough transport to get people to work, but all they say is that they might allow the use of some traditional Jeeps at some point.....if they need to!

Interesting that passengers on the modernized vehicles with AC need to fill up a contact form, so maybe there isn't total confidence they are that safe? The role AC might play in aiding virus spread is a matter of concern, I have seen a couple of videos of how that can work in restaurants on international news channels. This post from the IBON foundation summarizes some related findings. Dismissed by the President's spokesman.

https://www.gmanetwork.com/news/news...nvinced/story/

Re: NCR llockdown
 

Prior to lock down there was never enough buses as most would cram every last space with a body part and then some would be hanging out the doors. pretty much same for the jeepneys. Yet at the same time we were told that heavy traffick was due to volumes of buses and jeepneys. Now ith reduces numbers of both plus spatial distancing , there will not be enough workers to to get the jobs done or look after their families. Reality is that with spatial distancing there would have to be more than double the number of buses and jeepneys as there were before pre lock down...just to almost be at par for travelling public.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

https://www.gmanetwork.com/news/news...story/?just_in

Good at last a lawmaker coming out with some figures on the blindingly obvious. She says there are 75,000 traditional jeeps laid up. Wow! And as mike2 says at the best of times they aren't enough.

Governments around the world are realising that there are some areas where it's not possible to bring full economic life back and at the same time impose strict COVID social distancing rules eg at airports, transport generally and probably too with hospitality. With the one exception of mask wearing, which can be both imposed by the government and the individual. Given the third world economy we have here it would be disastrous to prevent the millions of poor in Manila from earning a living for much longer. Ms Quimbo wants an alternative to the Jeep provided....there isn't one.

https://news.abs-cbn.com/news/06/23/...s-enforced-doh

Another lady at the DOH isn't worried by the AC in the modernized Jeeps, but is concerned that in a traditional Jeep passengers are facing each other. Well, they would all be wearing masks, which are very effective in reducing transmission. One big reason why many Asian countries have done better than most European countries and the US in this pandemic. Plus, unlike the new Jeeps, there is, or could be generated, a good air current. She says safety standards would need to be enforced......but people here, as far as my observations are concerned anyway, are very good at wearing them.

Both ladies like the idea of dividers. But as the DOH U/S remarks the driver/owners can't afford to fit them. As they would need to be made of Perspex, For me, not necessary, as sideways transmission risks will be small. Setting capacity maximums so we will be under pre COVID overcrowding levels and, at the same time, earn the owners some profit will be Ok for now as economic activity is recovering and many people will be continuing working fully or partly from home.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

Even if you are gonna have partitions (and unless you clean them regularly-i.e. after each customer leaves) there would be body/clothing contact transmission with the prior passenger.

Don't know if anyone has done any studies or models of jeepney airflow and Covid spread. I've seen some models on the spread of unmasked vs. masked individuals in restaurants and running. Masked certainly ~ helps but airflow patterns in an open jeepney would likely cause the spread down the row, not directly across. It would be particles expressed through the side of the mask that would be the risk to other riders. Still the large particles would still be reduced...it would be the microparticles that would be the issue. These tend to have reduced viral load. Except when people cough or sneeze...most of the voids are caught be the mask but some macro particles do get out through the sides and top of the mask. If I rode a jeepney I'd take a long shower after getting home, and put my clothes in a heavy detergent wash.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

The numbers of COVIID cases have been steadily rising here over the last few weeks. While this is a lot to do with more testing and the death tally is low how good is the contact tracing to lower the future count? Then there are reports of health issues after recovery, even for young people. The most immediate issue is probably the effect on hospitals. Patients likely to be turned away. Maybe not yet in Manila, although there are reports of some hospitals in financial difficulty as Philhealth has been accused of being slow in paying them for COVID treatment..

Cebu City has become a hotspot, with the most cases of any city in the country. The President said the local government there had been slow to act so he sent in some members of the IATF, earlier this week. All Quarantine passes have been immediately withdrawn.....with no announcement as of last night as to how people are going to get out for essential purposes! Things are not going that well in parts of Manila either, so let's hope that will not be copied here!

The President appointed the head of the DENR to oversee the Cebu operation. He's still keeping that position, which has raised some eyebrows. Interestingly he's a retired General, as is the head of the nationwide anti COVID operation. The President is at present going around army bases to push the campaign against the NPA and the cabinet has about a quarter of its members ex Armed Forces or Police, so it's not surprising. But I just wonder whether these military guys are the right ones to head the moves out of lockdown?

Re: NCR llockdown
 

"At least 20 million people in the US may already have been infected with Covid-19, according to the latest estimate by health officials.

The Centers for Disease Control (CDC) says the true number of cases is likely to be 10 times higher than the reported figure.....

Our best estimate right now is that for every case that was reported, there actually were 10 other infections," CDC Director Dr Robert Redfield told reporters.

This was because testing was restricted to people with symptoms and ASYMPTOMATIC CARRIERS were not tested, he said."

BBC News June 26

https://news.abs-cbn.com/news/06/25/...-exceeds-50000

Expanding to non medical frontliners looks sensible after a slow start when the authorities really neglected medical frontliners. But they must still be missing most of the asymptomatic carriers. Since the Philippines has a young population this must be a big concern. This research compares Italy, where testing mainly followed infection and S Korea, where many people not showing symptoms were also tested:

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/world...-covid-19.html

The official case total here is about 33,000 now. But it seems it could really be much more. Yes, they can mostly be with milder symptoms, but they can spread it to older people and will keep all the annoying and economy restricting quarantines in place for longer.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

I don't know if they just don't know or are plain lying but somewhere like Cebu or Manils could have 30,000 cases on their own without trying. People say oh it's bad here or bad there. 30,000 nationwide no way.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

Think it's mainly a combination of poor reporting in addition to just not knowing through being slow to test in the many densely populated areas in Manila and Cebu.

But they have a motive to lie here as they are always claiming our long and strict lockdowns, using large numbers of police and military have kept the numbers low. Now cases are increasing together with hospital admissions they cannot put most of it down to increased testing and the slow opening up the economy. Social distancing and mask wearing seems to be at a high level. Some brave people are asking unwelcome questions to an authoritarian government on whether good use was made of the lockdowns.

Under-reporting of COVID-19 deaths is a worldwide problem, not just in developing countries. Britain did not include care home deaths in the daily announced total for many weeks. And this BBC report shows that using Excess Death calculations the UK earlier this month had added about 25% to its deaths total:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-53073046

I think an excess deaths calculation here would show much more than 25%.

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A couple of analyses suggesting a certain lack of transparency here on the COVID-19 outbreak. Following what has been seen elsewhere in the world with regards to the slow updating of data and a tendency to put too much blame on imported infections.

https://www.rappler.com/nation/26540...ronavirus-data

https://news.abs-cbn.com/news/07/01/...ss-than-10-pct

Re: NCR llockdown
 

A coincidence, but the last thing that transport lacking young commuters need is this extra requirement to attend and pass a theoretical course to get their student license. Three five hour lectures?

https://www.sunstar.com.ph/article/1844511

Re: NCR llockdown
 

According to this article only about 12% of Traditional Jeepneys have now returned to ply sometimes shortened routes in Metro Manila, at greatly reduced capacity. Subject to lots of requirements, some sensible but others probably not, including record keeping of passengers, and record keeping by passengers. Wouldn't be surprised that unless some of the more onerous requirements aren't dropped many won't want to come back. Especially as they will struggle to make a living long term.

The two Jeeps we can see from our house are still laid up. And very few to be seen on the main throughfares in our part of Paranaque.

https://www.rappler.com/nation/26543...ey-july-3-2020

Re: NCR llockdown
 

The jeepneys were out and about in force in Olongapo today, and not a lot of social distancing going on.

Re: NCR llockdown
 

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/...075915105.html

Hopefully a one off as an important part of the plan for Metro Manila is to concentrate looking for the virus in parts of some of the 300 plus most densely populated barangays.

Otherwise cases are more widely spread and not so easy to mass test and contact trace. If that is the case there seems to be no government appetite for reimposing a general lockdown so they are resigned to cases continuing to increase over the next few weeks, and are probably planning now to provide more COVID hospital beds. Then hope more testing/tracing can finally get the curve to plateau.

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If you need an alternative to watching rolling news, films and old sitcoms you can rely on Meralco to keep you occupied. Got a new bill yesterday which offers a new installment plan for March to May, different from the one they sent a few weeks ago. That was based on four installments whereas the new one is six. Up to November. Fine...but the unpaid amount now includes just one past unpaid bill and not two. Good that the one unpaid bill is now corrected to reflect a past payment, but I wonder what happened to the other unpaid amount? The bill for that date was originally for 0.00 but came up in the first instalment plan at over 5k. I assumed it was an estimate. So maybe they have now scrapped that? Plus, maybe they allowed for my payment of the first instalment of the first plan? But that was less. All that Meralco say on the new plan bill is that there may be some centavos rounding errors!

I generally pride myself as being able to understand this sort of thing, but as what they are asking seems reasonable I won't bother and will just go with Plan B...rather than risk spending hours in one of their business centres. No wonder people are confused.

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Does common sense prevail? I think not. From what you have written Meralco seems to be creating more confusion. I'm not sure if I'm the exception as I paid the two estimated bills for April and May and had a pleasant surprise in June when the actual consumption bill came to half of what I anticipated. I undertake all of my financial transactions online it saves unnecessary aggravation. A Swiss neighbour had quite a shock when his June bill arrived as he failed to pay the two estimated bills. My next bill arrives in two days so watch this space.

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I thought our power supplier was a disaster zone with just of the few basic problems - power supply and billing. We normally get the bill on about the 12/13th of the month to be paid by the 16th. A while ago bill arrived as normal followed by a letter on the 14th to say that they were cutting me off due to unpaid bill, as did quite a few others in our road. So down to their office and after telling the manager to "Sit up straight and listen" quite loudly all was sorted out. He first tried to say it was computer error until I showed him the hand written letter. I always keep about 6 months worth of receipts just incase.