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Re: What a cop out...
Originally Posted by jimf
(Post 8448651)
I don't think the action he took was completely unreasonable.
Obviously I don't think men should beat women with sticks except in the most extreme circumstances and that neither being verbal irksome nor being oppressively close physically constitutes an extreme circumstance. I think the orange juice defence might work against him; I find it difficult to think of a manner in which someone could be genuinely threatening while consuming a soft drink. I think he might have arrested her without delivering the beating though I concede that it's hard to tell since we can't see the mob, if any, behind her. |
Re: What a cop out...
A copper hitting a shrieking hippy....
As Oscar Wilde might have said, "the unspeakable chasing the inedible." |
Re: What a cop out...
Originally Posted by iaink
(Post 8448674)
Erm, they do get training dont they?
No doubt now there is a field exercise where vocal annoying protestors charge up to individual officers slightly separated from the phalanx and they do the "correct" thing to defuse the situation - whatever that is as long as it doesn't involve reaching for the batton. No other officers there saw fit to assault anyone armed with a noisy gob and (a carton of juice) did they? Well - no one got caught on video anyway Yes, you are right, it IS easy to judge. He was frustrated and overreacted. Should it end his career? no probably not. Should we turn a blind eye? Certainly not. I certainly don't think we should turn a blind eye. I don't think the police should have freedom to whack anyone they feel like but at the same time i think reasonable allowance needs to be made for the situations they have to deal with. |
Re: What a cop out...
Originally Posted by jimf
(Post 8448720)
I certainly don't think we should turn a blind eye. I don't think the police should have freedom to whack anyone they feel like but at the same time i think reasonable allowance needs to be made for the situations they have to deal with.
He was an officer on duty at a rowdy protest, some shouting and confrontation is surely to be expected, and its certainly not illegal. Even as a five year old I was familiar with "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me", and it seems this guy is too, hence the rather improbable "orange juice" threat defence I guess. I still completely fail to see how that was regarded as sufficent danger to warrant his action, but I guess time will tell. The UK courts never fail to surprise me in the application of justice. |
Re: What a cop out...
Originally Posted by dbd33
(Post 8448685)
Not a million miles from jingsamichty's "could be considered not unreasonable". In short, no one seems to be prepared to say that this is a proper way for a policeman to behave. Some will make concessions because of his job, effectively holding him to a lower standard of behaviour than applies to the public at large.
I think the behaviour is undesirable certainly and not best practice no doubt but that in itself doesn't make it assault does it? Obviously I don't think men should beat women with sticks except in the most extreme circumstances and that neither being verbal irksome nor being oppressively close physically constitutes an extreme circumstance. I think the orange juice defence might work against him; I find it difficult to think of a manner in which someone could be genuinely threatening while consuming a soft drink. I think he might have arrested her without delivering the beating though I concede that it's hard to tell since we can't see the mob, if any, behind her. Yes the video doesn't necessarily show the whole picture. |
Re: What a cop out...
Originally Posted by Jingsamichty
(Post 8448663)
I do find it sad that a woman who is basically a professional protestor - she is described in court as an animal rights activist - can't take the odd whack from a copper as an occupational hazard.
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Re: What a cop out...
Originally Posted by jimf
(Post 8448754)
I think the behaviour is undesirable certainly and not best practice no doubt but that in itself doesn't make it assault does it
The defenders on this board will probably say coppers should be held to a higher standard than the general public because of the power they have (in fact I think rae even said this). They then go on to describe how they should actually be held to a lower standard (as dbd said) because their job is difficult and frustrating - well get another job then as beating young girls half your size with a truncheon is not the behaviour of hard case no-nonsense coppers. |
Re: What a cop out...
Originally Posted by jimf
(Post 8448754)
.
How do you define an assault? Do you agree that police officers driving cars at high speeds should not be held to account if they run someone over, after all, aren't they just doing their jobs in that instance as well? Should I be allowed to hit a police officer with a stick that if I feel threatened by him? |
Re: What a cop out...
Originally Posted by Almost Canadian
(Post 8448771)
Where is is stated that she complained?
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Re: What a cop out...
Originally Posted by Jingsamichty
(Post 8448785)
Look at the video - after the cop had cuffed her, she ran back remonstrating and pointing out that he'd just hit a woman, the fascist pig-dog.
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Re: What a cop out...
Originally Posted by Jingsamichty
(Post 8448785)
Look at the video - after the cop had cuffed her, she ran back remonstrating and pointing out that he'd just hit a woman, the fascist pig-dog.
You obviously think it is OK for men to hit women, I don't. |
Re: What a cop out...
Originally Posted by Almost Canadian
(Post 8448796)
OK. I meant in the prosecution sense.
Originally Posted by Almost Canadian
(Post 8448796)
You obviously think it is OK for men to hit women, I don't.
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Re: What a cop out...
Originally Posted by Almost Canadian
(Post 8448780)
Should I be allowed to hit a police officer with a stick that if I feel threatened by him?
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Re: What a cop out...
Originally Posted by Jingsamichty
(Post 8448813)
As a lawyer, I'm sure you know that it's not what you meant that matters, it's what you said.
Originally Posted by Jingsamichty
(Post 8448813)
You like leaping to conclusions, don't you? First, I was be "saying it's OK to shoot Brazilians on the Tube", and now "I obviously think it's OK for men to hit women."
Your reference to live by the sword, die by the sword, led me to this conclusion. So tell me then, did he do wrong by hitting her? |
Re: What a cop out...
Originally Posted by Alan2005
(Post 8448774)
Yes, it does. If I did that to somebody then I would get done for assault.
The defenders on this board will probably say coppers should be held to a higher standard than the general public because of the power they have (in fact I think rae even said this). They then go on to describe how they should actually be held to a lower standard (as dbd said) because their job is difficult and frustrating - well get another job then as beating young girls half your size with a truncheon is not the behaviour of hard case no-nonsense coppers. What has gender got to do with it? Size inequality doesn't mean that the larger person can't perceive a threat from a smaller person |
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