Liberal NDP coalition
 

The NDP have agreed to support the Liberals in confidence votes until 2025.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/tru...ther-1.6392756

The deal however requires the Liberals to support Pharmacare (universal prescription drugs coverage) and Dentalcare (universal dental care coverage), which to me seem like great things.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/tru...ment-1.6393021

These will be significant improvements to Canada's social programs and bring us more in line with the kind of public coverage in Western European countries. Combined with the 5 paid sick days in BC as well as affordable childcare program in BC, we're seeing real improvement here compared to how brutal it used to be.

There is also a small gesture towards more affordable housing.
This is more disappointing as non-market housing can't solve our out of control housing prices, I would like to see more emphasis on housing supply. Right now the conservatives still have a better plan there.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

I will believe it when I see it (pharamacare etc.) Trudeau is only interested in what he wants... I suspect the NDP will end up like the Liberal Democrats at the end of this.

It is beyond pathetic that the conservative party can't scrape together a front bench and leader of even moderate quality to confront such a narcissistic, talentless, intellectually vapid, hypocritical little waster like Trudeau.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Given the Liberal-NDP coalition announced today, I am raising my expectations for inflation for the next few years. I think that 5% to 9% is realistic over the next few years.

I also expect the quality of dental care to degrade.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Not for the poor. they got none now.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

why?

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Because this happens to all government run services. Demand grows, resources are limited, this leads to inflation, government tries to control costs so inflation shows in deteriorating quality, longer waiting lists, etc.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Good summary of my thoughts on Trudeau. It all seems so desperate from both parties involved.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

They were exactly my first thoughts Trudeau is so desperate to hang on to what power he has for now, and NDP know they never will, so it just comes as across as a "nothing to lose" move by Trudeau, and indeed by ol' Jagmeet.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

I don't see that as the problem with it. I think governments need a robust opposition to keep them honest. If the NDP is rolled into the government, there's no one to keep the Liberals in check. Countries need, at least, two credible political parties.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Oooh, that NHS, ruin the country that will.

Is the government planning a Ministry of Tooth Management under which everyone's gob will be administered by civil servants who alternate stints as customs officers? I suppose they may be but I haven't seen that in the Guardian or heard it on the BBC.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

I would imagine the opposite.
The Lib Dems collaboration enabled Austerity and the bedroom tax and they suffered for the association.

If more affordable medical and dental costs result that might go down rather well...unless certain people start blaming "the feckless" for other ills and moaning about their tax dollars.

I'm surprised the NDP didn't want PR as part of the deal. But perhaps they did.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What does amuse me is people previously whingeing about an early election now complaining about there being a 3 year wait for the next one. :lol:

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

I have no problem with the idea of pharamacare etc. I just don't believe, on the evidence so far, that Trudeau has the capabilities to deliver it. He is more interested in making big announcements, or offering his "wisdom' on a given situation, but executing on it? I also suspect he has no real interest in it so there may be a watered down version appears or the planning will be "difficult" so it gets kicked into the long grass.

For the NDP, the reason they may end up like the LDs is that they will be tainted by any of Trudeau's shennanigans with no benefit to them. Imagine there is another blackface, for example... does Jagmeet have the stones to make good on his pledge to withdraw from the agreement? How do NDP voters, who intentionally voted for the NDP and not the Liberals, feel about them supporting the Liberals? I dunno, but I suspect it won't work out well for the NDP give that there is another so called progressive party waiting in the wings, namely the Greens.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

That's where I see the big difference.

Austerity and the bedroom tax should have been anathema to the Lib Dems but they actually voted for it. It had major repercussions for them

The NDP and Libs are not polar opposites like the UK Conservatives and the Lib Dems. I very much doubt that there is any policy at all, or any aspect of the budget, that the Liberals would want to bring in that the NDP would vehemently be opposed to let alone bring themselves to support it.

And that's not part of the agreement anyway. They can walk away if they feel their interests are not being served.

They also have no positions in government like the Lib Dems did with Cameron in the UK. If a minister makes a bad job of something, it will be a Liberal minister.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

I fail to see the upside for the NDP. If all goes well, the Liberals will get the credit and, if it doesn't they will be associated with the Liberals. That's not fair, but history shows that is what will happen.

I don't subscribe to left or right, religiously following one or the other. I want to see good policies. I don't care who proposes them. The next election may be a poisoned chalice for whoever wins, as cutbacks will be required and, if a new party has to impose them, they won't be thanked for it.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Resources limited by government underfunding? what a thought.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

I think this is true. It is quite evidently self serving despite the claims they are promoting "stability". I'm just hoping some good comes out of it.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Well don't we have the Rhino party and and in a recent provincial election we had a "None of the above' party candidate in our riding so I think that covers it. I put career politicians near the bottom of the credibility scrap heap.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Justin is so underwhelming.. All the right platitudes, making the grand gestures but not the kind of guy you imagine rolling up his sleeves and making sure the plans get implemented. I predicted in my family he would be a lot of hot air with little substance and I think I've been correct so far. I don't think he has a huge base, just a lot of people who vote liberal rather than PC or NDP and he doesn't strike me as the kind of guy who would attract people over from other parties due to his deep views and analysis.

His the 'budget will take care of itself' pronouncement was rather telling.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

To be fair what he meant was if you stimulate the economy and growth with investment like more infrastructure then the tax base grows and a deficit budget becomes worthwhile in the long run.

That being said the rollout of infrastructure over the past 7 years has been very slow going, and this is not all his fault with provinces and municipalities dragging their heels. I agree that he could have taken a more active roll and making sure projects got pushed through and approved instead of his more laissez-faire approach.

Also after seeing just how much debt he has sunk the country into, perhaps there are limits to that philosophy. On the other hand if he hadn't done that, thousands of companies would have gone bankrupt during the pandemic from the government restrictions (such as what happened in the US).

But you're right a lot of people do just vote ABC (anything but conservative), which encourages complacency.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

It was his simplistic answers that got me riled up. Not sure how much cost benefit analysis is done into the benefit of the infrastructure spending programs on a case by case basis is done or if it is spent in marginal ridings they are trying to hold on to. Of course none of the other parties would do that if they were in power. It is so easy to get cynical about politics.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Never happens. That’s why British teeth are SO much better than Canadian. Brits are famous for perfect teeth. We need to reproduce their model.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

I'd never seen such awful teeth as I have here in Canada. Teeth worn down to the stumps, in a young person too, missing teeth, broken teeth. Many more people with dentures. I've a good idea on how many as when I was working when we x ray the neck and skull we have to ask people to remove false teeth, many more people do here, and at a young age.
British teeth might be more crooked and an unbleached yellow but they aren't any worse than Canadian.
Poor people here have little or no access to dental care. Children can sometimes get free care from the health unit, I know that ours has a mobile van that goes around the remote areas.
So put that trope to rest. Luminous white and straight teeth among the comfortably off does not equate to healthy teeth

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Must be the other Canada. And the other Britain.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

There is nothing untrue in what I've written.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Funny until I came to Canada, I had never heard the ongoing north American joke about Brits having messed up teeth, it took me a while to catch on. I think its the luminous white teeth effect... no one does that in the UK. North America does seem obsessed with the luminous white teeth thing though!

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

It's a status symbol because so few people can afford dental care. The idea of everyone having dental care frightens conservatives as it goes against their mantra "it's not enough to win, others must suffer".

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Its cruel to talk about teeth in the presence of a Brit. Can’t believe a Canadian would do it. They are too nice.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

I have pumped a great deal of money into having childrens' teeth straightened and formatted at various dentists. The continuing claim was that they would end up with "American Teeth". I took that then to mean aspirational teeth, like the those of the Osmond family, but now I realize the dentists were differentiating; good teeth like Americans, not teeth like Canadians.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

As I said earlier, without anyone holding positions of power (like the LibDems had in the UK) it's hard to see how the NDP could be tainted.

As for the Liberals taking all the credit and not the NDP, I wonder if perhaps they might simply be happy that people have gained something from it and improving people's lives rather than political posturing might be a suitable aim.

Okay, you can stop laughing now. :lol:

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

That is what politics is supposed to be about, isn't it? You support policies you agree with and oppose policies you don't. Rejecting them simply because another party proposed them is, IMVHO, stupid.

Good ideas should be supported and bad ideas shouldn't.

What the NDP appear to be saying is simply that, isn't it?

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Absolutely. But that makes your comment that you fail to see the upside for the NDP puzzling.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Not really. I fail to see the reason for the big announcement as, essentially, all the NDP have agreed to do is what all politicians ought to do.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Not enough has been made of this comment in this thread. The biggest problem with Canadian politics right now isn't the Liberals or the NDP, nor even the Bloc, but the complete disarray of the Conservative party. Harper at least had the force of personality to (more or less) steer all the wheels in the same direction, but under Scheer and then what's-his-name the nonentity (oh yes, O'Toole - I genuinely had to work to recall his name...), they've completely fallen off. The more noise the socially conservative right wing folks make, the more difficult it will be for the party to be even remotely appealing to a majority (sorry, a plurality)of the general electorate. With Bergen in interim "control" trying to stem the more ludicrous excesses, and with the likes of Poillievre making the running in the leadership election, there's little prospect of any meaningful opposition to Trudeau, let alone a potential party of government, any time soon. Trumpist populism has had its day (excepting Mr Kenney and his Cnut-like attempts to hold back the tide of sentiment in Alberta, of course...).

Trudeau has not done much for Canada since taking office - for sure, he's not had the easiest brief, with having had to deal with the US under Trump and then dealing with all the pandemic crap, but there's not much he's done that leaves Canada in a better position domestically or internationally than it was in in 2015. But he will be allowed to continue in his mediocrity if the Cons can't produce a charismatic and electable leadership candidate with the political nous to realize playing to a diminishing base will not get them to government.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Keep an eye on that Pierre Poilievre fellow, he's probably the biggest chance the conservatives have of winning if he becomes the party leader. He is the only politician talking passionately about the housing crisis, which is probably the number one affordability issue in Canada right now, particularly for young people. The Liberals and NDP have completely dropped the ball on this issue.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

I don't think this single issue is enough to overcome his abhorrent views on everything else nor his unpleasant persona. He also has an issue with the clash between his accent and his far right constituency. He's not black, he's not Jewish, but he does sound French and that's getting on for being as bad.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

By the time of the next election, if Trudeau doesn't try again what he tried last year, he will be approaching the time that the electorate generally tire of the incumbent, no matter how well they are doing. As a result of this, I don't actually believe the any party's policy will sway anyone, it will simply be the fact that the incumbent needs to be punted, particularly if, by then, he can't point to anything of merit that he has actually achieved in the almost decade that he would have been in office.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Raising your expectation? It's already beyond 5-9% lol

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

What about those of us who were tired of him even before he became PM and could see he was weak on substance?

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

They were unlikely to have voted for him under any circumstances. I can't think of anything that he has done that anyone would agree was a good thing. One could argue that his changes around the Canada Child Benefit were good but he did so without having any plan to pay for it so the deficit simply rose.

His environmental plans have fallen flat on their face which is why he appears to be panicking somewhat now.

Re: Liberal NDP coalition
 

Isn't that standard liberal procedure though.:( in addition to him having no substance.