It was a reference to an earlier post on this thread where a field of unmarked graves was later on ploughed and planted with potatoes. I'm aware that as nomadic tribal people, the FN were not farmers. Hunter-gatherers ! I suppose some high status ancestors might be venerated by taking the mummified corpse out (of a cave), but it seems implausible that the practice would pertain to whole tribes (that was my point). I think some of Tibertan aboriginals leave there elder corpses out for the vultures to feed on, and that has some positive spirtual reasoning behind it.

That's interesting. I've never heard about that.

But one of the things to remember about BC FN is that they never signed any treaties. They relied on some promises made by Indian agents back in the late 19th and early 20th centuries, and trusted that they would be kept. After all, the agents said they represented Queen Victoria, and the FN believed she would not lie.

We know what happened!!

Also the Provincial government back then did not recognize Indigenous title or rights.

As a result something like 95% of BC is on unceded land. Vancouver itself is on the traditional territories of three Local First Nations: the Musqueam, Squamish, and Tsleil-Waututh

But this is why all the big fights here, because every nation is now fighting to get at least some of its ancestral lands back under their control, or get other land or, if not, money in recompense

Now obviously, they're not going to through every incomer off the "territorial" lands, but they are demanding recompense in some form or other.

But it is also complicated because there are so many nations in BC, and their ancestral lands overlapped in many cases

There are in fact almost 200 FN groups in BC, each with its own language and customs.

ON has the next largest number, with about 125/126

There are well over 600 recognized FN groups or bands across Canada, each with their own language and customs.

Then you have the Dene, the Inuit, the Metis.

It would be a life time study to understand everything, even at a superficial level.

Ah ..........

I would assume that would have been an incoming newbie settler who did that, and probably thought nothing of all the bones that were coming to the surface.

What kind of promises did the BC Indian agents make in 19th/20th century ?

I suppose it might to those of us used to thinking in terms of hierarchy, however there are several if not many peoples and cultures whose rituals applied to each and every one of them. A collective thinking.


Yes. New Zealand & The Crown has the Treaty of Waitangi which remains very much in play today.

Shard. You asked upthread if NZ had the same institutions for Maori children as Canada instigated for FN children. Yes. It also had the dreaded mission schools.

Y'know . I always honestly thought you had lived , emigrated or spent time in Canada Shard. Is that not the case then?

One would suppose the same type of pledges that was made to the NZ Maori and the like. Protection from other usurpers, trade, sharing, respect. That sort of thing & which was subsequently not so .

I can't remember in detail, but along the lines of "if you allow the white men to come and cut the trees down, and mine for gold or coal or whatever, you will be well treated."

Of course they weren't, they were in fact driven off their ancestral lands, forced in small reserves, and made dependent on the state for everything.

Yes have lived in Canada. Alberta, BC, Quebec and NS !

I thought Scilly might have some specific idea on the promises an she seems knowledgable on FN matters. I didn't pay much attention to FN issues in the past, but am slowly starting to learn about them. Actually I didn't even know about the residential schools until about 15 years ago when I saw an photograph in a museum.

Yes, New Zealand is I think the only country where the aboriginal people actually signed a treaty with the incoming British.

I think they have done better than those here, or in Australia, but were still not treated well.

I did once know what kinds of things they promised, but I don't want to quote the wrong things, and it's running late for me to have time to google.

Try googling and see what you get.

And I bet the children all looked really happy and glad to be there. I've seen loads of those, including in a museum in a former residential school in Phoenix, Arizona.

The usual photograph that was taken and handed to the higher authorities.

Look closer at such pictures, and into the eyes of the children.


To be honest, this computer is in a south facing room, the temperatures here are still high , 25-27C ........... prior to last week, I think we would probably have said we were having a heat wave

The fan is blowing on my back, but I'm getting too hot, and will have to move to the north-facing rooms.

so forgive me if I leave!

No worries. No need to google anything on my account, I was just curious. It probably was trade agreements of the nature that you and BEVS have alluded to. Wasn't much else happening back then.

This is a good article; Gordon's Reserve (George Gordon First Nation) at Punnichy is getting ready to search for the graves from their residential school. Unlike some places where they know exactly where to look, on Gordon's they'll be doing detective work from the start by interviewing former students. When similarities in recollections of location and descriptions begin to match they know where to start looking.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saska...2021-1.6085925

There's an entire career in that, or rather many such careers available, within the BC civil service, even today. A high-school chum (white, who grew up in a different province knowing nothing of the history), stumbled into that contractual minefield, and that career, from the government side, when she moved to BC.

The short answer to your question is that there is no short answer to your question. "BC Indian agents" made multiple, overlapping promises to various indigenous tribal representatives, some better documented than others. In turn, competing indigenous tribal representatives have overlapped claims between themselves (at one point, something like 250% of BC's land area was in dispute, in terms of which tribal representative was the legitimate one, and therefore the titular counterparty for original treaty purposes.).

Veeerrry slowly, these historic obligations have started to be unpicked, though many remain in dispute, to at least some degree.

But many others are long settled with a particular indigenous government. When I traveled (with an introduction from my mate) within the boundaries of one particular indigenous village, as I did many years ago, it was to a pretty idyllic place, by anyone's standards. There was a old-growth tree-lined lake where all the houses were located, looking like cottage country anywhere in Canada, a similar tree-lined stream feeding the lake, and then 10-year-old clear-cut regrowth beyond most of that. Overall no different from any other timber-industry town in the wider area, except there was no sign of any retail establishment: no grocer, no gas station, no restaurant.

Thanks for the explanation. I suppose the sliver lining in the cloud of tragic discoveries this year is that government at all levels will hasten their efforts to resolve disputed claims with the FN. The country does need to find a way to move forward cohesively.

There's no silver lining. And no, there'll be no rush by the government resolve disputed claims.