"Ground Zero" Mosque. Should they or shouldn't they?
Aug 16th 2010 | 1:01 pm
#91
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,139
Re: "Ground Zero" Mosque. Should they or shouldn't they?
Well, I think Obamas point was that religious tolerance applies as much to Muslims as Christians wasnt it? Squarely aimed at the domestic market, even if its not likely to win him any new admirers (or voters) on the right.
As the west is finding out again in Afghanistan, you cant quickly change hundreds of years of cultural baggage. But just because Saudi Arabia has a long history of (what to me appears to be) appalling behaviour to women (and other non male /heterosexual/ arab groups), doesnt mean we shouldnt endeavour to try and change things, directly or indirectly for the better. But thats really material for politics and diplomacy, rather than the fox news call in.
Ultimately people believe in "stuff". If enough of them believe in the same stuff then the temptation is there to try and encourage other people to believe in it too.
Sometimes the stuff in question is Christian faith, sometimes its Islam, sometimes its non secular beliefs like womens rights or freedom of religion for all. If you believe in it, then you have to keep trying I guess, win, loose or draw.
As the west is finding out again in Afghanistan, you cant quickly change hundreds of years of cultural baggage. But just because Saudi Arabia has a long history of (what to me appears to be) appalling behaviour to women (and other non male /heterosexual/ arab groups), doesnt mean we shouldnt endeavour to try and change things, directly or indirectly for the better. But thats really material for politics and diplomacy, rather than the fox news call in.
Ultimately people believe in "stuff". If enough of them believe in the same stuff then the temptation is there to try and encourage other people to believe in it too.
Sometimes the stuff in question is Christian faith, sometimes its Islam, sometimes its non secular beliefs like womens rights or freedom of religion for all. If you believe in it, then you have to keep trying I guess, win, loose or draw.
Aug 16th 2010 | 9:49 pm
#92
Thread Starter
Beep
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 8,311
From: Here
Re: "Ground Zero" Mosque. Should they or shouldn't they?
Ajax's comment "Maybe we'll get to waste a few heads along the way" does seem very bible-esque
Aug 16th 2010 | 9:55 pm
#94
Thread Starter
Beep
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 8,311
From: Here
Re: "Ground Zero" Mosque. Should they or shouldn't they?
Ultimately people believe in "stuff". If enough of them believe in the same stuff then the temptation is there to try and encourage other people to believe in it too.
Sometimes the stuff in question is Christian faith, sometimes its Islam, sometimes its non secular beliefs like womens rights or freedom of religion for all. If you believe in it, then you have to keep trying I guess, win, loose or draw.
Sometimes the stuff in question is Christian faith, sometimes its Islam, sometimes its non secular beliefs like womens rights or freedom of religion for all. If you believe in it, then you have to keep trying I guess, win, loose or draw.
Maybe it's God's punishment for allowing the muslims faith to be used for recent misdemeanour's
Aug 17th 2010 | 3:23 pm
#95
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 308
From: Calgary
Re: "Ground Zero" Mosque. Should they or shouldn't they?
I don't think there should be a Mosque near Ground Zero - it's like rubbuing NY's face in it (not to mention the families of those who were killed.)
It should be left as a space, maybe a small park could be placed there, with places for quiet reflection for all people who want to spend a minute or two remembering the terror that was there and the families of those who suffered as a result.
Aug 17th 2010 | 4:17 pm
#96
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 334
From: "Teh Westurn Zone D'oh Quebec"
Re: "Ground Zero" Mosque. Should they or shouldn't they?
It'd be nice if 'bama' would break the ice - bit like Reagan did in the 80's 
. Everyone could have a real chortle.
"My fellow Americans, I'm pleased to tell you today that I've signed legislation that will outlaw Islam forever. We begin bombing in five minutes."
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...bingRussia.ogg
. Everyone could have a real chortle."My fellow Americans, I'm pleased to tell you today that I've signed legislation that will outlaw Islam forever. We begin bombing in five minutes."
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...bingRussia.ogg
Aug 17th 2010 | 10:55 pm
#97
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,471
From: Near the Northern Lights
Re: "Ground Zero" Mosque. Should they or shouldn't they?
Well yeah why not. If you think theres enough Christians living in or around those sites and if you think they want to keep their religion alive and will use the churches on a regular basis then I do support your idea of building churches in those places.
Aug 18th 2010 | 12:43 am
#99
Thread Starter
Beep
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 8,311
From: Here
Re: "Ground Zero" Mosque. Should they or shouldn't they?
Although the number was much higher but a huge amount fled through fear.
I think all religion should be banned, and only spirituality be allowed
Aug 18th 2010 | 12:49 am
#100
Mostly Harmless
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 15,111
From: Semi-rural wonderworld, Brisbane
Re: "Ground Zero" Mosque. Should they or shouldn't they?
Is Obama right to allow "freedom" to surpass emotional reactions, considering the fresh history of the site?
Is the risk of backlash, outrage, and potential violence on the structure and users worth it?
Does anybody outside of the US really give a shit?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-10973459
Is the risk of backlash, outrage, and potential violence on the structure and users worth it?
Does anybody outside of the US really give a shit?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-10973459
Aug 18th 2010 | 12:50 am
#101
Just Joined
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3
Re: "Ground Zero" Mosque. Should they or shouldn't they?
I would rather my first post would have been about lighter subject matter, but this is something I feel very strongly about. However, it's said far more succinctly and extensively than anything I could hope to express here:
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2010/06/pa...surprised.html
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2010/06/pa...surprised.html
Aug 18th 2010 | 1:26 am
#102
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 13,402
From: South of Calgary
Re: "Ground Zero" Mosque. Should they or shouldn't they?
Damned good question. Perhaps they are mouth breathing republicans, rather than Christians. Its certainly not a forgiving "christain" attitude that I would expect from a "Christian". It all seems a bit more old testiment than that.
Thats the conundrum of US politics, the "Christian Right" is at times anything but Christian. They should stop and ask themselves that tired old cliche "What would Jesus do" more often, only they wouldnt like the answer!
Thats the conundrum of US politics, the "Christian Right" is at times anything but Christian. They should stop and ask themselves that tired old cliche "What would Jesus do" more often, only they wouldnt like the answer!
Aug 18th 2010 | 1:40 am
#103
Moderαtor Emeritus
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 30,771
From: Upstate South Carolina
Re: "Ground Zero" Mosque. Should they or shouldn't they?
Of course not, but it speaks to a type of stereotypical right wing "christian" republican loon, the kind that spits while talking and has a hard time understanding why more moderate people consider them to be a horrible hypocrite.
Aug 18th 2010 | 1:51 am
#104
Slob
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,345
From: Ottineau
Re: "Ground Zero" Mosque. Should they or shouldn't they?
Looking at the ever-correct wikipedia, it's suggested that there are as many Christians in Iraq as there are Muslims in New York.
Although the number was much higher but a huge amount fled through fear.
I think all religion should be banned, and only spirituality be allowed
Although the number was much higher but a huge amount fled through fear.
I think all religion should be banned, and only spirituality be allowed
