Tirytory

I've never come across UK streaming but was talking to a high school teacher in Ontario who says there are 3/4? streams that they choose for a child in the last year of Elementary school and that's the route chosen for them to take at high school. At least you can choose to work really hard at comprehensive and then go one to something else. I don't understand how you can pigeonhole a child as fit for only employment... Anyways I hope I'm wrong!

Shard

Well I'm no educational expert, but I constantly see stuff on MN referring to streaming. Hopefully one of the experts will be along soon to clarify. Good thread drift, BTW

R I C H

30 years or so ago, when I moved into high school, streaming was the norm within the local authority my school was located. My twin sister and I had a near identical academic record in middle school. She went into all the top streams in high school, I was placed in streams 2 bands lower. It appeared an arbitrary decision at the time. My mother (incidentally a teacher) was disgusted. It meant I wasn't scheduled (or expected) to take any O levels. The school argued that classes were full and therefore no space to move me. It took 2 terms to resolve, by which time I was obviously that length of time behind the curriculum. I did fine and got to Uni, but it left a sour taste of the streaming process.

JamesM

When I was in high school they streamed for GCSE in certain subjects.

In Maths for example there were 3 tiers of exam paper. The only way you could achieve an A* was to be writing the top paper. The lowest paper was called foundation level and the highest grade that someone could achieve writing that was a C.

JonboyE

The problem is that providing publicly subsidized housing enables businesses like fast food chains to pay below a living wage. You are effectively transferring part of their labour costs to the taxpayer.

JamesM

Exactly and the extremely wealthy as we know don't pay all that much tax so the burden falls on the aspiring "middle".

Profits are privatised and losses are socialised.

mdizzle

In my high school there was streaming in Maths and English from second year (12/13 y/o). Other subjects did the same later on. It was quite flexible though and if you performed well you could be moved up, or down if you were struggling a little. People were also allowed to take the exams they wanted to. I thought it worked quite well as a system to be honest. It was also good fun taking the piss out of your mates if they got 'relegated'.

scrubbedexpat091

They did that at my High School in California, starting in grade 10 you went one of 2 directions. Either into college prep courses or into the basic minimum needed for graduation which was actually very low and hardly even prepared you for working let alone college at any point.

I got sent down the basic stream so University was never an option out of high school, and I did go into community college, but I found my academic skills were not on par for a college level and after 2 semesters was kicked out on academic grounds.

I am not sure if they still do this system or not, this was back in the early to late 90's (1993-1997) when I was there.

In the US university is only obtainable from high school if the student has good SAT/ACT and took college prep courses in high school, otherwise the only option to get into university is via the community college route which is fine, except the minimum taught in high school to graduate won't prepare a student for college level academics and most end up dropping out or being kicked out because they can't maintain the grades needed because they don't have the skills needed for college level work.

For me even here in Canada for just about every college program, I have to basically repeat high school which adds another 3-4 years on top of the program, and at the end of the day, I don't have the money to stay in school, and I am not sure starting a career in my mid 40's would ever get me to a higher income once 6-8 years of debt is included upon graduation.

On the college assessment, my math was below a grade 8 level (lowest the test was scored for) and my reading/writing and comprehension was at a grade 10 level.

Tirytory

Which brings around us very circularly to the argument about closing legal tax loopholes so that google and the likes can't evade the tax that they should owe...

tee1

They most certainly do stream in UK schools. Whilst good a idea in principal to teach students of similar ability together it can be extremely difficult to get out of that stream once your in it. Once your in a stream and pigeon holed, your often only taught to that level with low expectations. Even working your ass off can not necessarily get you into a higher stream.
I remember doing my GCSE'S years ago and being pissed in maths as due to my stream the school had decided that we all had to do the foundation math paper were the highest grade attainable is D and pointless, WTF!
My niece is 15 and streamed at school right now

Aviator

This thread went quiet for a while

Millions face years on the breadline: Britain has more long-term low-paid workers than ever - Home News - UK - The Independent

Shard

Yes, indeed. Was thinking of posting that yesterday but didn't want to bore everybody. There is a polarisation phenomena going on, and I don't think it's going away. Up-skilling is the oft-quoted politicians solution, but it is easier said than done for those at the bottom.

ExKiwilass

imo streaming is a form of class warfare. IT's amazing how people will fight for it. ultimately it's easier to just throw a whole bunch of kids under the bus than actually help them, cos then they'll just be more competition for the middle class, and we can't have that.

Shard

Not so much more competition as deadweight. Some element of streaming/setting seems to make sense as not every child (and particularly not every child's parents) have the same aspiration.

ExKiwilass

yup, that's generally the line streamers use.

it doesn't seem to occur to anyone that maybe those parents/children have a realistic sense of how hard it is to get those jobs over the generations. Or that maybe resources should be put to increasing aspiration.

it's a numbers game. there's only so many good jobs to go around, and lots of crap ones. if you can persuade a big part of the population they're crap, and that poverty thinking is a moral choice not a rational one, they're effectively eliminated from the pool and everyone in the higher income brackets feels good. and done.