Andrew Miller

http://www.canada.com/ottawacitizen/...e-b2aac6d84aa8

Pengy

Feel like forwarding that to Gordon Brown !

Ben W Bell

Something that needs saying, howing they seem to lump all immigrants in as not being able to speak English or French which isn't the case. The language isn't a barrier to all immigrants, and those who have English as a native language, or learnt from childhood and are fluent, seem (according to my anecdotal evidence) to do okay for themselves.

Andrew Miller

Article doesn't "lump all immigrants...." into anything. But you need to take into consideration the fact that only less than 12,000 immigrants in total originated from UK and France in 2006:

http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resourc...rmanent/16.asp

It is less than 5% of the total number of immigrants (over 250,000) admitted in 2006.

Other countries combined, with English or French as predominant language were source of much smaller number of immigrants admitted. Thus it is hard not to generalize if only 5% natively speak English or French.

And you are here long enough Ben to remember seeing number of posts in not so distant past from many immigrants from certain parts of the world calling system (or myself) racist every time the language proficiency issue is raised. Even now I expect to be called racist for using the phrase "certain countries"...

Tangram

Agree totally.

RayS

Am I being stupid or what? But if Canada's immigrant programs are to succeed then why dont they give priority to Anglophone & Francophone immigrants?

Judging by the desperate numbers of people on this forum alone, priority given to Brits, Ozzies, Kiwi's, French etc would go a long way to overcoming the problem.

And no I am not a racist folks (my wife of many years is from an ethnic minority but born here in the UK) but I am a realist when it comes to employment expectations and Canada's future financial needs.

Ray

Andrew Miller

The problem Ray is that any kind of discrimination based on country of origin, race, religion, etc. is illegal in Canada. Thus immigration law cannot set any preferences based on country of origin and immigration visas quotas are allocated among visa posts almost proportionally to the size of population under each post's jurisdiction. It results in over 60% of immigrants coming to Canada from just few Asian countries.

No politician will risk changing it in fear of being called racist. And our government is already called racist the moment Immigration Minister announced that language proficiency will be one of the main factors in new selection criteria.

Maybe this is why the recently published proposed Regulations for CEC (Canadian Experience Class) have already washed out language proficiency criteria - for example to be eligible for the program applicant must have completed 2 years of post-secondary education and 12 months of full time work in Canada in skilled occupation, but must only demonstrate moderate language skills. Why not ask for high proficiency after this?

Ben W Bell

Oh I do agree with you, and I know the points you're making. The thing is immigration ultimately has to be beneficial to Canada and Canadian companies, it's not really for the immigrant but the country.

bodgerx

Agreed.

The article mentions the cliche of immigrant Doctors et al driving taxis - but this time in the context of them having poor languages skills. Which is a solid caveat. Who wants a doctor that can't speak fluent English or French in Canada?

I would of thought most people on this forum (with it being British Expats and that) wouldn't have an issue with English, so its application here is not exact.

Ben W Bell

Ah but a doctor who can't speak fluent English would just remind us all of England would it not?

RayS

Hmm, ... well Andrew it is also illegal in the European Community to discriminate on race, religeon, sex, age etc but that doesn't stop us trying to control unwanted immigration from the 3rd world and keep it largely to those applicants with the necessary skills and some appropriate language skills. I think I'm right in saying that Australia, New Zealand, USA etc try to operate similar criterior when approving immigrants?
Nobody seems to consider that these countries are being overtly racist so why should Canada be any different?
As other people on this thread have intimated and I will say is that Canada should decide what it wants, what's best for its future and give two fingers to the rest of the world!
Ray

Andrew Miller

Totally agree. But if language proficiency requirements for skilled workers will be as washed out as they are now for CEC then I don't see much change happening with the numbers of immigrants by source country.

Especially when Liberals are ready to try to trigger election this Fall and use immigration (including calling current Conservative government racist and anti-immigration) as one of their platforms as they already announced.

Depending from polls Conservatives may stick to their guns (I hope) and establish at least moderate language proficiency as requirement for skilled workers or they may retreat and do nothing in this matter. Only time will tell.

And it is not about how potential immigrants or rest of the world will see Canada - it is all about how Canadian immigration program is painted by opposition parties (particularly by Liberals who use and abuse immigration for purely political gains for over 2 decades now) and how well it plays with certain groups of voters.

dbd33

Surely Steven Harper is unashamedly racist and anti-immigration, his background is in neo-conservatism. I don't think he'd see that as a criticism.

bodgerx

timu12

There's no single test to determine the exact English proficiency. I have been to Canada for almost 6 years but I duno whether I have only moderate proficiency beccause of my IELTS result. I read newspaper, I have many Canaidan friends and I complete my work very well. I think Canada should have lured many protential immigrants like me and many many other foreign students and skilled workers long long time ago. I think me and my fellow immigrants-to-be deserve receiving higher priority in terms of processing!