loy loy

Hi Suzie

I deleted my post before you replied as I realised it's nothing to do with me or my moral compass.

Good luck, like I said, we have been there, I know how awful it is. I really feel for you....and the next owner!!! :-)

SuzieB

Thanks loy loy! I did see after you had deleted your post. I opened the thread on here to get advice, ideas etc so you are entitled to comment. There is another thread by Karl/O? he and his family are also really struggling with neighbour probs. I have been in contact with him, mail private to share ideas.
Think also it serves as a warning for anyone buying property here. We will def be more careful next time!!
In fact just to say we thought we had resolved all the problems for the next buyer but no here we go again.
Thanks we need a miracle now

Peabrain

Hi,
It would seem that the only recourse left to you is to go to court. This means expense, and time, but would appear to be the only way of ridding yourselves of problems that are making your life, and that of your tenants, a misery. You may already have sought legal advice, but if not, it seems clear that you now have no choice, otherwise your investment in this property will be to all intents and purposes lost, and these bastards will have won. If you have proof of their behaviour, then you'll probably win, but only a lawyer can tell you for certain.
I can only wish you all the very best,
PB

SuzieB

Thanks Peabrain

We have and are seeking max advice. Also looking at maybe going to court, my partner took out legal insurance for the garden problem. They refused to pay as problem existed when we bought the flat and we took out insurance subsequently.
It does cover coproprieté issues so we may yet go down that road.
We are past caring about them winning, we want to sell + move on but are totally blocked at the mo.
Have almost 3 weeks to change things, so will keep on trying.

Nectarine

In the UK I owned a first floor flat and had downstairs neighbours who played music through the night. Talking failed, they thought I was being intolerant (trying to sleep from 10pm to 7am!). Couldn't afford a solicitor as I was first-time buyer with huge mortgage. In the end, someone pointed out to me that I had the upper hand, literally, as I was on the first floor. I didn't want war, but in my book if someone can't get words into their head then you have to take some action that they DO understand. So when they were asleep I'd put my boots on and do aerobics directly over their bed. Running up and down the stairs in my boots (for exercise sake, of course) while they were resting also was pretty noisy. I can't recommend this to you, of course, but after an exhausting month they were ready to talk (I was ready to drop) and we came to a compromise about when they could play their music. How this applies in your case is up to you, but they have to sleep, they have children. Unfair? Of course, but no less fair than what they are doing to you ...

SuzieB

Good for you Nectarine!

Our problems are not quite so simple. These people don't listen to reason or respond to revenge tactics, they just keep on + on causing new problems.
Our tenants a while back put their music speakers on the floor late at night to retaliate for the noise they were being subjected to early hours of the morning. This seemed to do the trick but then the scutty kids below started throwing stones through the open kitchen windows into the flat.
Our tenants have a baby of 9+ months so they are trying to avoid noise retaliation and protect their son.
If you read all of my thread you will see we + now our tenants have experienced I think all the problems possible, noise, hygiene, smoke, animal neglect, harassment, parking problems etc etc. The worst is the bank account situation we find ourselves possibly back in again.
Unfortunately my French partner has always been too diplomatic and done everything legally. Wish he had agreed to take them to court along time ago!

I must try and believe in Karma!!!

Nectarine

Suzie, while this is going on I'd suggest you keep a log and also try to record some of it with a camera. You never know when this might be needed but it will certainly validate your claim of their unreasonable behaviour. Good luck, they sound dreadful.

Chatter Static

I believe articles 226-1 to 226-9 of the Penal Code waffle on about a persons right to privacy in their home so recording the neighbours with a camera might not be such a good idea because if the neighbour magic up a better Avocat than the OP the OP could end up paying the neighbour compensation.

SuzieB

Hello again Nectarine

I have a file full of photos and correspondence re the problems. The DASS originally told me to do, that started in 2009/10? The tenants have also taken photos and are continuing to do so (their own initiative).

These neighbours are the pits!!! + the woman upstairs has lost it totally!

view from our kitchen window of their patio when we were trying to sell.

SuzieB

Good morning all

Just to change the subject a little, does anyone know if you can find a date for a court case? we are still waiting for the garden transfer to go to court.
Hoping it will be this month but no guarantee!

thanks

dmu

Go along to the Tribunal and ask at the "Greffe" (clerk of the court's office). I've no idea whether such info is public, but one of the greffières should be able to inform you if you prove that you are involved.

SuzieB

Thanks DMU

Unfortunately we live in Lyon and the case is to be heard in Belfort, 3.5 hours from us.
We'll just have to wait and be patient? will chase the avocat this week for news.

merci beaucoup

SuzieB

UPDATE! year 8 of struggles

Hello all, finally it has all got to me! have lost my spark and desire to stay in France in the future. I don't understand this country, little support, compromise, communication, civil laws but lots of bureaucracy + costs!
Nov 2014 the agency were voted out so now we have Mr Bowels sorry Bauer again as a dishonest, stubborn, scutty idiot as president of the syndic.
Is there no law to stop this happening? question I will be asking the avocat next time. My partner has always attended the meetings alone but I will be going to the next!
An AGM was notified by email on 30/12 for 4/1, no urgency stated. My partner asked for a later date, no reply til the date of the meeting at 3.15pm. He was considered absent and was then advised the agency hadn't paid the buildings insurance + other invoices. This is because the scutty family have paid nothing from 2011 to 2014!!!
I contacted the Insurance and the invoice for June 2014 not paid, so insurance cancelled in Sep 2014. Also I contacted the water co, 2 invoices for 2012 not paid + Dec 2014. Only the electric is ok as we received a credit.
We have sent 2 registered letters to Mr Scutty, no replies as always. Waiting for the legal insurance to give the ok to take to the administrateur justice via the avocat. Insurance co as everyone else a nightmare, 8 weeks + still waiting. My partner spoke to the director + his bank to force things.
Why is it always necessary to get angry here to get a decision + help?
No one ever calls back + are almost never available.
We have been told a week now for the ok, on verra!
Still waiting for the court case for the garden, the owner only appointed an avocat in Dec. They are continually stalling so meanwhile we have lost our buyers. The tenants have decided they have had enough there, so think they will leave this year. The scuttys have a dog who they leave barking incessantly.
No news from the procureur for our tenants complaints (+ our statement).
Again we can not sell due to the garden process + now the bank account.
Just not possible to get on with our lives however hard we try.
Does anyone know the best way to contact the UK papers to tell our story? I would like to warn other Brits of these barriers in France.

trying to keep calm + carry on

cyrian

Hi Suzie,
Sorry to hear that your problems are still ongoing.
Your tale is a salutary lesson for other Brits who dream of moving to France and expect it to be the UK with sunshine; wine and cheese plus all the safeguards they normally expect.
Moving to another country is not like that - as many expats in Spain, for example, have found.
It is great when it works properly but anyone considering moving to France or elsewhere needs to research the move as much as possible before committing to the move.
I hope that you reach a satisfactory conclusion soon.

SuzieB

Thanks Cyrian! don't forget my partner is almost French (here since age of 3), so I expected more from him regards resolving these problems. I only moved to France due to his company closing the UK office. We had lived together in UK for almost 6 years and I hadn't had dreams of living in France.
Just to add, for me trop de liberté et pas assez de justice!