dbd33

People freeze to death on the street in Toronto most years. We had a run where there was a corpse on the office steps three weeks in a row. I assume that there are others who don't die but suffer frostbite though, I admit, I've never found any detached body parts.

ExKiwilass

snowshoveller

you would need to go to BC for severed limbs

robert_masters

Hi

Can see why most of the homeless end on Vancouver Island!

Couldn't believe how many I saw last time I went. Oh and Vancouver pushing trollies along finding scrap!

I must say didn't see this in Winnipeg or Niagara, only on the US side!

Anyway, everyone has different views of 'The Cold' and I wouldn't be put off. Surely things like your own social interests and what type of job you have to find satisfactory income is more important.

Look you learn to adapt, end off!

Angela

dbd33

There are some homeless people in Winnipeg:

http://www.uwinnipeg.ca/index/news-homeless-facts

it may be that you don't notice them because they're aboriginal. I would think that there are plenty in Niagara but it seems a rough place to me so I only go to the tourist sites.

Almost Canadian

In Calgary, when the temperature reaches a certain level below freezing, shelters are opened to ensure that this doesn't happen. I don't doubt for one minute that such a system ensures that everyone has a bed for the night but, in the 5 years that I have lived here, I have never heard of anyone freezing to death.

Ontario strikes me as somewhat strange regarding such issues: people having to have whip rounds to pay for medical fees, people freezing to death on the streets. I thought it was supposed to be the land of milk and honey and Alberta was supposed to be full of "I'm all right Jack" selfish types

iaink

Ontario also has warming centers, but just like in Calgary, many homeless people are subject to mental health issues, so they dont necessarily do what logic would dictate.

Id bet homeless people are dying in Calgary too Im afraid, and that people struggle with uncovered health care costs there too

dbd33

There are shelters here too and when there's a particularly cold night efforts are made to herd people into them. A significant proportion of homeless people won't go. The Salvation Army and an aboriginal organization, (Anishwabe?) take soup and sleeping bags to the hold outs but still most years some freeze to death.

I don't think I claimed it to be the land of milk and honey. I thought life for the poor in Ontario was brutal even before Mike Harris.

robert_masters

Nope not really! We went a fair distance around Niagara and Areas, didn't find it that rough! Like any area there will always be those areas to stay away from.

I guess you can spend a life time trying finding the perfect place to live. For us it's deciding on a Province, which ever is suited to our needs at the time. From there pick out a desirable area that's affordable and fairly commutable. That's why I think moving on the edge of the city is a better option, maybe 5 miles out max perhaps???

I do know people that live some distance from the city and they're limited, for some examples the weather, shopping or job choices. We have visited Canada a number of times now and seen Niagara, lots of areas in Alberta, lots of areas in Manitoba and Vancouver. For us we're down to Manitoba or Alberta, all depends mainly on the job. Firstly my husband will go alone to Winnipeg and the maybe next to Alberta but who knows next????????? Prob best keep ones options open.

Angela

Almost Canadian

I struggle with uncovered health care costs, I am sure that there are many others that do. I have never heard of anyone freezing to death on the streets of Calgary and, certainly, would deny that it happens so regularly that the workers in a particular building would witness it as regularly as DBD33 did.

I thought that this debate first came about on this thread by comparing the alleged temperatures of one part of the country with those alleged in another. It would appear, from what you have stated above, that the actual temperature has little to do with the likelihood of dying as a result of temperature but more to do with the propensity for people, who want to remain out in deathly temperatures against the advice of others, wanting to live in a particular region.

robert_masters

Hi

Yep, yep and yep I agree!

dbd33

I agree that the actual temperature isn't the determining factor, the government uses some index of temperature and wind chill to decide which nights are designated "round up" ones. The number of such nights per year will be greater in Winnipeg than Toronto so the chance of a homeless person freezing to death will be greater in Winnipeg. A person anticipating being poor would do well not to choose Winnipeg but then that person should choose Victoria or not go to Canada at all.

dbd33

http://edmonton.ctv.ca/servlet/an/lo...b=EdmontonHome

iaink

Two things occur to me; First, Colder is going to mean it takes less time to freeze to death for any given individual. Second,there are a lot more people, homeless or otherwise, in Toronto than Calgary( or Winnipeg).

So it doesnt really suprise me, given the population, that you may be more likely to see deaths in Toronto, there are just more candidates unfortunatley. But if you are on the streets of Calgary or Winnipeg you may be worse off than if your were, well, almost anywhere in the case of Winnipeg.


There is also a suspicion, but I might be way off the mark, that if you were a homeless person with a choice of location you would try and get to somewhere warmer, and/ or with more chance of finding a way to get by, but Toronto can be cold enough to kill too at times.

Sadly I suspect the media is not too interested in reporting the casualties in either Toronto or Calgary, and I also suspect that dbds experience is not entirely representative of the wider population.

dbd33

Of course it isn't. Most of the population lives in a suburb and has no reason to be downtown at night.