willmore

OMG - eddie how are you and the family and how is london?

fuschiagirl

Whether or not you havve a "full contribution record" you pension will, unfortunately, be frozen!

DAVIE_MAC

ERR No Stay awake and pay attention.

gryphea

Ann

It appears you have a work pension as well. In that case was your work pension not 'contracted out' meaning that you don't have the full contributions you think you do, or is it me who is totally muddled on this one?

Gryph

Pebblebeach

So whilst it seems to be generally agreed that it makes financal sense to make voluntary contributions to top up your contributions for time at home with kids or in part time jobs to 30 years if you won't claim until after 2010 if you are in the UK, how do you decide if it is worth it if you are going to Canada?

I had thought not to pay the top ups as they are unlikely to make much difference when I might claim with a basic pension with no increases in Canada. Having read this i think I'll get a pension forcast anyway and check it out a bit more. Thanks for the link and phone nos.

DAVIE_MAC

I think for me it would really just depend on how many years I had to make up.......15+ then prob no......5 maybe yes but will take advice first.

I have had a pension forecast and with being in forces at present we receive financial presentations when we are in our resettlement phase. When I attend mine I am going to ask more in depth questions on this to see if it actually makes sense to complete the 30 years as depending on when I leave I may only have 5 - 6 years to make up.

Now what I thought is this if my state pension is worth a pittance in the future I might just apply for the lump sum payment which you can get and use the dosh for something else...invest in Canadian pension / saving plan....pay off amount of the mortgage if still have one...or something else.

Every little helps as I said before even if it is a small amount it still helps pay off something or save it if you don't need it...it could help with holidays etc.

From certain feedback on this subject it seems that people who are not really bothered about it really don't need the money...I just think it's a shame if you have paid all those years then why not claim it...linked or not.

It could make a difference to low income families and parents of families joining them abroad when they retire.

"The £34 Billion in pensioners' money lying surplus in the National Insurance Fund, identified by the Government Actuary’s Department in January 2006, far exceeds the £400 million required to update the pensions of all contributors, wherever they live. The GAD forecasts the fund surplus will top £60.5 billion by 2011, almost 80 per cent of anticipated NI expenditure for that year”

startwin

Having just gone through this process I'd advise anyone to get the pension forecast (I think you can do it 4 years or so before age 60 to get accurate-ish(!) forecast. And once you've done your paperwork, give them a call and they will calculate how much you need to top up. I had very few working years in the UK, so I topped up to 10 years, and it increased my pittance - sorry, pension - threefold, and will pay me back in just over a year. Well worth it, I think. And believe me, when you get to pensionable age and start calculating your needs, every little helps and by god, if you've paid in for it, then you're entitled to it and no reason you should give it to the Brit government as a pressie. The frozen bit gets my goat but hopefully there will be equity in time.

morge

There have been some comments saying that we are not entitled to have the same increases as those in countries where the pensions are not frozen. I do not go along with that argument because I have yet to hear a good explanation as to what the "agreement" is with the countries where the paension is paid in full. What have other countries got to do with how the British government spend their money ? The Australians had an agreement which was apparently not honoured - so much for agreements. dbd33 wrote in saying it was not our money. OK, so where is our money then? Can we take back all of the payments that we made to invest in a pension in the country of our choice ? - no Sir. Davie_Mac mentioned the Actuary report and he is right. It is worth a read. The Canadian Alliance of British Pensioners is spearheading the action against the British government and the membership is increasing along with the pressure being put on the government.
Previously there was no effective way to organise the thousands of pensioners affected by the discriminatory policy of freezing pensions but now we have the Internet, we are able to be more organised. There are EDM's (Early Day Motions) 856, 1195 and 1203 that are relevant to frozen pensions going through at the moment which, given sufficient support by MP's, could change the policy.
We need more people to contact their previous MP and request that they sign these, or their present MP if still in the UK. Given suffient response, then the issue will be discussed which in the past has been a problem. The court case against the government failed because it was not a civil issue but a parliamentary one. The case before the European Court of Human Rights is a different matter and we are hopeful, and the indications are good, that this will rule in our favour. If you want any pension help, then why not join us and get your name on the list being brought before the ECHR. The squeeky wheel gets the grease and we intend to keep on making a noise until justice prevails. "Justice " is the name of our magazine which you would receive giving useful information about pensions. Did you know that you can get your full pension when you go on holiday to the UK ? Did you know that you can petition No 10 by e-mail ?
Here are some useful websites :

http://www.gad.gov.uk/Publications/docs/CM7021.pdf for the British government Actuary report

http://www.britishpensions.com/ for the Canadian Alliance of British Pensioners.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhZjDO24p0A a video example of the stupidity of the system

http://bpia.youle.info/ for British pensioners in Australia

http://edmi.parliament.uk/EDMi/EDMList.aspx for the EDM list.

http://www.upmystreet.com/commons/l/ for finding an MP.

http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/about e-petitions to No 10. enter "frozen pensions" in search.

Keep the pot boiling by making your voice heard one way or another.

fuschiagirl

Pensioners living in Canada, Australia etc are not "entitled" to the increases solely because it is the decision of the British Government NOT to pay them! It is nothing to do with the governments of the host countries! It is a typical twisted interpretation by the British Government of who is entitled to what in the UK - or should I say England as opposed to Scotland and Wales!

morge

Thank you skiboy 10 for your comment.
You are absolutely right. That was a point I was trying to make but did not explain myself very well I'm afraid.
In addition , I would like to quote the EDM1203 which shows why the uprating of pensions has been allowed to continue to some extent.

EDM 1203 OVERSEAS PENSIONERS22.03.2007
Bottomley, Peter
That this House asks the Social Security Advisory Committee to consider Statutory Instrument 2007 No. 775, the Social Security Benefits Up-rating Regulations 2007; calls on the Government to provide a remedy to the unjustified and unjustifiable discrimination against the 50 per cent. of overseas UK state pensioners in certain countries including Australia, Canada, South Africa and New Zealand; and requires the Government to present any future Instrument, Regulation or Order that purports to continue the application of disqualification in respect of inflation or other uprating of benefit as an independent Instrument, Regulation or Order instead of tucking it away in Clause 3 of a Regulation misleadlingly titled Uprating.

This shows how, should an MP be faced with a vote on this issue and not have read all of the small print, then he/she would vote for the uprating not realising that it included the freezing of over 500,000 pensioners living abroad.
Hence the EDM. You can see how important it is to get your MP to sign this and get the freezing issue into the open.

Beaverquest

am sure i read somewhere a suggestion to go back and live in UK for a spell just before your 60/65 birthday to claim the full pension , not what it was frozen at when you left the country - if you've paid enough in to start

any confirmation on this ?

morge

I think that you will find that if you already on a pension and return to the UK and are resident for 6 months, then your pension will be upgraded to the current UK level. If you are in the UK when you reach 60/65 then obviously there is no problem. As to the pre-pension situation, I am not sure but I am going to find out. Watch this space.

morge

OK. Further to my previous entry. If you are already abroad, then you will get the rate in force at the time you attain pensionable age (but the amout received will be a proportion depending on how many years you have contributed) . If you leave to a frozen country having reached pensionable age, then your pension will be frozen at the rate in force at the date of departure.
I hope that answers any queries.

Beaverquest

thanks for the info on that

i left uk aged 40 after about 17yrs working, so may be of benefit to take a spell back in uk prior to retirement to upgrade pension to yr 2031 levels
- whether it's worth it at that point is another matter

don't have an rsp out here as am a corporation and paid by dividends
(not deemed earned income by CRA -so need to work on a Plan B)

dbd33

Sorry I missed this earlier. You gave your money to the government of the day in the expectation that future governments would pay you some form of pension. The current government is willing to do that.