dbd33

It's no good, he's stuck his fingers in his ears so he can't see you.

geedee

Election - what does it mean ?



That depend were you flom.

Hai !!

Chi_Nook

I had a few minutes to spare while at work so I thought I would quickly post some information on the political leanings on our major party leaders in this election:

Stephen Harper Left of Barack Obama

Stéphane Dion Left of Tony Benn (or more correctly Anthony "Tony" Neil Wedgwood Benn)

Jack Layton (and Olivia Chow his wife) Left of Hugo Chávez

Gilles Duceppe Left of Fidel Castro

Elizabeth May Left of Stéphane Dion

For a nightmare scenario imagine Taliban Jack (Layton) and Chairman (Olivia) Chow jointly running Canada...I shudder to think about that one!!

dbd33

Now, now, Chi_Nook, you know you're telling porkies. Also, please note that Fidel Castro is dead, you need new disinformation now.

Chi_Nook

I shouldn't really respond to uninformed stupid comments from dbd33, but what the hell:

September 11 2008

JOHANNESBURG (AFP)

Fidel Castro, who turned 82 Wednesday, becomes the first non-African and the third ex-head of state to win the "Ubuntu" award, the National Heritage Council of South Africa said in a statement.

dbd33

Ah! So you do read my posts. Care to comment on the substantive ones? Specifically, #73?

I'll amend Castro being dead to being "widely thought dead". AFAIK the Ubuntu award doesn't require attendance and may be awarded posthumously.

dbd33

And while I have your rapt attention Chi_Nook, perhaps you could explain how Jack Layton's policies differ from those of his wife and how either of them is "Left of Hugo Chávez".

Chi_Nook

Your back on the ignore button...

JET747

It's amazing when you start a thread seeking honest and public opinion regarding immigration that it turns into something you can't recognise as an answer to what you were looking for.

Brilliant. People never lose their sense of humour

Keep it up

JET

Chi_Nook

Good points. I'll try and answer some of them for you.

On immigration, when the Liberals were in power from approximately 1993 to 2005 they favoured an open door policy for anyone who applied to immigrate to Canada. This resulted in a massive backlog of applicants and the wait time for a decision slowed to a crawl, as every applicant had to be considered in the order their application was received. In essence this meant that even if the person applying had absolutely no chance of qualifying to come to Canada, they still occupied a place in the queue and it slowed the whole system down, while their case was reviewed and dealt with by the immigration department.

After defeating the Liberals and forming a minority government in 2005, this year (2008) the Conservatives introduced changes to the immigration system that would allow skilled workers needed in Canada (Engineers, Welders, Carpenters, Nurses, Doctors etc) to be given priority processing above other less needed applicants and so as to reduce the time it took these people to emigrate into Canada, as they were desperately needed to sustain and build our economy.

The Liberals and NDP oppose these new rules and have stated that if they are elected they will revert to the old first come, first served immigration system again (albeit one that doesn't work).

The Green Shift plan (Carbon Tax plan) proposed by the Liberals is an attempt to primarily tax the oil producing areas of Canada (Alberta, Newfoundland, Saskatchewan and BC) and transfer this wealth into federal government social programs to be directed and administered from Ottawa and believed to be mostly for the benefit of the southern Ontario area (although the Liberals will deny this). This type of program was introduced once before in the 1980 (during the world oil shortage) by another Liberal, Pierre Trudeau and was called the "National Energy Program" (NEP); it was an unmitigated disaster for the Canadian economy, as it attempted to create a Canadian only price for oil in order to subsidise the southern Ontario manufacturing companies with cheap fuel. The international oil companies faced with substantial increases in taxation and price fixing of their product by the government simply stopped further exploration and also reduced the production of oil from Canada. There were other negative aspects of the NEP, including the creation of PetroCanada a government run oil company that was allowed and actively encouraged to nationalize oil company holdings in western Canada.

One further point Canada for the last few years has been dealing with the possibility of separation of the province of Quebec. This has largely occurred because successive mostly Liberal governments, have chosen to ignore the original spirit of the British North America Act (Canada's first constitution), which allowed for the devolution of powers to the regions and have attempted to direct centralized one size fits all political programs from Ottawa. This has enraged the people of Quebec (and the west) and encouraged Quebec to seek separation from the rest of Canada (ROC). The Conservatives wish to reverse this process and follow the original intent of the BNA. This Conservative position has undermined separatist political support in Quebec for the Bloc Québécois as more and more Quebeckers now see some positive things for Quebec if it remains within the Canadian Confederation,

Hope this helps to answer some of your questions.

dbd33

My, my, where to start. You know of course that Chi_Nook will not attempt to justify any of the positions he advances. He's writing from an extremist point of view and seems unwilling to acknowledge even that; Harper, for example, is more a breastless Palin than a white Obama.

Anyway:

Absurd polemic. Chi_Nook would have you believe that any party except the Conservatives would admit Osama bin Laden as an immigrant in he waited long enough. In fact, it's quite difficult to bring in an immigrant to Canada unless they are immediate family or you can offer them a job.


It's inevitably the case that applications from individuals must be processed in the order received and applicants can't be rejected until their application has been reviewed. However, even at the peak of the backlog, I had no trouble sponsoring a potential "employee" into Canada (quotes because legally he's an independent subcontractor). In fact, it's always been the case that, if you have a job and the employer is willing, you can be here quickly.

Not quite a defeat if they're a minority, surely?

This is an interesting idea but I think interventionist government policies are ineffective. Mr. Harper's bureaucrats don't know what skills are needed in Canada; the market knows. This policy will have Welders and Engineers driving taxis when what we need is actual skilled taxi drivers.

Blather.

First come, first served, with priority over others for people who have a job, not a governmental opinion that they can find a job but an actual job. I should have thought that an undeniably fair approach.

No. It's a tax on consumption. The assertion is only true if those provinces are the primary consumers of carbon fuels.

No, it's intended to be revenue neutral. Whether or not one believes in revenue neutrality there's no connection with social programs. In any event social programs are, by and large, administered provincially. What programs are thought of here?

I'd expcect you to deny it. I thought you accused the Liberals of pandering to Quebec.

In what way is the current plan comparable to the NEP? I can't even guess this one.

Surely the objective was to provide all Canadians with fuel at an equitable price rather than having cheap fuel in Alberta and expensive fuel elsewhere. It seems to me that the then Alberta government was rather mean spirited about it suggesting that people in the east "freeze in the dark" in order to maximum the provinical oil revenues.

Wouldn't the lack of viable oil deposits at the then current price have been a factor? Even now the oil sands are marginally profitable.

For the benefit of Canadians please note.

Dead horse now, innit?

A deft change of tune on the part of the Conservative party. Hasn't it always been the case that the tories thought Quebec loved Canada because the feds taxed the west and spent in Quebec? Now you argue that a federal policy of leaving Quebec to get on with life on its own would please that province, pull the other one!

I suggest that the people of Quebec are far from being enraged.

Again, dead horse, well flogged.

Canada has a constitution now. Resurrecting the BNA is something the United Empire Loyalists might crave but the rest of the country has moved on.

Please substantiate "more and more".

It seems to me Chi_Nook that given the variance in your writing style between this thread and the others on which you have posted, you are posting someone else's material here. If you are in fact cutting and pasting Conservative party literature I think you should acknowledge the fact for copyright reasons if no other.

Chi_Nook

Just a point of clarification on my previous message I omitted that Quebec has never agreed with or signed Canada's "new" constitution.

From Wikipedia:

In 1981, a round of negotiations led by Prime Minister Pierre Elliott Trudeau reached a patriation agreement that formed the basis of the Constitution Act of 1982. Although this agreement passed into law, augmenting the British North America Acts as the constitution of the land, it was reached over the objections of Quebec Premier René Lévesque, and the Quebec National Assembly refused to approve the amendment. However, the Supreme Court of Canada ruled in the Patriation Reference and the Quebec Veto Reference that neither Quebec nor any other province had a veto to prevent the federal government from petitioning the British Parliament to pass the Canada Act 1982, and that the new constitution applied to all provinces notwithstanding their disagreement.

Brian Mulroney defeated Trudeau's successor, John Turner, in the 1984 federal election and was determined to succeed where Trudeau had failed, by reaching an agreement that would allow Quebec to sanction the Constitution. Led by Mulroney, the federal and provincial governments signed the Meech Lake Accord in 1987. However, when the 1990 deadline for ratification was reached, two provincial legislatures, Manitoba and Newfoundland, had not ratified the agreement, and thus it was defeated. This defeat, in turn, led to a resurgence in the Quebec sovereignty movement.

Bottom line, to this day, Quebec has still not accepted or approved the "new" Canadian Constitution that the Liberal Government of Pierre Trudeau tried to impose on them in 1982.

dbd33

Ah, the "notwithstanding" clause. Isn't that the one Mr. Harper proposed using to illegalise gay marriage?

Oh and whilst writing I'd like to withdraw my description of Mr. Harper as being "breastless". His corpulent frame includes ample man boobs.

Chi_Nook

Oh yes, Brian Mulroney was the leader of the Progressive Conservative Party of Canada. The last Conservative government of Canada until Stephen Harper.

I'm now going to have nice dinner of wild salmon, asparagus and wild rice complimented with a nice glass of Châteauneuf-du-Pape.

Goodnight everyone.

geedee

Better get serious now as nobody liked my Japanese joke...


Elections (snigger) are a complete distraction to give us sheeple the impression that we have a say in our destiny. In fact, we don't. The tier above government, shielded from prying eyes, dictates world events for its own enrichment and consolidation of power.

Chi-Nook, you sounded a bit like Hannibal Lecter in your parting statement...