kiwi_child

Probably not unless I turned up at your place and we went to the local university so I could become some guinea pig. That's why people feel in a comfort zone with their assumptions. They are easy to cling on to and people don't have (or want) to have them proven right but oh how people kick up once they have been disproven!

At the end of the day they are opinons based on no actual evidence, rather circumstansial or incidental/accidental. eg, the guy on the harley with leathers, tattoos and a beard is a threat to me. What is it based on? A stereotype? What is a stereotype? nothing more than an assumption that is gleaned as somehow representing the truth.

Life as a mushroom is just so much easier

Sugo

What makes certain people not deserve the same rights as you, please explain what makes them less of a human being.

kiwi_child

Cheers Badgey Wadgey Nice of you to drop by

mingusdynasty

Well, I suppose if you have got a muslim migrating to say, England, or NZ, or Australia, what have they done historically to reap the benefits of that country?

Conversely, as a group what have they done to ensure said countries do not flourish?

And then, to top it all, what do they do once they get into said countries?

Whereas, my forefathers and myself have all been in the Army. I kind of think Im entitled to reap the rewards of freedom. The spoils of war if you like. The fact that my forefathers went thru 2 world wars means I see "johnny foreigner" coming over to said countries with a slighty jaundiced view.

Look, it's complicated, and my tiny brain can't work out all the complexities. You could argue we invaded them first, but then we were invaded by the saxons, romans etc. Basically, England was the bitch of Europe at one stage.

I don't think anybody is less human than me. No sirree! We are all swimming in shit at the end of the day.

Cheetah7

I thought about this one, my muslim husband has not contributed historically to the UK, he hasn't had the chance as he is too old for the Armed Forces here although has done it in his own country but please give him chance to contribute in other ways.

What has he done since he has arrived in the UK? He has worked his nuts off, to pay his way in life and has never claimed benefits.

He is in a managerial position and has to interview people for jobs and I am afraid to say that some of the 'English' applicants' he has interviewed or had experience in working with, have an attitude/belief that the world owes them a living and have little or no desire to do what it takes to succeed in the working enviroment.

That includes the ones that the job centres send for interviews where the applicants are more than happy to 'stay on the social' while my tax paying 'muslim' husband pays for them and their offspring plus their daily packet of fags.

So whilst he may not have served in the British National Forces, he has more than proven himself in our society.

Pablo

Trouble is, who gets to pick what is a 'human right' and what isn't?

Pablo

kiwi_child

Interesting and thought provoking question. Human rights as we know them today are probably relatively new (developed say over the last 50 years or so). However the concept has been around in some form for centuries. I think it's a sort of two steps forward, one step back kind of thing.

They tend to gain ground from contemporary issues that present as political/moral concerns and debated against societal values and traditions. The UN has a charter of human rights but this is basic in some ways and not guaranteed, even by signatory countries, eg: it lists the right to employment as one, but nowhere in the world is there true full employment I think.

Rights to housing, education and healthcare are also included, but again these are not guaranteed in any signatory country as far as I kniow. And even if they are in some countries, the standards may be poor or policies they are delivered by, slanted.

I think ideally all leaders of countries should take with them a list of desired rights as voiced by their citizens to the UN and these should be debated until consensus is reached. This would make them truly universal human rights. The matter should be reviewed every decade or so, so that it stays a living, fresh and vital force for social improvement

Countries that differ on certain rights would still adopt those they agreed to, and all countries should accomodate the expressed desire of their citizens in this regard. This would be a move away from representative democracy to a more pure version.

Representative democracy has long proven to be a dangerous tool in the hands of the wrong people. It needs some limitations and should provide much greater accountability..

Many human rights (or what should be upheld as human rights) are though self-evident IMO. Laws should not be made or enforced that clearly discriminate against persons within a society. Any such laws should be ammended or repealed. All persons within any society should be afforded the same rights, privileges and protections as all other persons residing within it.

NedKelly

I suppose when it comes down to it I would rather be treated by someone who was gay than someone from the religion of peace.

http://en.sevenload.com/videos/mIiC2...Jihadi-Doctors

NedKelly

What about the rights of the victims?

Pablo

Nothing here establishes 'human rights' an an objective, impartial standard. What you describe is no different from positive law mixed with traditions (and traditions are often reflected in positive law).

You would like to see certain laws applied to the population of the whole planet. That does not make those laws objectively true or right, merely universally applied by legislators.

What if the 'expressed desire of their citizens' were mistaken?

What is 'a more pure version' of democracy? Direct democracy? Does this somehow establish the objective nature of 'human rights'?

Who gets to decide who the 'wrong people' are?

If they're self-evident, why do they need to be legislated or imposed? If they're not self-evident to everyone, or if what is self-evident to you contradicts what is self-evident to someone else, who gets to decide?

Pablo

XenonII

That's so ghey!

Vim Fuego

I'll look it up and get back to you.

Hutch

Whatever happened to Kiwi_Child? Maybe she hooked up with Mr Backhomewhodoyouthinkyouarekiddingmrhitlerifyouthi nkoldenglandsdoneatlast ...

northernbird

Vim Fuego

Stupid Boy!