Originally Posted by Hebe (Post 10294986)

Help needed. Upped my iPhone this morning and now cannot connect to home wifi - any suggestions? Chhers

Originally Posted by fish.01 (Post 10298133)

Knowing the history of IT the notion that apple just copy is not historically accurate or a fair representation of the incredible innovation they have added to the industry compared to any other company.

Originally Posted by knockoff nige (Post 10298141)

I couldnt agree more. Apple tend to improve on existing technologies, making them work as opposed to rushing them to market.

Originally Posted by roaringmouse (Post 10298875)

http://youtube.com/watch?v=wFeC25BM9E0

Originally Posted by fish.01 (Post 10300073)

These things are great in silly Internet wars but we all know the incredible innovation that apple, Microsoft, google etc have bought to the industry. Pointing out that almost everything in IT is built on top of decades of other advances is just par for the course...no company could be classed as innovative if that was the only criteria.

I find the apple copies everything line just as simplistic as the apple invents everything line...we all know some of the Japanese/Korean companies would love to have the ability to innovate as well as apple (or google etc)...

Originally Posted by knockoff nige (Post 10300097)

They generally re-think things and deliver a product that works out of the box which is targeted at users who want to know how to use it without reading anything. Where others are cramming features into devices, Apple are designing more elegant and useful devices for a typical mans world.

Originally Posted by knockoff nige (Post 10300097)

If everything comes from the wheel, nobody invented anything since. Apple have enough patents to suggest they invented somethings. An ignorant man would argue otherwise.

Originally Posted by GarryP (Post 10300102)

=packagers

And elegant is a matter of opinion, sparse would be another word for it. When you don't do much, its easy to make it the only thing you can do.


Patent system is pretty obviously broken - most apple patents are both invalid (if you don't have a crap jury that don't even consider that aspect) and software, which in the EU aren't even allowed to be applied for.

They aren't even in the same ballpark as something like pixie dust.
http://searchstorage.techtarget.com/...ion/pixie-dust

Originally Posted by GarryP (Post 10300086)

Thing is, apple are known for doing less true innovation and more copying that others. Hell, the video was being overly generous, even the things they gave half a point to were not inventions of apple - the A5 was simply licence parts put together.

If you compare, Google have Pagerank, IBM have pixie dust, even Microsoft have Kinetic (not really an invention, but much closer than anything apple do).

Apple are packagers and marketers - not innovators. Since Woz left, that's all they do - Mac specifically included.

Originally Posted by knockoff nige (Post 10300112)

Yeah I guess it is a matter of opinion and the fact that the iPhone is currently the most popular smart phone available suggests that enough people think so to. But people with blinkers on will argue against that.

Originally Posted by knockoff nige (Post 10300112)

Yes, obviously the patent system is broken, it would be devastating to your argument if it wasn't.

Originally Posted by knockoff nige (Post 10300112)

Innovation isn't simply about creating a single standalone device. It's also about putting components together into a unique design which works. The iPhone 5 is very much innovation. The idea to make the phone longer, thinner and lighter without sacrificing battery life in itself is innovation.

Originally Posted by knockoff nige (Post 10300112)

Making it faster than any other phone and a much superior display on top is amazing design. But you can't see past your ignorance and call them packagers. That's quite immature actually.

Originally Posted by fish.01 (Post 10300118)

Personally I think the internet chatter characterization of them as just packagers and marketers is absurd. Sure they are great at both of those things and it has contributed greatly to their success...but ignoring all the genuine innovation just smacks of internet fanboi'ism rather than genuine reflection to me...

Originally Posted by GarryP (Post 10300124)

Android outsells Apple, by a wide margin.


Generally accepted by virtually everyone.


Nah, its called manufacturing process. Work done by others. Or maybe you think Android phones, which have been getting bigger, thinner and lighter are somehow precopying apple?


No, trying to claim black is white by virtue of your personal opinion, rather than fact, is immature. I've covered, quite often in detail, how and why the two design approaches differ, and how 'close to the metal' apple costs more in the end in the shape of built in design limitations. I've also covered how apple copies and packages; it doesn't innovate.

The really fun thing is we are moving into the end game. Apple have been trying to use the courts to gain commercial advantage, and in doing so have been making to big enemies with real patent portfolios. Eventually one of these, with basic patents on mobile comms, will get to the position where either apple stops trying to litigate out of their design hole, or are banned from selling iphones and ipads around the world. Live by the sword, die by the sword.

Originally Posted by knockoff nige (Post 10300112)

Yeah I guess it is a matter of opinion and the fact that the iPhone is currently the most popular smart phone available suggests that enough people think so to. But people with blinkers on will argue against that.
.