Carbon tax
Jul 15th 2011 | 10:34 pm
#243
Truth is the safest lie.
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 7,307
From: @ the beach.
Re: Carbon tax
Pointless to talk about party politics though.
Julia is trying to win over CEOs of big industry and Abbott is riding around with truck drivers. Something is going terribly wrong here from a traditional perspective
.
Julia is trying to win over CEOs of big industry and Abbott is riding around with truck drivers. Something is going terribly wrong here from a traditional perspective
.
Jul 16th 2011 | 3:05 am
#245
Banned
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 22,348
Re: Carbon tax
That wasn’t as funny because the *****ing man had memorized the tax codes (Obama that is) and so wasn’t as dumbstruck by the question.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=BRPbCSSXyp0
They should have an award for “Member of the public who asked a question that made an elected official feel least comfortableâ€. I’m inspired frankly
.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=BRPbCSSXyp0
They should have an award for “Member of the public who asked a question that made an elected official feel least comfortableâ€. I’m inspired frankly
.I previously didn't have a very high opinion of Obama but he's gone up in my estimation. He answered Joe Public's questions very well and didn't seem at all slimy and patronising.
But as for Gordon and Juliar...
Gordon's Bigotgate remarks cost him the election. Strange how recently he's blaming The Sun for his loss. Thank god we're shot of him!
Carbon tax and the false promises that preceded it will almost certainly cost the ALP the next election.
Jul 16th 2011 | 3:16 am
#246
Banned
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 22,348
Re: Carbon tax
I think it was because she needed the greenies on board. The carbon tax was the price they exacted from her and the Australian public. She needn't worry though, the taxpayers will give her a nice fat pension, with free flights, etc. when she is ousted at the next election.
What an incredibly insane gamble it is to be tinkering with Australia's economy right now.
Jul 16th 2011 | 3:53 am
#247
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 6,039
Re: Carbon tax
The award sounds like a great idea
I previously didn't have a very high opinion of Obama but he's gone up in my estimation. He answered Joe Public's questions very well and didn't seem at all slimy and patronising.
But as for Gordon and Juliar...
Gordon's Bigotgate remarks cost him the election. Strange how recently he's blaming The Sun for his loss. Thank god we're shot of him!
Carbon tax and the false promises that preceded it will almost certainly cost the ALP the next election.
I previously didn't have a very high opinion of Obama but he's gone up in my estimation. He answered Joe Public's questions very well and didn't seem at all slimy and patronising.
But as for Gordon and Juliar...
Gordon's Bigotgate remarks cost him the election. Strange how recently he's blaming The Sun for his loss. Thank god we're shot of him!
Carbon tax and the false promises that preceded it will almost certainly cost the ALP the next election.
- Abbott's direct action climate plan which is old hat and already proven not to work under Howard. The results have already been studied from past attempts and it is an utter failure. It is according to the experts very wasteful of taxpayer money.
- Abbott's do little broadband plan which is a mish mash of wireless funding and tinkering based on the false presumption that wireless can be the backbone of our broadband network. Abbott is self confessed technology illiterate.
- Abbott and Hockey's running our finances which Abbott has self confessed low interest in and Hockey has low experience in - and frankly does not appear up to the job.
- Abbott tinkering with our morality based on his ultra conservative quasi religious political stance while strengthening the influence of large corrupt american style pentecostal churches like Hillsong.
- Abbott dog whistling on asylum seekers.
- Abbott's low interest in policy areas that require him to reform and build.
I think he is all ideology and little substance - his ability to threaten to stop and/or destroy everything seems to be all he has to offer. I despair if too many Australians fall for his cheap political tricks.
Julia Gillard is by no means perfect but she is at least centrist and attempting difficult reforms under trying circumstances. Far better for our country than Abbott in my opinion. Can the Liberal Party please allow their talented people to shine and sideline the more extreme men and women who currently have control. Then we might have a genuine choice.
Last edited by fish.01; Jul 16th 2011 at 3:55 am.
Jul 16th 2011 | 4:19 am
#248
Banned
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 22,348
Re: Carbon tax
Lets hope your wrong as that would be a disaster for the country. We would get:
- Abbott's direct action climate plan which is old hat and already proven not to work under Howard. The results have already been studied from past attempts and it is an utter failure. It is according to the experts very wasteful of taxpayer money.
- Abbott's do little broadband plan which is a mish mash of wireless funding and tinkering based on the false presumption that wireless can be the backbone of our broadband network. Abbott is self confessed technology illiterate.
- Abbott and Hockey's running our finances which Abbott has self confessed low interest in and Hockey has low experience in - and frankly does not appear up to the job.
- Abbott tinkering with our morality based on his ultra conservative quasi religious political stance while strengthening the influence of large corrupt american style pentecostal churches like Hillsong.
- Abbott dog whistling on asylum seekers.
- Abbott's low interest in policy areas that require him to reform and build.
I think he is all ideology and little substance - his ability to threaten to stop and/or destroy everything seems to be all he has to offer. I despair if too many Australians fall for his cheap political tricks.
Julia Gillard is by no means perfect but she is at least centrist and attempting difficult reforms under trying circumstances. Far better for our country than Abbott in my opinion. Can the Liberal Party please allow their talented people to shine and sideline the more extreme men and women who currently have control. Then we might have a genuine choice.
- Abbott's direct action climate plan which is old hat and already proven not to work under Howard. The results have already been studied from past attempts and it is an utter failure. It is according to the experts very wasteful of taxpayer money.
- Abbott's do little broadband plan which is a mish mash of wireless funding and tinkering based on the false presumption that wireless can be the backbone of our broadband network. Abbott is self confessed technology illiterate.
- Abbott and Hockey's running our finances which Abbott has self confessed low interest in and Hockey has low experience in - and frankly does not appear up to the job.
- Abbott tinkering with our morality based on his ultra conservative quasi religious political stance while strengthening the influence of large corrupt american style pentecostal churches like Hillsong.
- Abbott dog whistling on asylum seekers.
- Abbott's low interest in policy areas that require him to reform and build.
I think he is all ideology and little substance - his ability to threaten to stop and/or destroy everything seems to be all he has to offer. I despair if too many Australians fall for his cheap political tricks.
Julia Gillard is by no means perfect but she is at least centrist and attempting difficult reforms under trying circumstances. Far better for our country than Abbott in my opinion. Can the Liberal Party please allow their talented people to shine and sideline the more extreme men and women who currently have control. Then we might have a genuine choice.
A rich country like this could work wonders under good leadership.
Jul 16th 2011 | 5:01 am
#249
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 691
Re: Carbon tax
Lets hope your wrong as that would be a disaster for the country. We would get:
- Abbott's direct action climate plan which is old hat and already proven not to work under Howard. The results have already been studied from past attempts and it is an utter failure. It is according to the experts very wasteful of taxpayer money.
- Abbott's do little broadband plan which is a mish mash of wireless funding and tinkering based on the false presumption that wireless can be the backbone of our broadband network. Abbott is self confessed technology illiterate.
- Abbott and Hockey's running our finances which Abbott has self confessed low interest in and Hockey has low experience in - and frankly does not appear up to the job.
- Abbott tinkering with our morality based on his ultra conservative quasi religious political stance while strengthening the influence of large corrupt american style pentecostal churches like Hillsong.
- Abbott dog whistling on asylum seekers.
- Abbott's low interest in policy areas that require him to reform and build.
I think he is all ideology and little substance - his ability to threaten to stop and/or destroy everything seems to be all he has to offer. I despair if too many Australians fall for his cheap political tricks.
Julia Gillard is by no means perfect but she is at least centrist and attempting difficult reforms under trying circumstances. Far better for our country than Abbott in my opinion. Can the Liberal Party please allow their talented people to shine and sideline the more extreme men and women who currently have control. Then we might have a genuine choice.
- Abbott's direct action climate plan which is old hat and already proven not to work under Howard. The results have already been studied from past attempts and it is an utter failure. It is according to the experts very wasteful of taxpayer money.
- Abbott's do little broadband plan which is a mish mash of wireless funding and tinkering based on the false presumption that wireless can be the backbone of our broadband network. Abbott is self confessed technology illiterate.
- Abbott and Hockey's running our finances which Abbott has self confessed low interest in and Hockey has low experience in - and frankly does not appear up to the job.
- Abbott tinkering with our morality based on his ultra conservative quasi religious political stance while strengthening the influence of large corrupt american style pentecostal churches like Hillsong.
- Abbott dog whistling on asylum seekers.
- Abbott's low interest in policy areas that require him to reform and build.
I think he is all ideology and little substance - his ability to threaten to stop and/or destroy everything seems to be all he has to offer. I despair if too many Australians fall for his cheap political tricks.
Julia Gillard is by no means perfect but she is at least centrist and attempting difficult reforms under trying circumstances. Far better for our country than Abbott in my opinion. Can the Liberal Party please allow their talented people to shine and sideline the more extreme men and women who currently have control. Then we might have a genuine choice.
Julia is NOT centrist and is in fact VERY left. She belongs to the LEFT faction of a LEFTIST party and was a member of the Fabian society (look it up - socialism!!) for twenty years.
She was soooooo desperate to maintain the Prime Ministership she agreed to pretty much whatever the Greens (an extremist party) wanted. She should have stayed firm and not agreed to implement a carbon tax in this term, but instead formulate a package to take to the next election. The Greens would NEVER form an alliance with the Libs, so she was in the box seat.
Now we are being lumbered with a useless tax that will disadvantage our economy at a most inopportune time.
The Greens and the ALP actually think Australia is going to be at the forefront of renewable energy technology... what a joke!!!! They are delusional; they seem to really believe this tax is going to save the planet. Insanity has completely prevailed. NO OTHER country has a scheme anything like this and seriously if its the solution to a problem WHY is no other country going down the same insane road????? Surely us Brits or the USA would be racing to implement such a brilliant scheme????
Jul 16th 2011 | 5:06 am
#250
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 691
Re: Carbon tax
But this is the only angle the Coalition have. The only way they feel they can defeat it is by attacking the man (or woman in this case) and branding her as a liar. They know that as soon as the debate goes onto the Tax Plan itself they will lose. There are too many economists saying this is the way to go to counter anything the Coalition have when it comes to the economy armageddon ("this will kill out economy"). There are also too many people within the Coalition who agree with the concept itself to make them a united front. There is a working model in Europe that has been functioning for 6 years where the vast majority of people have not noticed any adverse side effects to show that there is a lot more than hypotheses at work here.
The only real arguments the Coalition keep coming up with are:
- MMCC is not real
- We can't make difference by ourselves, so what's the point?
Neither are particularly promising prospects.
I am one of Gillard's middle-class income households that does not get fully compensated. How on earth they work out that we are "wealthy" is beyond me, however for the sake of the future of this planet and my kids I am willing to pay the extra $10 a week or more over time without subsidy if it means that on the off-chance that these mad Gallileoesc scientists are right.
The only real arguments the Coalition keep coming up with are:
- MMCC is not real
- We can't make difference by ourselves, so what's the point?
Neither are particularly promising prospects.
I am one of Gillard's middle-class income households that does not get fully compensated. How on earth they work out that we are "wealthy" is beyond me, however for the sake of the future of this planet and my kids I am willing to pay the extra $10 a week or more over time without subsidy if it means that on the off-chance that these mad Gallileoesc scientists are right.
Why you think paying $10 a week more is going to save the planet is seriously deluded thinking (and I don't being so blunt, can't seem to help it regarding the carbon tax)
But I guess the guilt trips have got some people so strong that they have convinced themselves if they pay a bit of blood money they can relax and start looking at themselves in the mirror... and get that new 4Wd and take that trip to Bali.... oh the insanity.....
Jul 16th 2011 | 5:13 am
#251
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 691
Re: Carbon tax
How about we don't say she lied, how about we she gave an assurance. Would that help? I am sorry to get hung up on semantics but you would normally view a lie as an untruth told after the fact or about something that has already happened or about something that is she already knew she was going to do. I don't think she initially intended to introduce a carbon tax but was forced into it to get the Greens on her side. In Gillards case she said something which wasn't a lie when she said it but her actions afterwards turned her statement into what appears to be a lie. I suppose she didn't know at the time that she would have to brown nose Brown to get to be PM. So really it wasn't a lie she told but she went back on her assurance to the Australian people.
That doesn't get her off the hook though. She should still resign because she broke her word, assurance, promise or whatever you like to call it.
That doesn't get her off the hook though. She should still resign because she broke her word, assurance, promise or whatever you like to call it.
Jul 16th 2011 | 5:14 am
#252
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 691
Re: Carbon tax
Personally I think that woman wasn't after any explanation but just wanted to kick her. Bit self indulgent for little purpose except entertainment for a partisan audience.
She has already said she changed her mind - it was a mistake to promise what she couldn't keep to and let's hope she's learnt from it - there is no evidence that rather than change her mind she purposely lied. To emphatically imply that she purposely lied without hearing her out is rude. From what I have read about her and how she is regarded by both sides of the house and journalists the balance of probabilities suggests she is of good character. Abbott on the other hand has a history of nasty incidents and makes a bad alternative if you dislike people of poor character.
She has already said she changed her mind - it was a mistake to promise what she couldn't keep to and let's hope she's learnt from it - there is no evidence that rather than change her mind she purposely lied. To emphatically imply that she purposely lied without hearing her out is rude. From what I have read about her and how she is regarded by both sides of the house and journalists the balance of probabilities suggests she is of good character. Abbott on the other hand has a history of nasty incidents and makes a bad alternative if you dislike people of poor character.
Jul 16th 2011 | 5:18 am
#253
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 691
Re: Carbon tax
When the Libs got in in 1996 there a MASSIVE black hole in the budget's books due to some dodgy accounting by the world's Greatest ever treasurer, Mr Keating, and so some of the spending commitments made by Howard during the election campaign had to be shelved, hence core and non-core promises.
Jul 16th 2011 | 5:22 am
#254
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 691
Re: Carbon tax
Go and start lobbying the politicians in China, USA, India and Brazil.
We are cutting our nose off to spite our face. There is NO USE in it other than making those on guilt trips feel better about themselves.
We are cutting our nose off to spite our face. There is NO USE in it other than making those on guilt trips feel better about themselves.
Jul 16th 2011 | 5:30 am
#255
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 691
Re: Carbon tax
So if I follow the logic of the government.
1. They tax the big polluting companies
2. They give that money to compensate Joe Public for the increase in the cost of goods caused by the rise in costs to the big polluting companies.
So far so good.
Fast forward 2 years and lets assume that the big carrot worked and the big polluting companies will have figured out ways to reduce their emissions and therefore the tax they pay.
At that point; do you think that the subsequent in the costs of goods will be passed on to the consumers. I don't think so, they will remein at their new inflated price. And is the government still compensating Joe Public? If so, what with? The pot of money they were using to compensate with has run empty because the big polluting companies aren't filling it anymore.
It's just Labour spending (or promising to spend) what they haven't got all over again.
1. They tax the big polluting companies
2. They give that money to compensate Joe Public for the increase in the cost of goods caused by the rise in costs to the big polluting companies.
So far so good.
Fast forward 2 years and lets assume that the big carrot worked and the big polluting companies will have figured out ways to reduce their emissions and therefore the tax they pay.
At that point; do you think that the subsequent in the costs of goods will be passed on to the consumers. I don't think so, they will remein at their new inflated price. And is the government still compensating Joe Public? If so, what with? The pot of money they were using to compensate with has run empty because the big polluting companies aren't filling it anymore.
It's just Labour spending (or promising to spend) what they haven't got all over again.
