Michael

Maybe this one will also be of interest to the ongoing discussion.

London is the sixth richest city in the world, provides 20% of UK's GDP, and is one of the most expensive cities to live in worldwide. Yet alongside prosperity lives poverty. 4 in 10 (or 650,000) London children live in poverty, 12% above the national average. Child poverty levels in inner London boroughs are higher still; more than one in every two inner London children live in poverty.

4 in 10: The End Child Poverty London Project

amideislas

Tell me something; Are you a farking expert in everything? or just a wannabe?

Before you answer, be advised I know a few of those already.

Bob

Lawrence is a prime shithole

Pulaski

He has a lot of spare time, and is a dab hand with Google.

Cape Blue

In reality that a measure of inequality not poverty.

When I moved from Streatham in London to San Francisco, the large amount of homeless people was startling.

Michael

+1

Just to add, I seldom read just one article but often hundreds trying to figure out what are the most logical conclusions.

As far as poverty, that is probably one of the most complex things to draw logical conclusions about. When I was working in Europe during the late 1960s and early 1970s, I often had to travel to East Germany on business and poverty, run down buildings, barely drivable roads, shoddy goods, and lack of cars seemed to be everywhere. I also visited Hungary and Yugoslavia on vacation and the richest of the three countries appeared to be Yugoslavia with it's well maintained and clean cities, good roads, expensive cars, and beautiful resorts and East Germany appeared by far the poorest. However according to the World Bank and the CIA, East Germany was the richest of the Eastern block countries and Yugoslavia ranked near the bottom.

Also Yugoslavia appeared to be a very harmonious place but as we later saw, they didn't like each other very well.

WEBlue

Agree with both these sensible responses. It seems glaringly obvious that the answer to the OP's question really depends upon two factors that differ somewhat for every one of us: namely where you come from in the UK and where you have moved to in the US....

Even those two factors are not simple. For instance, in England we lived in Cambridge for many years, raising our family in a very nice area with few/no signs of poverty or homelessness. However, once the children left home and the husband and I decided to share a car--necessitating one or both of us to use the local busses more often than previously--our perceptions changed as we saw more people who either could not afford a car and/or obtain a drivers licence (health, mental, addiction, or homelessness problems). I began to notice people I'd not really seen before--the pan-handlers around the main bus station, rough sleepers in the parks, etc.

Now we live in a well-to-do area of the US--lots of rich folks' second homes around us. I would say if I went on surface appearances alone that there's no evidence poverty here at all.... Yet I know that under that surface there probably is a problem (substance abuse, squatters breaking into empty houses to rob or sleep). Sometimes it just takes time to be able to "see" the signs....

HumphreyC

Nope, it's still a shithole

Mrs Danvers

Hmmm. I remember reading Russell Brands My Bookywook that there is a subsection of society you don't see until you need to see it. He began to see it when he was a homeless heroin addict and wondered why he hadn't seen it before.

When I lived outside Cambridge UK I didn't have a car either and there were always homeless types hanging around Drummer street bus station. Also all the public toilets always had sharps containers where IV drug users could safely dispose of their needles. I used to smoke in those days and I daren't walk across Parkers Piece with a cigarette because I got tired of people asking me if I had a spare fag.

The first place I lived in Boulder was a second floor apartment which overlooked a library. I used to see someone roll up in a psychedelic spray painted Yugo at night, break into the library and leave about 5:30 in the morning.

There are a lot of homeless in Boulder who make little camps alongside the Boulder creek.

I think I've always noticed homelessness straight away. What I didn't notice so much in the USA at first was working poor living in trailers, really nasty ones.

jeepster

Homelessness in the US has a long history. Before it used to be called skid row or "bummin around". In the beginning of the last century up to the Derpression it wasn't unusual to see whole families "riding the rails".

As me English Wife says, "the American Dream is doing what you want without being stigmatized for it". Free to be impoverished, free to be mentally ill, free to be homeless. It's the culture, you're free to fail. There is no noblesse oblige in America.

WriterChick

No noblesse oblige in America?

Umm, no, thankfully America is not a monarchy.

Anyway, if you think there is noblesse oblige in the UK, you've been gone a very, very long time, or you are delusional.

petitefrancaise

not noblesse oblige exactly but where I live there is a conspicuous (? I've had a glass already ) effort at helping those less fortunate. Coat/clothes drives at the schools, backpacks full of food for kids for the weekend. I just got really fed-up with my over-privileged kiddoes and tried to volunteer en famille over christmas. Nobody needed help, all is booked up.

I really noticed how many people there are begging at every single busy junction and it tugged at my heartstrings when we first arrived. Now, I see the same people at different places having paid their "fee" no doubt and I think that there are enough places to get a bed and free food around this city and I find I'm less susceptible to their pleas.

RICH

I live in a "poor" area but not "the Hood". There are a few houses like that. Squatters next door.(the drug dealers got busted). Vacant half block that used to be a Trailer Park. But it is actually a reasonable residential area.

I used to work downtown, where beggars would be after change or cigs on every corner. The vacant lot / car park I used often had vagrants sleeping there when I arrived in the morning. Now I work next to the county Jail. Different but similar scenery.

In UK I lived in central London, and before that in Torquay and Bristol. It was 10-20 years ago, but much the same impressions.

ETA For 2 weeks right before emmigrating, I lived (with permission) in a boarded up building on Tottenham Court Road.

Bnet36

Never looked at "land of the free" from this perspective. Smart woman.

jeepster

Noblesse still exists (in England) but it's the government programs that have taken over. Social safety net.

Yes, when living in the states one has to accept living with failure. It's out in the open and you help when you can.