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UK state pension and USA social security

UK state pension and USA social security

Old Nov 26th 2015, 5:10 am
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Default Re: UK state pension and USA social security

Originally Posted by chris_fuzz View Post
Hello Nun,

I am presently applying for SS benefits in the US. I have many years of voluntary NICs in the UK, but the SS are insisting on including all my NICs in my WEP calculation! I am very interested when you say that voluntary contributions do not count in the WEP. Do you have chapter and verse on that? I think they would listen to me if I could cite an SSA, or other official US Govt, document that says it.

Any information you could give would be helpful.

Thank you.
Not Nun but...

A) Voluntary contributions mean that the the pension is not earnings related and therefore not subject to WEP.
This is taken from the very definition of a pension subject to WEP - 'For a pension to cause WEP, the payment must be based on earnings for service that were not covered by Social Security.' See B1 https://secure.ssa.gov/apps10/poms.nsf/lnx/0300605360

B) On form SSA-308 there is a section which specifically asks you to identify voluntary contributions - they should then eliminate these periods from WEP.

C) Probably could use something else in their procedural system POMS if necessary. See https://secure.ssa.gov/apps10/poms.n.../0200307290#c5 Section C 5b.

Last edited by jb82; Nov 26th 2015 at 5:29 am.
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Old Nov 26th 2015, 5:39 am
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Default Re: UK state pension and USA social security

Originally Posted by jb82 View Post
Not Nun but...

A) Voluntary contributions mean that the the pension is not earnings related and therefore not subject to WEP.
This is taken from the very definition of a pension subject to WEP - 'For a pension to cause WEP, the payment must be based on earnings for service that were not covered by Social Security.' See B1 https://secure.ssa.gov/apps10/poms.nsf/lnx/0300605360

B) On form SSA-308 there is a section which specifically asks you to identify voluntary contributions - they should then eliminate these periods from WEP.

C) Probably could use something else in their procedural system POMS if necessary. See https://secure.ssa.gov/apps10/poms.n.../0200307290#c5 Section C 5b.
Hi jb82,

Thank you!! ThT is very helpful indeed!

chris_fuzz
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Old Nov 26th 2015, 2:39 pm
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Default Re: UK state pension and USA social security

Voluntary UK NICs are not counted for WEP under GN 00307.290 C.5.b


https://secure.ssa.gov/apps10/poms.nsf/lnx/0200307290
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Old Nov 27th 2015, 4:43 am
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Default Re: UK state pension and USA social security

Originally Posted by nun View Post
Voluntary UK NICs are not counted for WEP under GN 00307.290 C.5.b


https://secure.ssa.gov/apps10/poms.nsf/lnx/0200307290
Thank you for your help. I now have a very good idea what to do.
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Old Nov 27th 2015, 1:19 pm
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Default Re: UK state pension and USA social security

Originally Posted by nun View Post
Voluntary UK NICs are not counted for WEP under GN 00307.290 C.5.b


https://secure.ssa.gov/apps10/poms.nsf/lnx/0200307290
I'm 65 and already get my US SS, I plan to start getting my British state pension when I'm 66, that is, after deferring for one year. Do I have to approach the British authorities for the required letter detailing what percentage, or what amount, of my future British state pension is based on voluntary contributions, or does the SSA go to the British authorities direct?
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Old Nov 27th 2015, 4:55 pm
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Default Re: UK state pension and USA social security

Originally Posted by robin1234 View Post
I'm 65 and already get my US SS, I plan to start getting my British state pension when I'm 66, that is, after deferring for one year. Do I have to approach the British authorities for the required letter detailing what percentage, or what amount, of my future British state pension is based on voluntary contributions, or does the SSA go to the British authorities direct?
When Mrs L and I claimed our SS we had to supply the SSA with all the information about our UK pension. They didn't to my knowledge have any contact with the DWP in the UK. In fact the person at the SSA who dealt with us took everything over the phone with the usual sworn statement that is was true. We didn't have to provide any documentary evidence. But Mrs L was subject to the full WEP on the information we provided so there probably wasn't any need to check further.

Last edited by lansbury; Nov 27th 2015 at 4:57 pm.
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Old Nov 27th 2015, 5:34 pm
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Default Re: UK state pension and USA social security

I am in the similar scenario. I have UK Pensions and have chosen to defer for 5 yrs when I will be 70 Yrs. During this defer time my us SS benefits will not be subject to WEP until I claimed UK Pension. I am not sure when I claimed UK Pension WEP amount will increase in line with the increase in UK Pension but recent article and my question to the author indicated that WEP amount will be the same if I would have claimed same both pension together.
I will appreciate comments from other who have taken this route and their experience.
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Old Nov 29th 2015, 4:20 pm
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Default Re: UK state pension and USA social security

I have been reading the posts but am still confused, (function of age I assume). The question I have is this: (hypothetical figures) if I get $1000/m from my US Social Security and get $600/m from UK pension, are the numbers reduced so I get less than $1600?
What worries me is that I've paid into both, (US earned and UK partial earned and partial volunteer contribution), but don't want to lose anything.
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Old Nov 29th 2015, 4:31 pm
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Default Re: UK state pension and USA social security

If you have paid contributions into SS for 30 years or more you will not be subject to WEP. If you have less than 30 years contributions then SS WEP will be calculated using the part of your UK pension which derives from earned contributions.
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Old Nov 29th 2015, 5:24 pm
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Default Re: UK state pension and USA social security

Thanks, need to check how many years, only 28 I think. I believe the WEP is to be repealed but not sure when.
Losing money sucks!
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Old Nov 29th 2015, 10:22 pm
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Default Re: UK state pension and USA social security

Originally Posted by scottiedoggie View Post
Thanks, need to check how many years, only 28 I think. I believe the WEP is to be repealed but not sure when.
Losing money sucks!
There have been several attempts in Congress to repeal WEP. None have so far succeeded. I did read somewhere that a Senator was going to have an attempt at reforming what is already there, but there would still be an adjustment of some sort to the SS payment.

If you have 28 years of contributions I think the most your full SS would be reduced by is 10%.

Last edited by lansbury; Nov 29th 2015 at 10:26 pm.
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Old Dec 1st 2015, 5:29 am
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Default Re: UK state pension and USA social security

Got on-line with US SS today and have 29years as of the end of 2014.
Called UK this morning and talked to a guy with a thick Geordie accent and got more info about claiming my pension. Takes about 3 months from receipt of paperwork apparently. I would like to hear from anyone who is already receiving US and UK pensions, regarding the tax situation.
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Old Dec 1st 2015, 5:41 am
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Default Re: UK state pension and USA social security

What do you want to know about tax. It is paid in the US on both. The UK one is tax free in the UK.
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Old Dec 1st 2015, 6:48 am
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Default Re: UK state pension and USA social security

Great, thanks for the prompt reply!
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Old Dec 1st 2015, 12:08 pm
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Default Re: UK state pension and USA social security

Originally Posted by scottiedoggie View Post
Got on-line with US SS today and have 29years as of the end of 2014.
Called UK this morning and talked to a guy with a thick Geordie accent and got more info about claiming my pension. Takes about 3 months from receipt of paperwork apparently. I would like to hear from anyone who is already receiving US and UK pensions, regarding the tax situation.
When you are calling UK what number are you using?

Thanks
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