dunroving

Keep your shirt on.

Samual

I could just as easily find another league table that would contradict that. League tables aren't a measure of prestige anyway.

Don't tell me to keep my shirt on, you misconstrue what i say so i corrected you. If you have nothing else to offer stop quoting me.

dunroving

I didn't misconstrue what you said. You need to read more carefully and get a thicker skin. And the only way I'll stop quoting you is if you stop being so sanctimonious (or shut up, either is fine with me).

Samual

Evidently you did misconstrue what i said, i suggest you go back and re-read what was said. God knows how you can work where you say you do if you're unable to understand my very simple post.

dunroving

To and fro, to and fro ... not my favorite way of spending time on BE. You are making a real impression in your first few posts on BE, aren't you?

Following some very preliminary research, I can tell you that in the "ancient" Scottish universities, and in some English universities (e.g., Oxford), a Master of Arts (yes it IS called a masters contrary to your earlier assertion) is awarded in subjects such as English, social sciences, humanities, without what would typically be recognised as postgraduate studies (i.e., entry directly into the MA without prior undergraduate studioes needed)

Whether it is "just" an undergraduate degree, or "equivalent" to a BA depends on your source of information. For example, some of the universities concerned assert (understandably, perhaps) that the rigour involved in the final year of studies makes the MA a higher-level degree than most typical BA degrees. And the MA is sought-after by some international universities as being superior to the BA.

OK, now you can reply "That's what I said"

p.s. I don't remember saying where I worked ... and have you ever thought that maybe the problem with your posts is exactly because they are simple, and therefore ambiguous? Clarify your terms, use precision of language, and then maybe we'd have a clue what you're trying to say. I think you'd rather wind people up with your patronising comments than engage in a meaningful discussion of the subject. Or perhaps we all just aren't paying enough attention ...

Jerseygirl

That's what I was getting at.

Samual

Yup im sure i am making an impression, but why that has any bearing i dont know.

No they do not award masters degrees, i dont know how many times i must say this until you understand. The Scottish MA is an undergraduate degree. I hoped you were of sufficient intelligence to appreciate the difference between the name "Masters of Arts" and a masters degree, but clearly you dont. A masters degree from Scottish universities that award the undergraduate MA are usually styled MLitt.

I'm not sure what authority you are siting for this but it is wholly unfounded, and frankly BS! The rigour involved in the final year is no more challenging than that of the third year at English universities. The first year at Scottish universities is comparable to A2 standard by the way, just in case your argument is that because an honours degree is 3 and not 4 years in England it is somehow inferior.

Your whole claim seems to be based on the fact its called an MA, which i already said is due to historical reasons, that are i think somehow linked with the Oxbridge MA (which isn't a masters degree either) by the way.

Again, i suggest you go back and re-read what was said.

dunroving

You are a real piece of work, aren't you?

robin1234

I have a Cambridge MA, and it IS a masters degree. I have a Master of Arts diploma, awarded to me either three or four (I forget exactly) years after I graduated with the bachelors degree. Cambridge has always done it that way, and they aint about to change just because a lot of upstart institutions in America etc. find it confusing.

dunroving

Just a couple of relevant quotes:

"The Scottish master of arts is not an ordinary undergraduate degree ... The Scottish MA increases the length and depth of study. Students in their fourth year will study the material that might be abridged in other postgraduate MA courses... "

The source is the former Principal of Glasgow University, now Vice Chancellor of the University of London. If you don't agree with what he says, take it up with him. Just a piece of advice: You might not want to tell him he's talking BS, lacking in intelligence or can't read.

p.s. It's "citing" not "siting". Anyone with an MA in English would know that.

Samual

Thank you.

It isn't a masters degree. I would argue this point a little more, but i see no need to. If you really cared you'd google it and see for yourself. But i did just ask my father who also attended Cambridge and he agrees with me.

Oh actually i will add this that i just found:

"The universities of Oxford, Cambridge and Dublin award master's degrees to BAs without further examination, when a certain number of years after matriculation (7 in the case of Oxford and Cambridge) have passed, and upon payment of a nominal fee. It is commonplace for recipients of the degree to have graduated several years previously and to have had little official contact with the university or academic life since then. The only real significance of these degrees is that they historically conferred voting rights in University elections, and certain other privileges e.g. the right to dine at high table. For the purpose of comparison, they are considered equivalent to BA/BSc degrees of other universities. The MAs awarded by Oxford and Cambridge are colloquially known as the Oxbridge MA. The University of Cambridge also offers an MA to senior staff both academic and non academic after five years employment with the university."

Clever stuff, i mean really, correcting a spelling error... wooh that really showed me didn't it? I love it when people do that, you may as well say i have nothing else to say because i was wrong and be done.

What does that prove exactly?... I mean, its hardly evidence to support your very ill-informed views is it. The only difference between English and Scottish undergraduate degrees is that in Scotland, the extra year means that students take out "extra subjects" a bit like the liberal arts education in the US, before specialising in year 3 and 4.

dunroving

Good luck with getting that bee out of your bonnet.

Samual

And may i equally wish you good luck, and hope you dont cross my path with stupid and ignorant comments again or your ego may take another bashing.

dunroving

droll ... for a 5-year-old

Samual

More than i could say about some of your posts.