jmood

Why is it so hard to find someone's bank account number or work address? Why if a court gives a garnishment order, does the same court also not provide for a means to execute that order? Why if monies can only realistically be collected from insurance companies would anyone have anything more than the legally required bare min insurance? How could OJ live w/o any income? Wouldn't his interest earned and royalties be considered income?

The way I'm reading all this, it seems as if insurance companies and the legal system in the US are actually in collusion to earn money and the system is not to protect people but to make money. Yes, OK the bailiffs in the UK are awful, but at least people know that if they legitimately owe something they better pay up.

Someone owes me around $15K and keeps saying he will pay but never does. No formal contract but I have it in writing in e-mails. Lawyer I consulted basically said there was very little I could do to get it back, even if I got the thing formalized via court, because it is a person that kind of scrapes by.

Nutek

hungryhorace

I think you may have summed the court system in the US up quite well there. It's all about protecting corporations. Remember, corporations are people as well now! Just another insane judgement from the rabble that is our current Supreme Court make-up.

scrubbedexpat091

OJ had good lawyers. Good lawyers can keep you protected.

It's not the courts job to collect, its their job to issue the orders, but it's up to the plaintiff or their lawyers to find ways to collect based on the court orders.

In California for example if you have a judgement against someone and they wont pay, you can ask the court for a wage garnishment order, ask to place a lien on real estate the person may own, place a lien on personal items and have the Sheriff go collect the items and place them up for auction.

"You can have the sheriff take the debtor's personal property and sell it at public auction to pay the debt.

This personal property can include things like:

Audio equipment, televisions, or musical instruments;
Computers;
Coin collections;
Jewelry;
Rare books, etc.
But, often, the cost of doing this is more than the value of the property, so make sure that the property you want the sheriff to take and sell will be worth all the effort and money."

"To collect from a debtor who will not pay you, you can file a lien on the debtor's real property (like a house or land). This way when the debtor tries to sell or refinance his or her home, you can get paid your judgment plus accrued interest from the escrow.

If you choose not to wait for the debtor to sell or refinance the property, you can look into "foreclosing" on the judgment lien. This means that you force the debtor to sell the property and pay you with that money. This only works when there is enough equity in the property to pay all the liens as well as the costs of foreclosure."


Of course it will all take time and a lawyer to deal with it all, so unless a large amount, probably not worth collecting.

Obviously rules will vary by state, this is only for California.

Collect From the Debtor's Property - small_claims_selfhelp


As for garnishment's, my sister is well versed in that since she has various judgement's against her ex, he simply stops working and finds cash jobs to avoid having wages garnished. He owes so much child support, his kid will be retired before its ever paid, if it ever is paid.

She is always in court over it, but his mom pays for a lawyer and my sister has limited legal help, so he almost always gets the court to delay something because of a loop hole in the law.

A good lawyer can do wonders for you, and ultimately that is the most important part of the legal system, having a better lawyer then the other person.

jmood

That means the system sucks.

The law should make it clear (to even the bad lawyers) what the possible path to recovery is. And if the law provides the path for someone to pay up for legitimate debts, it should not be stoppable (like OJ) because of good lawyers.

Michael

You as an individual or a corporation have no legal access to a person's personal information that the government knows about that person except what is public record. A corporation or an individual could place a lien against someone's home but they can't collect until the home is sold and they will be at the bottom of the list to collect if it is sold.

Even for a deadbeat dad, often there is little that the state can do to collect. In that case, many states can revoke someone driver's license or if the judge finds evidence that he is hiding assets, the judge can put him in jail until he makes back payments. However those techniques can only legally be used for certain debts such as child support.

If a creditor sues to collect a debt you owe and wins a court judgment against you, the creditor can ask the court for an order to garnish your salary, bank account, or other assets. The court order would instruct your bank to turn over money from your account. However, federal law says that many federal benefit payments like Social Security benefits, Supplemental Security Income (SSI) benefits, Veteran’s (VA) benefits, Railroad Retirement benefits, and benefits from the Office of Personnel Management are not subject to garnishment in most cases - which means that this money is exempt. (For some benefits, there are exceptions for money owed in child support, spousal support, or for federal taxes.)

Can a creditor garnish my Social Security benefits to pay a debt? > Consumer Financial Protection Bureau

• If you do not show up in court to fight the charges against you, it is likely that the judge will order a garnishment up to the amount the person suing you is requesting.
• Federal limits are in place for wage garnishment. Under wage garnishment laws, no creditors can garnish more than 60 percent of your wages. This is an extreme amount and not often awarded.
• Four states do not allow wage garnishment from creditors, such as credit card companies. Those four states are South Carolina, Pennsylvania, North Carolina and Texas.

Garnishment – What you need to know | Garnishment Laws | Wage Garnishment and Garnishment Laws

State laws can be more lenient towards a debtor, they cannot be more strict than Federal law.

Wage Garnishment: Basic Laws For All 50 States

Corporations often don't try to garnish a poor or middle class person's wages since they might change jobs and if the garnishment order is too large, they may file for bankruptcy. If a person owes one creditor a large amount of money, that person likely also owes a large amount of money to other corporations. If all corporations try to collect, that will likely force the person into bankruptcy. However when a person's debts exceed their assets significantly, they usually file for bankruptcy anyway.

Some states are recourse states for home mortgages which means the lender can sue the person for money owed after a foreclosure. However few lenders sue the person since most are totally broke and it just forces them into bankruptcy. Only when the lender believes that the person has significant assets does the lender even consider suing the person but even then, seldom sues.

A person could carry minimum liability insurance but if a person has assets, he/she will likely have to hire a lawyer at a significant cost to try to keep the judgment low. Eventually for most people, they would have to file bankruptcy and then bankruptcy laws would dissolve assets to pay off part of the debt.

If a person is rich, he/she can hire expensive lawyers to evade paying debt. Around the world, the rich have benefits that the average person doesn't have. In the UK, the rich can often be taxed either like a resident or non resident while living in the UK to reduce taxes but this law has no advantages for the average person. Therefore they can stash their money in the Cayman Islands and be taxed like a non resident and pay significantly less taxes.

hungryhorace

They can? I'm pretty sure said person(s) would have to live outside of the UK for a minimum of 183 days a year.

Michael

Nope. If they have lived outside the country for a specific period of time, upon return you can opt to be excluded from getting the standard deduction (£10,000) and pay taxes only on the money brought into or earned the UK. As time passes, there are penalties but the penalties are low in relation to the tax savings if you are very rich.

hungryhorace

How does that work then? Do you have any examples?

Michael

Reread my post. I edited it. You'll have to check the exact way it is done.

scrubbedexpat091

Short article on it all.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/101748242#.

They have collected some from OJ, but his largest asset appears to be a pension which under the law they can't touch. Seems OJ did a really good job at hiding his assets, which the courts can't do much about, if someone can't find it, they can't prove someone has it.

Michael

The article also didn't mention that homestead laws in Florida 100% protect a person's primary residence. Therefore if OJ had a $2 million home and owned it outright, that can't be toughed. Most other states only protect the equity in the home to a specific amount and some protect as little as $20,000.

jmood

So the criteria for this to apply is how rich you are and not how many days of the year you spend in the UK?
What would the max number of days per year you could spend in the UK be for this to apply?

jmood

HungryHorace I'm now scared of you.

Michael

When you need to consider domicile

If you have foreign income or foreign capital gains then you need to consider your domicile, as it will have an effect on the amount of Income Tax or Capital Gains Tax you have to pay. You may also need to consider your domicile for the purposes of Inheritance Tax. If your circumstances are complicated you may need to consult a professional adviser.

Effect of domicile on your UK tax

Your domicile status may affect what Income Tax and Capital Gains Tax you pay in the UK if both of the following apply:

• you are a UK resident and are not domiciled in the UK
• you have foreign income or foreign capital gains

If these apply, you will be taxed as normal on your UK income and UK capital gains, but you'll be able to choose how you are taxed on your foreign income and capital gains ' either on the 'arising basis' or on the 'remittance basis'.

HM Revenue & Customs: Meaning of 'domicile' and how it affects your tax

Sorry I used the term resident earlier and the correct term is domicile.