Land of opportunity...
Jul 27th 2008, 7:46 pm
#931
Forum Regular
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 90
Re: Land of opportunity...
I grew up here and carry the blue passport with the eagle without any shame, but I agree with the majority posting here that the US system sucks, too. I've seen plenty of examples of its failures both firsthand and in the data, and I understand enough about business, finance and economics to realize that the problems with US health care access are inherent to the current business model and do not occur in spite of it.
Since they live here and offer a perspective tempered by experience abroad, I think that their input is useful, particularly for those who have no such experience. Some use it as a subterfuge for America-bashing, but most of them are offering legitimate complaints and are acting as good Americans should, showing their love for the country by trying to make it a better place.
Perhaps most importantly, the comments made here help to dispel much of the self-serving mythology and propaganda that is promoted by the US health care industry to protect its oligopoly and profit margins.
As comedian Louis Black notes in one of his routines, the Americans who are most likely to go on about the US being the "greatest country on Earth" have barely left the place and are the last people on Earth to render such a judgment. They could benefit from reading this.
You would think that people outside the US were dying in the streets and waiting in year-long queues to see a nurse, given the tripe that substitutes for dialog among many Americans in respect to this subject. It would be an eye opener for tens of millions of Yanks to see that not only do they not have it better, but that they actually have it worse. Much worse.
Since they live here and offer a perspective tempered by experience abroad, I think that their input is useful, particularly for those who have no such experience. Some use it as a subterfuge for America-bashing, but most of them are offering legitimate complaints and are acting as good Americans should, showing their love for the country by trying to make it a better place.
Perhaps most importantly, the comments made here help to dispel much of the self-serving mythology and propaganda that is promoted by the US health care industry to protect its oligopoly and profit margins.
As comedian Louis Black notes in one of his routines, the Americans who are most likely to go on about the US being the "greatest country on Earth" have barely left the place and are the last people on Earth to render such a judgment. They could benefit from reading this.
You would think that people outside the US were dying in the streets and waiting in year-long queues to see a nurse, given the tripe that substitutes for dialog among many Americans in respect to this subject. It would be an eye opener for tens of millions of Yanks to see that not only do they not have it better, but that they actually have it worse. Much worse.
But if USSR had only 10% of GDP debts.
USA have 75%. I even coldn`t imagine yours economic collaps.
Jul 27th 2008, 7:48 pm
#932
Professional Drama Queen
Joined: Dec 2007
Location: West Virginia
Posts: 1,061
there MUST be elements within that profession that are as despairing of the current system as some of us are ? C'mon I watched ER I know they have hearts! 
Jul 27th 2008, 8:01 pm
#934
Banned
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Bay Area, California
Posts: 826
Re: Land of opportunity...
I'm sure many go into medicine for the best reasons. I believe that the reality was that personal idemnity was a big issue here a while back and dissuaded many from going into the profession. More profitable to be a laywer. Not sure if that trend continues..
Jul 27th 2008, 8:05 pm
#935
Forum Regular
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 90
Re: Land of opportunity...
Its really could happens. In late 80s USA (if i don`t forget) had only 20% of GDP debts and this wasn`t so serious for USA
But now. If we imagine 5-6% for this debts (or credits for USA) - this is 4% of GDP per year. Such GDP growth was only few times in 30-year USA history.
But now. If we imagine 5-6% for this debts (or credits for USA) - this is 4% of GDP per year. Such GDP growth was only few times in 30-year USA history.
Jul 27th 2008, 8:29 pm
#936
Not living a 9 to 5 life
Joined: Jun 2002
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 11,061
Re: Land of opportunity...
hardly JG, and I think even you know that.....While the only thing I agree with Kali of his assessments is that, yes, this debacle of a debate is fruitless. Certainly it always goes back to the system of the NHS and how superior it is to anything at all - when of course it has many flaws. So does this system.
But what I find really ironic is the few of you that are American citizens or are married to American citizens, are having a go at the country you've chosen to invest your future in - or the foreseeable one anyway. Instead of coming up with viable solutions, you're sitting back and poking fun. Especially Kali - his worthlessness knows no bounds. The fact that he admits to using the NHS system to his benefit is pretty tasteless.
Oh well. Just another health care debate - I should have stuck by my original post 500 hundred pages ago on this very thread..... "here we go again....."
But what I find really ironic is the few of you that are American citizens or are married to American citizens, are having a go at the country you've chosen to invest your future in - or the foreseeable one anyway. Instead of coming up with viable solutions, you're sitting back and poking fun. Especially Kali - his worthlessness knows no bounds. The fact that he admits to using the NHS system to his benefit is pretty tasteless.
Oh well. Just another health care debate - I should have stuck by my original post 500 hundred pages ago on this very thread..... "here we go again....."
Those who've lived overseas and now live in the US perhaps cast a more critical eye over the American system because they are likely to be comparing two (or more) nations health systems against one another. In some respects, this gives more perspective to the comments given about the American system because most Americans do not have experience of another country's health insurance and medical services (based on the fact that about 27% of Americans have passports*).
AmerLisa is implying that it's unpatriotic to be critical of one's country, in this case the USA. Her comments are rubbish. There are probably viable solutions out there but it will require action by the Government to get things done and since politicians are the least likely to suffer the negative consequences of the US healthcare system, it's going to be a long time before things improve for the average American.
Now if a handful of politicans were to swap lives (homes, earnings, and healthcare for example) with the average American for one year whilst still working as a politician, this might open the politician's eyes and prompt changes for the better for the general populace.
* according to the State Department.
Jul 27th 2008, 8:44 pm
#937
Bloody Yank
Joined: Oct 2005
Location: USA! USA!
Posts: 4,186
Re: Land of opportunity...
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/ec...my-public-debt
Personally, I think that the US level is excessive, but eliminating it completely would be an equally poor idea. Some level of public debt can be useful for stimulating an economy. It's a matter of balance, not being debt free.
Jul 27th 2008, 9:20 pm
#938
Account Closed
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 0
Re: Land of opportunity...
Yes there are plenty. There are doctors that try to fight the insurance companies on behalf of patients all the time. I spent a lot of years working in the system here and, yes it needs to be changed but it is not all as bad as a lot of people make it out to be.
I'm not going to comment too much on the NHS as I've been out of the country too long to know how good or bad it is now. I do have some knowledge through family members. My now deceased SiL had excellent treatment through Addenbrooks in Cambridge for years with kidney dialysis and transplant but during that time both her and my brother tirelessly raised money for the dialysis center and to this day my brother still does.
My BiL has Gauchers Disease and has to have intravenous enzymes injected every week, the cost is phenomenal and every six months it has to be re-evaluated by a board to see if there is money available in the local Health trust to pay for it, if there isn't then it will stop and he will not survive (sounds similar to the US, eh?)
Living here for the last 19 years we have had our share of medical problems and we have also been fortunate to have insurance. O f course having to find deductables and the usual 20% the insurance don't pay does start to add up. Also the insurance is only there and affordable as long as we are employed so it can be concerning.
Last week I had to have a heart catherter and I am now looking to have possibly more cardiac related surgery in the near future. It's a problem that has been caught early through regular encouraged check ups, extra testing because of hereditary related problems, would I have had this done so quickly or easily in the UK? Or would it have only been discovered when I had a major heart attack?
There is good and bad to both systems. One day there may be a fix for both countries health services..........I'm not holding my breath though.
Jul 27th 2008, 9:21 pm
#939
Septicity
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 23,762
Re: Land of opportunity...
But what I find really ironic is the few of you that are American citizens or are married to American citizens, are having a go at the country you've chosen to invest your future in - or the foreseeable one anyway. Instead of coming up with viable solutions, you're sitting back and poking fun.
Jul 27th 2008, 9:47 pm
#940
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 22,105
Re: Land of opportunity...
Jul 27th 2008, 9:55 pm
#942
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 22,105
Re: Land of opportunity...
Your worth in all these threads is questionable. You have written countless moronic remarks about (your admission) your own countrymen. And when its pointed out to you that you've used the NHS illegally, you've managed to keep quiet and skip through that. Personally I think you're here to stoke the fire and keep the pot boiling. The trolls these days are getting a bit more ingenious.
Jul 27th 2008, 9:59 pm
#944
A lion in your lap
Joined: Jul 2003
Location: Sparta NJ
Posts: 7,605
Re: Land of opportunity...
and raise you so if it's not going to change overnight (does that happen to anything significant?) we should just suck it up? Do I have that right?
Last edited by elfman; Jul 27th 2008 at 10:04 pm.
Jul 27th 2008, 10:08 pm
#945
Banned
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: Bay Area, California
Posts: 826
Re: Land of opportunity...
Your worth in all these threads is questionable. You have written countless moronic remarks about (your admission) your own countrymen. And when its pointed out to you that you've used the NHS illegally, you've managed to keep quiet and skip through that. Personally I think you're here to stoke the fire and keep the pot boiling. The trolls these days are getting a bit more ingenious.