Guns?
Jun 9th 2005, 9:47 pm
#136
Just Joined
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 4
Re: Guns?
Originally Posted by anotherlimey
Where's that stat coming from? and how many are the result of people not declaring them after the ban resulting from the Dunblane massacre?
After the ban in 1997, every single pistol that was legally held in the UK was accounted for. The police knew what make, calibre and serial number.
The FBI Uniform Crime Report makes very interesting reading when comparing US/UK crime figures. Per capita head, large swathes of the US have lower crime rates than the UK.
Jun 9th 2005, 9:48 pm
#137
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Joined: Mar 2005
Location: CA
Posts: 857
Re: Guns?
Originally Posted by ImHere
I didnt say thay would stop it happenening, however they will lower the risk, otherwise the alarm manufacturers have made an awful lot of cash out of lies. Statistics can say anything, which is why I dont believe them from any side of the argument.
Look, you do what you think is neccessary and I shall do what I think is neccesary and within the law.
Why dont you all come back to me when you have truly been in amongst dangerous criminals and seen what they can do. When you've dealt with someone who is willing to rape and then murder the victim to stop them talking. When you've had to wade into a room full of idiots waving smashed bottles in each others faces.
Look, you do what you think is neccessary and I shall do what I think is neccesary and within the law.
Why dont you all come back to me when you have truly been in amongst dangerous criminals and seen what they can do. When you've dealt with someone who is willing to rape and then murder the victim to stop them talking. When you've had to wade into a room full of idiots waving smashed bottles in each others faces.
As for my own protection, at one time I took to carrying one of those sprays (even though it was illegal in the UK) ... until I thought better of it, figured the mugger would probably wrestle the spray from me and I would end up getting sprayed with it instead!
Jun 9th 2005, 9:52 pm
#138
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,577
Re: Guns?
Originally Posted by Simon G
The Home Office, ACPO and Customs put the illegal arms pool in the UK at between 2 and 4 million guns.
After the ban in 1997, every single pistol that was legally held in the UK was accounted for. The police knew what make, calibre and serial number.
After the ban in 1997, every single pistol that was legally held in the UK was accounted for. The police knew what make, calibre and serial number.
The FBI Uniform Crime Report makes very interesting reading when comparing US/UK crime figures. Per capita head, large swathes of the US have lower crime rates than the UK.
Jun 9th 2005, 9:56 pm
#139
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,577
Re: Guns?
Originally Posted by Simon G
The Home Office, ACPO and Customs put the illegal arms pool in the UK at between 2 and 4 million guns.
After the ban in 1997, every single pistol that was legally held in the UK was accounted for. The police knew what make, calibre and serial number.
The FBI Uniform Crime Report makes very interesting reading when comparing US/UK crime figures. Per capita head, large swathes of the US have lower crime rates than the UK.
After the ban in 1997, every single pistol that was legally held in the UK was accounted for. The police knew what make, calibre and serial number.
The FBI Uniform Crime Report makes very interesting reading when comparing US/UK crime figures. Per capita head, large swathes of the US have lower crime rates than the UK.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/...it_fir&id=OECD
US: 8259 intentional homicides with a firearm
UK: 62
EDIT: per capita the UK shows 0.00, whereas the US is 0.03. don't know what population estimates they are using though.
Jun 9th 2005, 9:59 pm
#140
Guest
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Re: Guns?
Originally Posted by anotherlimey
Exactly. So why is gun crime such a problem?
Its not to me. But a lot of people feel it is a very big issue. Personally I think street punks are safer with guns - the larger caliber the better - than with knives....most of them couldnt hit a barn door with a handgun and those big .50's they seem to love make then even worse shots. Whereas a properly weilded knife is a very dangerous article indeed.
Infact, you are far more likely to die from a knife wound than a gunshot wound and it is much, much easier to hit someone with a knife (contrary to what Dant seems to think) than a gun. Why do you think all police forces in the UK now issue covert knife proof body armour as standard issue? We had to wear ours everytime we stepped out the door due to the high(er) risk of knife attack, and I worked in a more rural area.
Jun 9th 2005, 10:02 pm
#141
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Joined: Feb 2004
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Re: Guns?
Originally Posted by ImHere
Its not to me. But a lot of people feel it is a very big issue. Personally I think street punks are safer with guns - the larger caliber the better - than with knives....most of them couldnt hit a barn door with a handgun and those big .50's they seem to love make then even worse shots. Whereas a properly weilded knife is a very dangerous article indeed.
Infact, you are far more likely to die from a knife wound than a gunshot wound and it is much, much easier to hit someone with a knife (contrary to what Dant seems to think) than a gun. Why do you think all police forces in the UK now issue covert knife proof body armour as standard issue? We had to wear ours everytime we stepped out the door due to the high(er) risk of knife attack, and I worked in a more rural area.
Infact, you are far more likely to die from a knife wound than a gunshot wound and it is much, much easier to hit someone with a knife (contrary to what Dant seems to think) than a gun. Why do you think all police forces in the UK now issue covert knife proof body armour as standard issue? We had to wear ours everytime we stepped out the door due to the high(er) risk of knife attack, and I worked in a more rural area.
Jun 9th 2005, 10:03 pm
#142
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Joined: Mar 2005
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Posts: 857
Re: Guns?
Originally Posted by ImHere
Infact, you are far more likely to die from a knife wound than a gunshot wound and it is much, much easier to hit someone with a knife (contrary to what Dant seems to think) than a gun. Why do you think all police forces in the UK now issue covert knife proof body armour as standard issue? We had to wear ours everytime we stepped out the door due to the high(er) risk of knife attack, and I worked in a more rural area.
Jun 9th 2005, 10:03 pm
#143
Forum Regular
Joined: Jan 2004
Location: Leeds to Los Angeles
Posts: 287
Re: Guns?
Originally Posted by ImHere
Its well know the best way to create a police state is by
A) Disarming the populace, then
B) Create a paranioa amongst the public that crime is out of control and finally
C) Introduce "Tough New laws" designed to reduce the now soaring crime rates.
A) Disarming the populace, then
B) Create a paranioa amongst the public that crime is out of control and finally
C) Introduce "Tough New laws" designed to reduce the now soaring crime rates.
Jun 9th 2005, 10:04 pm
#144
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Location: Delaware, US
Posts: 148
Re: Guns?
Originally Posted by ImHere
. If someone broke into my house in the middle of the night they would definitely not get the chance to rape and murder my wife and child without serious risk of pain and death to themselves.
I don't want to sound funny (i am honestly interested in your reply) but do you think you would have the chance to shoot first if you were attacked in your bed?
I know if i was woken from sleep even if i had a loaded gun under my pillow i'm sure they would get me first and in my groggy state i would be more likely to shoot the cat rather than an attacker!
Jun 9th 2005, 10:04 pm
#145
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Joined: Nov 2004
Location: Austin, Texas in my own little world
Posts: 21,691
Re: Guns?
Originally Posted by Guelder Rose
But isn't that because in the UK knives are more likely to be carried than guns, so protection against being stabbed is a higher priority?
Jun 9th 2005, 10:06 pm
#146
Guest
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Re: Guns?
Originally Posted by anotherlimey
Personally I think the gun issue is overrated. Gang problems are far worse.
Jun 9th 2005, 10:07 pm
#147
Guest
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Re: Guns?
Originally Posted by Guelder Rose
But isn't that because in the UK knives are more likely to be carried than guns, so protection against being stabbed is a higher priority?
Yes. But also because knives can do far more damage.
Jun 9th 2005, 10:07 pm
#148
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Re: Guns?
Originally Posted by snowbunny
I bet there are very few innocent bystander knivings.
Jun 9th 2005, 10:07 pm
#149
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Location: Sparta NJ
Posts: 7,605
Re: Guns?
Originally Posted by Simon G
Read some of the work by John R. Lott
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Lott
Jun 9th 2005, 10:09 pm
#150
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Guns?
Originally Posted by Dant3
But you yourself, like most advocates of liberal gun control, are the most guilty of point B. It is you that is creating paranioa amongst the public in order to justify gun ownership. It is then those same people who advocate point C, such as 'Three Strikes And Your Out' and an increased use of the death penalty.
I dont think Ive ever said crime is out of control. Infact I think its the opposite. Im not paranoid and you'd never even know I was carrying a gun if you stood talking to me.
So I am assuming then you think tough penalties for criminals are bad because the create an illusion of more crime?