Mummy in the foothills

Funny that I had never heard that myth and thought it was just teens messing about. and for the first time today I drove to town and saw some tennis shoes hanging over the wire, that gave me a chuckle

sallysimmons

Have a great time!

Another Hull veteran here although I was born near Leeds. I worked in Hull for a couple of years, met my husband there and as a result, wound up living abroad. I thought Hull got a bad rap - I liked where we lived (The Avenues) and I thought the town center was cool. We used to go to a pub on the Land of Green Ginger - forget the name but it was really old and quaint - and we loved the Housemartins, who used to call themselves "the fourth best band in Hull." I have nothing but good memories of that town.

Menschlein

Lived there from 1961 to 1964 in the Stoneferry area and several years in the early 70's up by the Compass Rd Estate. I remember Richard Zeizers, Needlers, and Russel and Lambert (rat) during the first stay and worked for Redifusion in town plus various other Agency jobs.

windsong

I have to correct you. It is not necessarily everyone's "choice" to be here.

chriswinter

Windsong...I guess I'm not quite understanding you...so please take no offense. As adults it is our choice where we live, where we work, etc. I may have had no choice in moving to the states when I was a babe...but I certainly have had and made many choices as to where I would live as an adult. Even today at 64 I still have 'choice' as to where I live. I may have moved to Texas while my husband was alive, because of work...but I made a personal choice after my husband passed away, irrespective of my adult children and grandchildren that lived in Texas at that time. 6 months after my husband passed away, I chose to move back to Chicago...Texas simply was not home for me...never was, in fact I hated where I lived, I was absolutely miserable. About 3 months before my husband died, we had decided we were going back to Chicago..I was putting the plans together...sadly he couldn't hold on that long.
I guess I'm just saying..that as adults we can make choices for ourselves..sometimes they are hard choices...still choices all the same. My mom made a choice for me when I was a minor...as was her right to do. I made choices for my children when they were minors as well, some they didn't appreciate either. But as the adults we all are today...we can truly choose our own brand or place of happiness...sometimes that means going back home, wherever that may be. I sincerely hope you find that which brings you the happiness you desire.

dunroving

I think that for many people, choice is limited, especially with the current economy and job market. I have "chosen" to return to the US, but for three years of trying have failed. So, I'm still stuck in the UK, even though I have "chosen" not to be.

For some reason, it seems (to me anyway) that there has been an increasing level of intolerance and antagonism in several threads on this forum just lately. There have been "this is a British forum, not an American" forum, and other comments tantamount to, "If you don't like it, then leave." Of all the sites on BE, this one probably has the highest proportion of people who are not happy with their lot, and either plan to or would like to come back (after they come back to the UK, if they're happy most posters disappear).

I think statements like "I could never have the cheek to live in and benefit from a country that I dislike or look down on. It is everyone's choice to be here" can set people off. Maybe they are just being over-sensitive maybe not, who's to judge? It's certainly judgemental, and I guess we just have to decide whether to take it personally. But saying we all have a choice is at the least an oversimplification of the situation for many people.

sallysimmons

One of those was me, but I don't think I phrased it quite that way - or I certainly didn't mean to anyway. What I meant was that, as this is a forum for British Ex-Pats intending to move back to the UK, the majority of people are bound to be Brits who for one reason or another are not happy with their lot in life. That in turn is going to lead to negativity about whatever country they feel stuck in. I just think that's the nature of the game and if we all left tomorrow and a new batch of people joined, the conversation would go exactly the same way.

I totally agree with you that most of people don't have complete freedom of choice. In many cases, as in mine, a spouse has to be considered too. Lots of people have children they can't just uproot, or older family members they can't just leave.In the US, some have houses they can't sell. And of course money and jobs are always going to limit choice.

dunroving

I think I was referring to posts like #5537 and #5502, which I did think was unnecessarily rude and and sort of an "If you don't like it ..." response (which all expats should really be sensitive to, as we have probably all at some point been made to feel unwelcome in our adopted country by some redneck or other).

Have just been reading a thread on the US forum, which started off with a list of "crap things about the UK", associated with a sort of "This is why I'm so happy to be moving to the perfect US" tone ... so you are asolutely right, we do tend to find fault in wherever we are trying to leave. I don't bitch and moan about the UK on here anywhere near as much as I do in my personal life, but mostly it's because while bitching and moaning can sometimes make you feel better, here does not seem to be the place for it - I try to present a pragmatic scepticism on here to counterbalance the certain amount of fantasizing that I see. People need support but also a dose of reality from those of us who are hitting the challenges that the UK presents. Ironically, one of the things I dislike about living in the UK is that I feel like I have turned into much more of a whinger since I came back, I've almost had a personality transplant.

Rambling again.

windsong

Dunroving, I think you should reread my post (#5537). I was speaking hypothetically in response to someone else's post (which was in response to someone else's rude post #5502) about what I would have said had the shoe been on the other foot. However, it was an honest response. If someone doesn't like to hear what I would have said if the shoe had been on the other foot, that's not my problem.

chriswinter

Dunroving...I sincerely hope you are not thinking that I'm of the intolerant nature, that I'm being antagonistic or even being judgmental (since your answer includes quoting me). Actually I am quite 'happy' with my lot in life at the moment. I am probably the most liberal and non-judgmental person you would meet in IRL. I believe that life is short, no one has a crystal ball and where there's a will there's a way. I could sit here all day with my regrets, because by no means has my life been a bed of roses, since arriving to the shores of America, many moons ago. In fact, my childhood was a horror. But I am grateful for what I have today...the ability to walk and breathe. I try to see life as an adventure..one chapter may close, but another chapter opens.

I found nothing wrong with this statement that you quoted..""I could never have the cheek to live in and benefit from a country that I dislike or look down on. It is everyone's choice to be here".
In the beginning of this sentence the writing is in the "I" sense, what that person believes in for her/himself...that is not 'simplification', that is a personal belief that a person was sharing with others. Maybe the next statement was a 'generalization'...still I could relate to that, because that is how I believe. Not that per se, one had a choice to be here, how we got here...but that as adults we have the privilege of making adult decisions for oneself.

One of the many problems with writing on the internet or even writing hand-written letters...it's all open to interpretation by the reader. You and I may read the exact same writing, yet more than likely will interpret differently, hear another ring to the writing. The other problem in writing on the internet..I don't see so much as 'simplification', but rather generalization..is why when I give an opinion I try to include my own beliefs, my own life experiences along with that opinion. Maybe another will relate, and maybe not. But will always hope, that possibly what I say might help someone else, cause a little interest, give a chuckle or at the very least can relate to a little bit.

I have always believed one cannot judge another until you walk a mile in that person's shoes. It is my fervent hope, that all will, sooner or later, have that which their heart desires most...wherever that may be.
And to end my speech! I would like to offer a few quotes on regret, that I personally can relate to.
“When one door closes, another opens; but we often look so long and so regretfully upon the closed door that we do not see the one which has opened for us.” ~~~~ Alexander Graham Bell
“Never regret. If it's good, it's wonderful. If it's bad, it's experience.”
~~~~ Victoria Holt
“Guard well within yourself that treasure, kindness. Know how to give without hesitation, how to lose without regret, how to acquire without meanness.” ~~~~ George Sand

OK..will now step down from the podium...NEXT!

dunroving

No, I was really meandering between two different points, I was really trying to say in response to your post that it's not as simple as saying that people have a choice whether they live in country X.

As far as the post that said "I could never have the cheek to live in and benefit from a country that I dislike or look down on. It is everyone's choice to be here", true, the OP was making a statement about him/heself, but the implicit message is that others who live in the US if they don't like it "have the cheek" to do so; that's like me saying "I'd never be so selfish as to put my dog in the hold of a plane for 12 hrs just because I want to go back to the UK" ... I'm sure some folks would take offence at the implication about them, even though the statement is ostensibly about me ...

Menschlein

In Canada too we are repeatedly told that this is the Greatest country on Earth and that people the world over are seeking access. True, there are some great places, if you can afford to live in them, but considering the fact that one pays tripple Taxes, Federal, Provincial & Municipal as well as 60% Tax on all annual earnings above 60G's as well as an added 13% of HST (harmonised Sales Tax) on every added purchase, service, Medical etc. in order to maintain such perceived Greatness, said Greatness has become severely diluted. It is for that very reason that the mind turns back to the European way in order to escape, especially during ones last years, the appaling excess and continued exploitation of a so carelessly generated reproduction of cheap labour, source of all human energy .

dunroving

OK, I reread your post. You said you totally agreed with a rude post that suggested that DDL doesn't belong on this Forum ("This is OUR forum UK not US expat forum", "UK EXpat forum not US expat forum", "OTH maybe wrong forum for u").

I just find that to be rather unfriendly. That's just my opinion and I'm sure it won't be your problem that I hold that opinion.

sallysimmons

I definitely appreciate that and always enjoy your posts (even while I am silently thinking 'nnoooooo, don't leave!!!') I know I tend to make up my mind and then just plough ahead without considering the negatives. That's how I wound up here in the first place

In the end, we all have different tastes, needs and preferences, not to mention different life situations that mean we're happier in one place or another. I like hearing the downsides of the UK because it helps me prepare (and I think you present them in a less negative way than many). In the end, I'm going back because my family and friends are there, and that overrides everything else, but for those going back because they think the UK is somehow 'better,' I think your posts are even more useful.

windsong

Yes, you are correct about that.