Taking your gun to another state drama...
Apr 19th 2009, 3:31 pm
#556
Septicity
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 23,762
Re: Taking your gun to another state drama...
Hi:
I was talking about the internal structure of the statement. The statement that "criminals ignore the law" means absolutely nothing -- the repetition is in the meaning -- "people who break the law ignore the law." The slogan of "When guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns" is also a tautology.
In your example, the repetition adds nothing in a logical sense. However, it gets the point across.
I was talking about the internal structure of the statement. The statement that "criminals ignore the law" means absolutely nothing -- the repetition is in the meaning -- "people who break the law ignore the law." The slogan of "When guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns" is also a tautology.
In your example, the repetition adds nothing in a logical sense. However, it gets the point across.
Apr 19th 2009, 5:20 pm
#557
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 7,605
Re: Taking your gun to another state drama...
Hi:
I was talking about the internal structure of the statement. The statement that "criminals ignore the law" means absolutely nothing -- the repetition is in the meaning -- "people who break the law ignore the law." The slogan of "When guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns" is also a tautology.
In your example, the repetition adds nothing in a logical sense. However, it gets the point across.
I was talking about the internal structure of the statement. The statement that "criminals ignore the law" means absolutely nothing -- the repetition is in the meaning -- "people who break the law ignore the law." The slogan of "When guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns" is also a tautology.
In your example, the repetition adds nothing in a logical sense. However, it gets the point across.
You defined "tautology" using "needless repetition" as a necessary condition. I did you the courtesy of working to your definition and went on to demonstrate that, in the case in point, the repetition was not needless. Therefore, you are wrong and the statement both has meaning and is not a tautology. QED.
To take a leaf from your book, however, thank you for agreeing that there is an important point which needs to be got across to gun control fanatics.
Apr 19th 2009, 8:26 pm
#558
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Nov 2007
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 13,258
Re: Taking your gun to another state drama...
It is, however, still a simple fact that a law abiding citizen concerned for his or her own safety is more likely to live longer without a gun than with a gun ...
Own as many as you want, carry them around like John Wayne for all I care ... just don't try to sell me on the notion that it actually makes you safer.
Own as many as you want, carry them around like John Wayne for all I care ... just don't try to sell me on the notion that it actually makes you safer.
Apr 20th 2009, 2:26 am
#562
Septicity
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 23,762
Re: Taking your gun to another state drama...
You defined "tautology" using "needless repetition" as a necessary condition. I did you the courtesy of working to your definition and went on to demonstrate that, in the case in point, the repetition was not needless. Therefore, you are wrong and the statement both has meaning and is not a tautology. QED.
Apr 20th 2009, 2:40 am
#563
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 7,605
Re: Taking your gun to another state drama...
Apr 20th 2009, 2:46 am
#564
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Jan 2009
Location: DFW, TX
Posts: 508
Re: Taking your gun to another state drama...
That sucks.
Having gotten that out of the way: nope. All sodomy laws have been repealed and/or invalidated.
* "repealed" - means abolished from the law books (statutes)
* "law invalidated" (examples are from Court cases, such as Lawrence vs Texas) - means still in the law books, but can not be enforced
Having gotten that out of the way: nope. All sodomy laws have been repealed and/or invalidated.
* "repealed" - means abolished from the law books (statutes)
* "law invalidated" (examples are from Court cases, such as Lawrence vs Texas) - means still in the law books, but can not be enforced
Apr 20th 2009, 8:17 am
#565
Sursum corda
Joined: Sep 2002
Location: Richmond Hill, GA USA
Posts: 38,860
Apr 20th 2009, 9:37 am
#566
Account Closed
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 16,266
Re: Taking your gun to another state drama...
I didn't define anything. I posted the definitions from Dictionary.Com.
I learned the term in a lower division philosophy class on logic. The term covers one in which the repetition adds nothing to a logical argument.
Another thing I remember from that class was when the Prof, with a smile, noted that there three broad types of logic: deductive, inductive, and seductive.
Last edited by Folinskyinla; Apr 20th 2009 at 9:43 am.
Apr 20th 2009, 9:41 am
#567
Account Closed
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 16,266
Re: Taking your gun to another state drama...
Hi:
Be nice. The word "fact" is subject to multiple meanings. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/fact?r=75
Depending upon the definition used, a "fact" may or may not be true; it may be a matter of reality or just of belief.
I guess that in this context "true fact" would be a matter of clarification and not a "tautology."
Be nice. The word "fact" is subject to multiple meanings. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/fact?r=75
Depending upon the definition used, a "fact" may or may not be true; it may be a matter of reality or just of belief.
I guess that in this context "true fact" would be a matter of clarification and not a "tautology."
Apr 20th 2009, 12:14 pm
#569
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 14,578
Re: Taking your gun to another state drama...
Hi:
I didn't define anything. I posted the definitions from Dictionary.Com.
I learned the term in a lower division philosophy class on logic. The term covers one in which the repetition adds nothing to a logical argument.
Another thing I remember from that class was when the Prof, with a smile, noted that there three broad types of logic: deductive, inductive, and seductive.
I didn't define anything. I posted the definitions from Dictionary.Com.
I learned the term in a lower division philosophy class on logic. The term covers one in which the repetition adds nothing to a logical argument.
Another thing I remember from that class was when the Prof, with a smile, noted that there three broad types of logic: deductive, inductive, and seductive.
Hi:
Be nice. The word "fact" is subject to multiple meanings. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/fact?r=75
Depending upon the definition used, a "fact" may or may not be true; it may be a matter of reality or just of belief.
I guess that in this context "true fact" would be a matter of clarification and not a "tautology."
Be nice. The word "fact" is subject to multiple meanings. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/fact?r=75
Depending upon the definition used, a "fact" may or may not be true; it may be a matter of reality or just of belief.
I guess that in this context "true fact" would be a matter of clarification and not a "tautology."
