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morpeth Jul 27th 2016 2:58 am

Re: 2016 Election
 

Originally Posted by Jerseygirl (Post 12013385)
She is an accomplished, intelligent woman...no doubt about it and she would have done well without Bill. However I do not believe she would have been a senator, Secretary Of State or the Democratic nominee without him. He has the personality/charisma...she has the personality of a dead fish...he is very likeable...she is generally unlikeable. Bill pulled strings and called in favours to get her to this point.

I think it is obvious she had advantages in being Bill's wife that helped her get to be Senator, Secretary of State and now the nominee of the democratic party, and obviously as Bill Clinton so well portrayed last night she has accomplished things in her life.

The issue to me about Clinton is that she is part of a general mindset that doesn't get that the policies and trends of the last few decades have led us to this situation, and more of the same will contribute to further decline.

sir_eccles Jul 27th 2016 3:22 am

Re: 2016 Election
 
So Trump campaign have said they are not releasing the tax returns. I guess he has nothing to hide then.

Either it's deep monetary ties to Russia or as mark Cuban suggested he has less income than the Clintons paid in taxes.

sir_eccles Jul 27th 2016 3:24 am

Re: 2016 Election
 

Originally Posted by morpeth (Post 12013410)
I think it is obvious she had advantages in being Bill's wife that helped her get to be Senator, Secretary of State and now the nominee of the democratic party, and obviously as Bill Clinton so well portrayed last night she has accomplished things in her life.

The issue to me about Clinton is that she is part of a general mindset that doesn't get that the policies and trends of the last few decades have led us to this situation, and more of the same will contribute to further decline.

Define decline. Do you mean the decline in unemployment? The decline in crime? The rise in the Dow? What precisely is declining?

zargof Jul 27th 2016 3:39 am

Re: 2016 Election
 

Originally Posted by morpeth (Post 12013377)
Sane platform ? The country has serious economic and national security issues, hardly does the platform of either party offer solutions to change the trend in decline. I have run businesses and have studied economics, Clinton's professed policies as far as I can see offer more regulations, more taxes and more expense to business- hardly a recipe for significant economic growth. Trump makes bold statements and certainly understands more about creating jobs but his rather vague presentation of how he would turn the economy around doesn't seem too coherent.

What a terrible choice for the American people this November.

If you have actually studied economics, then you should know about optimal tax theory, and right now taxes in the US are far below the optimum.

Citing more taxes and more regulation as stifling economic growth is right wing bullshit. Reducing income inequality and giving the middle class and the poor a larger share of GDP means they have more money to spend in the economy which drives more growth.

magnumpi Jul 27th 2016 3:43 am

Re: 2016 Election
 

Originally Posted by Jerseygirl (Post 12013385)
She is an accomplished, intelligent woman...no doubt about it and she would have done well without Bill. However I do not believe she would have been a senator, Secretary Of State or the Democratic nominee without him. He has the personality/charisma...she has the personality of a dead fish...he is very likeable...she is generally unlikeable. Bill pulled strings and called in favours to get her to this point.

Yup, behind every great women there is a guy pulling a few strings,;) (exception being Thatch)

Jerseygirl Jul 27th 2016 4:48 am

Re: 2016 Election
 

Originally Posted by magnumpi (Post 12013450)
Yup, behind every great women there is a guy pulling a few strings,;) (exception being Thatch)

In fairness I believe that Bill would not be where he is today if it were not for her.

One time when she was in Arkansas filing up with gas...a guy said to her something like...'if it wasn't for your husband you would be living in the apartment above this gas station.' Her reply was 'If it wasn't for me he would be working at the gas station.'

Nutmegger Jul 27th 2016 5:00 am

Re: 2016 Election
 

Originally Posted by Jerseygirl (Post 12013500)
In fairness I believe that Bill would not be where he is today if it were not for her.

One time when she was in Arkansas filing up with gas...a guy said to her something like...'if it wasn't for your husband you would be living in the apartment above this gas station.' Her reply was 'If it wasn't for me he would be working at the gas station.'


Good one! It will be interesting to see what Michelle Obama does post-White House -- she's another extremely smart woman who needs to stand in no man's shadow. I believe she hopes to extend her advocacy for the education of girls around the world.

sir_eccles Jul 27th 2016 5:02 am

Re: 2016 Election
 
The media keep talking about a demographic which is very strongly anti Hillary and pro Trump. White men without college degrees.

I was thinking about this in the car this morning. I get the feeling that this is a demographic that won't be switched no matter what. I feel it is based more on sexism than anything else. Sort of like the men's rights activists who get upset when Ghostbusters is remade with women in the lead roles. This sounds like a group of men for whom it was bad enough a black man is in the White house now they would have to take orders from a woman.

Should Hillary even try to sway them?

dc koop Jul 27th 2016 5:23 am

Re: 2016 Election
 

Originally Posted by Jerseygirl (Post 12013500)
In fairness I believe that Bill would not be where he is today if it were not for her.

One time when she was in Arkansas filing up with gas...a guy said to her something like...'if it wasn't for your husband you would be living in the apartment above this gas station.' Her reply was 'If it wasn't for me he would be working at the gas station.'

I don't suppose it meant much then that Bill Clinton won a a Rhodes Scholarship long before he met Hillary

zargof Jul 27th 2016 5:30 am

Re: 2016 Election
 

Originally Posted by sir_eccles (Post 12013515)
The media keep talking about a demographic which is very strongly anti Hillary and pro Trump. White men without college degrees.

I was thinking about this in the car this morning. I get the feeling that this is a demographic that won't be switched no matter what. I feel it is based more on sexism than anything else. Sort of like the men's rights activists who get upset when Ghostbusters is remade with women in the lead roles. This sounds like a group of men for whom it was bad enough a black man is in the White house now they would have to take orders from a woman.

Should Hillary even try to sway them?

I agree, and no, I don't think Hillary is going to have much success winning their votes. She needs to focus on winning women and minorities. That's part of why I think picking a white guy as VP was a mistake.

Jerseygirl Jul 27th 2016 5:33 am

Re: 2016 Election
 

Originally Posted by dc koop (Post 12013525)
I don't suppose it meant much then that Bill Clinton won a a Rhodes Scholarship long before he met Hillary

Don't be silly...surely you can get the subtle meaning of what she meant? Personally I thought it was a great comeback reply...funny too.

sir_eccles Jul 27th 2016 5:35 am

Re: 2016 Election
 

Originally Posted by zargof (Post 12013533)
I agree, and no, I don't think Hillary is going to have much success winning their votes. She needs to focus on winning women and minorities. That's part of why I think picking a white guy as VP was a mistake.

Maybe, but reading Kaine's bio he seems to have a broad appeal. Being a strong Catholic who worships in a black church would probably draw a good chunk of that church going African American population.

SultanOfSwing Jul 27th 2016 5:36 am

Re: 2016 Election
 

Originally Posted by sir_eccles (Post 12013515)
The media keep talking about a demographic which is very strongly anti Hillary and pro Trump. White men without college degrees.

I was thinking about this in the car this morning. I get the feeling that this is a demographic that won't be switched no matter what. I feel it is based more on sexism than anything else. Sort of like the men's rights activists who get upset when Ghostbusters is remade with women in the lead roles. This sounds like a group of men for whom it was bad enough a black man is in the White house now they would have to take orders from a woman.

Should Hillary even try to sway them?

As a white man without a college degree, I'd love to know what the clucking bell the media is on about there :lol:

Then again, I am from a country who is now on their second female Prime Minister so women in power isn't exactly a unique idea for me either.

zargof Jul 27th 2016 5:42 am

Re: 2016 Election
 

Originally Posted by sir_eccles (Post 12013540)
Maybe, but reading Kaine's bio he seems to have a broad appeal. Being a strong Catholic who worships in a black church would probably draw a good chunk of that church going African American population.

True, and him being bilingual should help with Hispanics. But will low information voters see any of this, or will he just be the white guy?

morpeth Jul 27th 2016 6:00 am

Re: 2016 Election
 

Originally Posted by zargof (Post 12013448)
If you have actually studied economics, then you should know about optimal tax theory, and right now taxes in the US are far below the optimum.

Citing more taxes and more regulation as stifling economic growth is right wing bullshit. Reducing income inequality and giving the middle class and the poor a larger share of GDP means they have more money to spend in the economy which drives more growth.

Questioning the veracity of someone posting on the this site, and using words such as "right wing" bullshit" hardly indicate an open mind to consider different points of view.

It is obvious if one increase taxes on business and regulation that doesn't help a business to expand and grow, and doesn't help keep more jobs in the country.

It is just as obvious that if there are 40 million people on food stamps, including those with full time jobs, the economy is in a mess. JI do think some dramatic changes should be made. For example, why have limits on income that bears social security tax- why not increase the limit on higher income earners, and use that revenue to give credits to those making under $50,000 ? Why endanger Obamacare through out of control medical costs- maybe time for regulation ( I am not against all regulation) of medical industry similar to that of utility companies ? It is outrageous the cost of medical care.

But regulation especially senseless regulation is a real problem. I ran one business for 10 years and regulation was a major barrier to expansion, and we also had operations in Mexico where we had government support such that we never had in the USA.


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