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Old Jul 23rd 2015 | 7:16 am
  #721  
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Default Re: 2016 Election

Originally Posted by CelticRover
I only saw a bit of that, but what I didn't see mentioned is that there are a lot of undecideds in those numbers.

She's not a stellar candidate in many respects, but there is a lot of play in those numbers. And it is wise for her side to hold back until they know which GOP candidates are most likely to win. It wouldn't be smart to position herself now against candidates who don't end up as true contenders, only to change messages later.
 
Old Jul 23rd 2015 | 7:55 am
  #722  
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Default Re: 2016 Election

Originally Posted by FlaviusAetius
Watch the Left's money flood into The Donald's campaign chest for a 3rd Party run if Jeb or Marco gets the nod. Didn't we see that in Kansas with the so-called Independent's (an alleged TEA party guy) run last election?
Not really. Orman ran as an independent, but was in no way a "tea party" clown. The Democratic candidate then withdrew because they believed Orman had a better chance of unseating the Republican incumbent. So although it's true that an independent got Democratic money, that was only because there was no Democratic candidate in the general election.

Oh, and I see the "tea party experiment" in Kansas has come a little unstuck...

Trump's threats to run as an independent are likely merely a reaction to the hostility he's getting from some quarters of the Republican Party: "back off or I'll run as an independent".

Last edited by Giantaxe; Jul 23rd 2015 at 7:57 am.
 
Old Jul 23rd 2015 | 8:06 am
  #723  
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Default Re: 2016 Election

Originally Posted by RoadWarriorFromLP
I only saw a bit of that, but what I didn't see mentioned is that there are a lot of undecideds in those numbers.

She's not a stellar candidate in many respects, but there is a lot of play in those numbers. And it is wise for her side to hold back until they know which GOP candidates are most likely to win. It wouldn't be smart to position herself now against candidates who don't end up as true contenders, only to change messages later.
This is just the beginning of a long, drawn out, political reality show, with the myriad of candidates shuffling for position and firing for effect, in the very early stages. The polls will rise and fall along the way for everyone, depending how the wind is blowing any particular day and most people will withdraw along the way.
Some factors which might make it different, is the overwhelming number of voters who have nothing but contempt for Washington and would desperately like to see change. With ostensible opposites like Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump in the race, it should prove to be interesting and entertaining.
 
Old Jul 23rd 2015 | 8:10 am
  #724  
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Default Re: 2016 Election

Originally Posted by Giantaxe
Trump's threats to run as an independent are likely merely a reaction to the hostility he's getting from some quarters of the Republican Party: "back off or I'll run as an independent".
Why are they so hostile? Is it because he's popular with Republican voters or is it because he's torn down the curtain to reveal the Republican mindset without the usual code words and dog whistles?

I see now he has come out and said that the Government shouldn't be profiting from student loans. With that and his support for universal healthcare, has Fox News called him a socialist yet?
 
Old Jul 23rd 2015 | 8:25 am
  #725  
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Default Re: 2016 Election

Originally Posted by zargof
Why are they so hostile? Is it because he's popular with Republican voters or is it because he's torn down the curtain to reveal the Republican mindset without the usual code words and dog whistles?

I see now he has come out and said that the Government shouldn't be profiting from student loans. With that and his support for universal healthcare, has Fox News called him a socialist yet?
The truth, as Trump sees it, must be very disturbing to the Old Boys' Club, privileged way of life.

 
Old Jul 23rd 2015 | 8:33 am
  #726  
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Default Re: 2016 Election

Originally Posted by CelticRover
This is just the beginning of a long, drawn out, political reality show, with the myriad of candidates shuffling for position and firing for effect, in the very early stages. The polls will rise and fall along the way for everyone, depending how the wind is blowing any particular day and most people will withdraw along the way.
Some factors which might make it different, is the overwhelming number of voters who have nothing but contempt for Washington and would desperately like to see change. With ostensible opposites like Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump in the race, it should prove to be interesting and entertaining.
At this point, one of the basic issues is that the Republicans are now running, while she isn't. The other is that Sanders is there to split the polling results. When he drops out, she will pick up at least some, if not most of his support.
 
Old Jul 23rd 2015 | 9:00 am
  #727  
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Default Re: 2016 Election

Originally Posted by RoadWarriorFromLP
At this point, one of the basic issues is that the Republicans are now running, while she isn't. The other is that Sanders is there to split the polling results. When he drops out, she will pick up at least some, if not most of his support.
I wonder what would happen if neither Trump or Sanders dropped out and we ended up with a 4 horse race (Dem, GOP and two independents).
 
Old Jul 23rd 2015 | 9:14 am
  #728  
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Default Re: 2016 Election

Originally Posted by sir_eccles
I wonder what would happen if neither Trump or Sanders dropped out and we ended up with a 4 horse race (Dem, GOP and two independents).
In November 2016, the US will have 51 presidential elections, 49 of which will be winner-take-all.

The more powerful independent would ruin it for his side of the political aisle by splitting the vote. If there was some sort of electoral vote tie (highly unlikely), then we would have a Republican president because the House will cast the vote.

I doubt that Trump has staying power. If it was a two-choice universe between Trump and Sanders going the distance, then I would bet on Sanders staying in.
 
Old Jul 23rd 2015 | 5:27 pm
  #729  
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Default Re: 2016 Election

Is Trump loud enough to distract from another mass shooting?


Spoiler:
In case it gets deleted

 
Old Jul 24th 2015 | 2:19 am
  #730  
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Default Re: 2016 Election

Looks like Clinton's email problem may not go away easily...
Hillary Clinton's email could become a criminal matter – report | US news | The Guardian
 
Old Jul 25th 2015 | 12:01 pm
  #731  
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Default Re: 2016 Election

Originally Posted by FlaviusAetius
Another Ross Perot? Proof he's a Hillary plant.
I saw a long rant by Rachel Maddows (who I never normally watch, even though I'm on the same side as her) saying that the conventional wisdom - that Ross Perot helped the Democrats - is completely false. She said that exit polls taken during that election showed that 38% would have voted Republican had they not voted for Ross, and 38% said they would have voted Democrat. The rest said they would not have voted.

How true that is I don't know but she was quite adamant

But still ... Run, Donald, Run! I don't think he has much appeal at all on the left, so Donald really could help the Democrats. Ross was more 'reasonable' as I recall ...
 
Old Jul 25th 2015 | 12:07 pm
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Default Re: 2016 Election

Originally Posted by RoadWarriorFromLP
At this point, one of the basic issues is that the Republicans are now running, while she isn't.....
Confused ...
 
Old Jul 25th 2015 | 12:50 pm
  #733  
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Default Re: 2016 Election

Originally Posted by Steerpike
Confused ...
For now, she is keeping the campaigning to a minimum. Which she should, given the circumstances.
 
Old Jul 25th 2015 | 1:20 pm
  #734  
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Default Re: 2016 Election

Originally Posted by RoadWarriorFromLP
For now, she is keeping the campaigning to a minimum. Which she should, given the circumstances.
Indeed - why not! Let the rest of them destroy each other. Bernie just isn't a serious threat, so she can just sit back and save her money and energy for the ensuing battle.
 
Old Jul 26th 2015 | 3:30 am
  #735  
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Default Re: 2016 Election

Originally Posted by Steerpike
Indeed - why not! Let the rest of them destroy each other. Bernie just isn't a serious threat, so she can just sit back and save her money and energy for the ensuing battle.
Part of the issue that she doesn't know who the opposition will be, and her message will be shaped in large part by who the opposition is. So she needs to hang back for that reason alone.

I suspect that fears of Hillary Fatigue are another concern. This is a marathon, not a sprint.

Ultimately, Sanders will be an asset to Clinton. His job will be to get progressives to put their momentum behind her, and he could help with Democratic turnout.

Along those lines, I suspect that her polling numbers will get worse before they get better. The media pundits will make a big deal about it, but it doesn't much much for now. If she can't recover during early to mid-2016 or so, then that's when she'll need to start worrying.

Last edited by RoadWarriorFromLP; Jul 26th 2015 at 3:32 am.
 


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