2016 Election
Mar 11th 2016, 4:07 am
#5701
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Dec 2006
Location: Nova Scotia Canada
Posts: 27,078
Mar 11th 2016, 4:08 am
#5702
Banned
Joined: Feb 2016
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 348
Re: 2016 Election
Fox is both magazine and news channel, throughout the day it reports the news, i.e. what is happening in the world. Towards the evening it shifts to opinion based programming and this is the part people get wound up at and incorrectly judge the entirety of fox news on
Mar 11th 2016, 4:09 am
#5703
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Nov 2007
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 13,270
Re: 2016 Election
As someone who regularly watches Fox, I find this stereotype about it really quite tiresome and terribly smug. I also watch CNN and their bias for the other side is just as bad, every night Rachel Maddow conducts a party political broadcast on behalf of the Dems but no one makes disparaging comments about the intelligence of their viewership
I happen to be watching Fox right now, and they are saying that 'Kasich is boring' and that the candidates 'blew their chances to derail Trump' last night (in other words, the 'civil' debate was a mistake in their minds).
Mar 11th 2016, 4:27 am
#5704
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Nov 2007
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 13,270
Re: 2016 Election
According to this article from 2014
"The Department of Labor reports that of the 2.5 million farm workers in the U.S., over half (53 percent) are illegal immigrants. Growers and labor unions put this figure at 70 percent."
So that's a little more than 10% to over 15% of undocumented workers.
Illegal immigrants benefit the U.S. economy | TheHill
I'd add one more question: can you tell us what percentage are paying US income, sales, Social Security and Medicare taxes?
"The Department of Labor reports that of the 2.5 million farm workers in the U.S., over half (53 percent) are illegal immigrants. Growers and labor unions put this figure at 70 percent."
So that's a little more than 10% to over 15% of undocumented workers.
Illegal immigrants benefit the U.S. economy | TheHill
I'd add one more question: can you tell us what percentage are paying US income, sales, Social Security and Medicare taxes?
An estimated 3 million work in agriculture. As for the rest of your post...yes...there are a number of jobs you mentioned that could be filled by Americans but put the blame where it belongs...on the businesses that employ them and encourage the situation. I am not about to dump on desperate people who have often been lured to the country by agents of companies who want such workers. Until the government gets serious about clamping down on those companies with stiff fines and jail time for multiple offenses..the problem will remain.
As for benefits...I think you will find that without proof ef legal status they are nye impossible to come by.
As for benefits...I think you will find that without proof ef legal status they are nye impossible to come by.
Facebook post says "less than 2 percent of illegals are picking crops, but 41 percent are on welfare" | PolitiFact
I don't know if 'politifact' is considered a reasonable source of info or not.
They actually state that only about 2% of illegals work in agriculture, which surprised me, and - while debunking the '41%' figure, provide some insight into how a family with an illegal member could be receiving some benefits (children in a household might be citizens by birth, and thus, receive benefits, which thus feeds the rhetoric that a household headed by an illegal may get benefits).
For those who (like me) were confused by the topic, the issue of farm workers, illegals, and percentages is this ... we are talking about
1) what percentage of illegals work in agriculture, and
2) what percentage of agricultural workers are illegals
They are two different stats.
Mar 11th 2016, 4:36 am
#5706
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Jan 2006
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 12,894
Re: 2016 Election
Take a look at this article and let me know what you think.
Facebook post says "less than 2 percent of illegals are picking crops, but 41 percent are on welfare" | PolitiFact
Facebook post says "less than 2 percent of illegals are picking crops, but 41 percent are on welfare" | PolitiFact
Mar 11th 2016, 4:37 am
#5707
I love my brick!
Joined: May 2007
Location: Peachy
Posts: 9,304
Re: 2016 Election
Here's Donald Trump helping to shore up Latino support again...
Mar 11th 2016, 4:50 am
#5708
Account Closed
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 0
Re: 2016 Election
Unless in Vancouver or Toronto metro areas housing can be had pretty cheap. You can get houses in Winnipeg for under 200k that are decent. Same with Atlantic Canada.
2 regions push up the averages, Metro Vancouver and Toronto Metro area so the averages are skewed.
Biggest factors in higher prices is exchange rates especially with food since most produce for example is imported and paid for in USD.
Other biggest factor is small population spread over several thousand kilometers which brings up transportation and distribution costs.
Obviously the volume of 310 million brings down costs there as does a stronger currency.
Bring in the fact we dont have to pay hundreds a month for insurance for medical and you can end up a head here or maintain the same quality of life.
We could never maintain the same quality of live down there, healthcare alone would eat up all our disposable income not to mention we would earn less.
Point is prices for things like fast food isnt much higer, nor are hotel rooms and other places people claimed earlier would cost huge amounts if wages were raised.
Booze is heavily taxed and controlled by the govt so has nothing to do with wages.
Ditto for smokes.
[QUOTE=themadpooper;11892863]
2 regions push up the averages, Metro Vancouver and Toronto Metro area so the averages are skewed.
Biggest factors in higher prices is exchange rates especially with food since most produce for example is imported and paid for in USD.
Other biggest factor is small population spread over several thousand kilometers which brings up transportation and distribution costs.
Obviously the volume of 310 million brings down costs there as does a stronger currency.
Bring in the fact we dont have to pay hundreds a month for insurance for medical and you can end up a head here or maintain the same quality of life.
We could never maintain the same quality of live down there, healthcare alone would eat up all our disposable income not to mention we would earn less.
Point is prices for things like fast food isnt much higer, nor are hotel rooms and other places people claimed earlier would cost huge amounts if wages were raised.
Booze is heavily taxed and controlled by the govt so has nothing to do with wages.
Ditto for smokes.
[QUOTE=themadpooper;11892863]
We have higher wages in Canada and yes we do pay more for some things but nothing what you describe.
Last hotel I was at paid 13/14 per hour to start and our average rate was only 80 to 100 per night.
Fast food pays anywhere from 11 to 13 to start and prices are not much higher then in WA state.
Min wage in BC is 10.40hr but many places have to pay more due to market demands.
We manage not to have to rely on cheap cheap illegal labor and still function.
Sorry but Canada is a monumental rip off compared to America; the cost of stuff is astronomical
Gas, beer, food in general, the average mortgage. It's not even close
Last hotel I was at paid 13/14 per hour to start and our average rate was only 80 to 100 per night.
Fast food pays anywhere from 11 to 13 to start and prices are not much higher then in WA state.
Min wage in BC is 10.40hr but many places have to pay more due to market demands.
We manage not to have to rely on cheap cheap illegal labor and still function.
Sorry but Canada is a monumental rip off compared to America; the cost of stuff is astronomical
Gas, beer, food in general, the average mortgage. It's not even close
Mar 11th 2016, 5:12 am
#5709
Account Closed
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 2
Re: 2016 Election
An estimated 3 million work in agriculture. As for the rest of your post...yes...there are a number of jobs you mentioned that could be filled by Americans but put the blame where it belongs...on the businesses that employ them and encourage the situation. I am not about to dump on desperate people who have often been lured to the country by agents of companies who want such workers. Until the government gets serious about clamping down on those companies with stiff fines and jail time for multiple offenses..the problem will remain.
As for benefits...I think you will find that without proof ef legal status they are nye impossible to come by.
As for benefits...I think you will find that without proof ef legal status they are nye impossible to come by.
Some may have taken that number to be those employed illegally.
In 2012, there were 3.2 million farmers,[19] ranchers and other agricultural managers and an estimated 757,900 agricultural workers were legally employed in the US. Animal breeders accounted for 11,500 of those workers with the rest categorized as miscellaneous agricultural workers. The median pay was $9.12 per hour or $18,970 per year.[20] In 2009, about 519,000 people under age 20 worked on farms owned by their family. In addition to the youth who lived on family farms, an additional 230,000 youth were employed in agriculture.[21] In 2004, women made up approximately 24% of farmers; that year, there were 580,000 women employed in agriculture, forestry, and fishing
Mar 11th 2016, 5:36 am
#5710
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Dec 2006
Location: Nova Scotia Canada
Posts: 27,078
Mar 11th 2016, 5:38 am
#5711
Banned
Joined: Feb 2016
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 348
Re: 2016 Election
Unless in Vancouver or Toronto metro areas housing can be had pretty cheap. You can get houses in Winnipeg for under 200k that are decent. Same with Atlantic Canada.
2 regions push up the averages, Metro Vancouver and Toronto Metro area so the averages are skewed.
Biggest factors in higher prices is exchange rates especially with food since most produce for example is imported and paid for in USD.
Other biggest factor is small population spread over several thousand kilometers which brings up transportation and distribution costs.
Obviously the volume of 310 million brings down costs there as does a stronger currency.
Bring in the fact we dont have to pay hundreds a month for insurance for medical and you can end up a head here or maintain the same quality of life.
We could never maintain the same quality of live down there, healthcare alone would eat up all our disposable income not to mention we would earn less.
Point is prices for things like fast food isnt much higer, nor are hotel rooms and other places people claimed earlier would cost huge amounts if wages were raised.
Booze is heavily taxed and controlled by the govt so has nothing to do with wages.
Ditto for smokes.
2 regions push up the averages, Metro Vancouver and Toronto Metro area so the averages are skewed.
Biggest factors in higher prices is exchange rates especially with food since most produce for example is imported and paid for in USD.
Other biggest factor is small population spread over several thousand kilometers which brings up transportation and distribution costs.
Obviously the volume of 310 million brings down costs there as does a stronger currency.
Bring in the fact we dont have to pay hundreds a month for insurance for medical and you can end up a head here or maintain the same quality of life.
We could never maintain the same quality of live down there, healthcare alone would eat up all our disposable income not to mention we would earn less.
Point is prices for things like fast food isnt much higer, nor are hotel rooms and other places people claimed earlier would cost huge amounts if wages were raised.
Booze is heavily taxed and controlled by the govt so has nothing to do with wages.
Ditto for smokes.
As for healthcare, I'd rather pay my insurance premiums and get 1st class treatment versus chancing my luck on Canadian waiting lists
Ultimately, Canada is for people who can't get into America, that's why so many Brits end up there. Bit like Australia in that respect. It's also yet to fully cut the colonial apron strings so is like the UK on a lot of the things, the cost of living being the most obvious one. Terrible beer another. Terrible TV another. The list goes on
Mar 11th 2016, 5:43 am
#5712
Account Closed
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 2
Re: 2016 Election
According to Pew 4% work in Agriculture, so if its 3 million, well you do the maths.
Mar 11th 2016, 5:43 am
#5713
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Dec 2006
Location: Nova Scotia Canada
Posts: 27,078
Re: 2016 Election
Thanks for eventually agreeing with me it's expensive. America has lots of expensive places, also. NYC is only 2nd to London as most expensive city in the world, go down to Florida though and you can get a 3 bed house in a gated community for 200 grand
As for healthcare, I'd rather pay my insurance premiums and get 1st class treatment versus chancing my luck on Canadian waiting lists
Ultimately, Canada is for people who can't get into America, that's why so many Brits end up there. Bit like Australia in that respect. It's also yet to fully cut the colonial apron strings so is like the UK on a lot of the things, the cost of living being the most obvious one. Terrible beer another. Terrible TV another. The list goes on
As for healthcare, I'd rather pay my insurance premiums and get 1st class treatment versus chancing my luck on Canadian waiting lists
Ultimately, Canada is for people who can't get into America, that's why so many Brits end up there. Bit like Australia in that respect. It's also yet to fully cut the colonial apron strings so is like the UK on a lot of the things, the cost of living being the most obvious one. Terrible beer another. Terrible TV another. The list goes on
Mar 11th 2016, 6:02 am
#5714
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Dec 2006
Location: Nova Scotia Canada
Posts: 27,078
Re: 2016 Election
Take a look at this article and let me know what you think.
Facebook post says "less than 2 percent of illegals are picking crops, but 41 percent are on welfare" | PolitiFact
I don't know if 'politifact' is considered a reasonable source of info or not.
They actually state that only about 2% of illegals work in agriculture, which surprised me, and - while debunking the '41%' figure, provide some insight into how a family with an illegal member could be receiving some benefits (children in a household might be citizens by birth, and thus, receive benefits, which thus feeds the rhetoric that a household headed by an illegal may get benefits).
For those who (like me) were confused by the topic, the issue of farm workers, illegals, and percentages is this ... we are talking about
1) what percentage of illegals work in agriculture, and
2) what percentage of agricultural workers are illegals
They are two different stats.
Facebook post says "less than 2 percent of illegals are picking crops, but 41 percent are on welfare" | PolitiFact
I don't know if 'politifact' is considered a reasonable source of info or not.
They actually state that only about 2% of illegals work in agriculture, which surprised me, and - while debunking the '41%' figure, provide some insight into how a family with an illegal member could be receiving some benefits (children in a household might be citizens by birth, and thus, receive benefits, which thus feeds the rhetoric that a household headed by an illegal may get benefits).
For those who (like me) were confused by the topic, the issue of farm workers, illegals, and percentages is this ... we are talking about
1) what percentage of illegals work in agriculture, and
2) what percentage of agricultural workers are illegals
They are two different stats.
Was going to post this on Boilers post..lbut just as good here. First paragraph specifically says they do not do a count of crop pickers..who by the way, make up a huge portion of undocumented agriculture workers. Second paragraph says that for regular farm workers 1.2 to 1.75 million are illegals. Hopefully that settles it.
Total Population of Farmworkers The NAWS does not count the number of crop workers or other farmworkers in the United States. There are an estimated 2.5 million farmworkers laboring on our nation’s farms and ranches, cultivating and harvesting crops and raising and tending to livestock.2 Immigration Status and Nationality According to the NAWS, approximately 48% of farmworkers lack work authorization. However, this estimate may be low due to a variety of factors.3 Some sources estimate that as much as 70% or more of the workforce is undocumented.4 Using these estimates, roughly 1.2 million to 1.75 million farmworkers are undocumented and roughly 750,000 to 1.3 million farmworkers are United States citizens or lawful immigrants. According to the NAWS, about 33% of farmworkers are United States citizens, 18% are lawful permanent residents and another 1% have other work authorization.
Mar 11th 2016, 6:19 am
#5715
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Nov 2007
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 13,270
Re: 2016 Election
Try finding insurance in the private (not group/employer provided) market, pre-ACA, if you had a pre-existing condition. If you could find it at all, you'd be paying astronomical premiums and get lots of exclusions on coverage.
