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Where is everyone?

Where is everyone?

Old Aug 16th 2021, 6:40 pm
  #16  
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Default Re: Where is everyone?

Originally Posted by Stingychips
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/why-brits-are-buying-holiday-homes-again-on-the-costa-del-sol-fvcrdwz9
Brexit won’t stop Brits residing in Spain. A strong pound and sky high property prices in the UK. When Covid settles and Boris fully allows for Brits to fly in and out without having to isolate. It’s cheaper nowadays to go on holiday in Spain than it is to have a holiday in the UK.
Brexit will stop people residing in Spain if they don't meet the minimum income criteria. Of course Brits will still take holidays in Spain but many will find the third country residency process a nightmare. Is that why you are applying for an Irish passport?

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Last edited by Lou71; Aug 16th 2021 at 6:44 pm.
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Old Aug 16th 2021, 6:50 pm
  #17  
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Default Re: Where is everyone?

Originally Posted by DLC
If you want to read the whole article, here it is without the paywall.

It says upmarket areas have more interest, cheaper areas less interest from Brits, the guy who's wife had cancer probably still hasn't worked out healthcare costs after Brexit, and it finishes by listing three expensive houses at the bottom of the article.

In other words, those people who don't have half a million in the bank burning a hole in their pocket are going to miss freedom of movement and from now on these "place in the sun" stories are just going to focus on those people who can afford it. It sucks to be young, poor, and interested in Spain for reasons which go beyond it having a hot ball of fire in the sky though.
Agreed. Brexit closes doors for the vast majority of people, it doesn't open them. UK nationals with a modest income/pension from the UK could easily move to Spain and support themselves but Brexit has taken that opportunity away from them.
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Old Aug 17th 2021, 7:39 am
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Default Re: Where is everyone?

Originally Posted by Lou71
Brexit will stop people residing in Spain if they don't meet the minimum income criteria. Of course Brits will still take holidays in Spain but many will find the third country residency process a nightmare. Is that why you are applying for an Irish passport?

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There is no criteria for rocking up in Spain and buying a house. Or even renting. Which is what the Brits are doing. As it’s still cheaper to do that than it is to even get a caravan in the UK these days.
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Old Aug 17th 2021, 8:11 am
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Default Re: Where is everyone?

Whilst there's no criteria to rock up and buy, there's the personal criteria of having cash in the bank. Someone without the cash or a substantial wedge of cash isn't getting a Spanish mortgage and getting a loan from the UK is pretty hard unless you're remortgaging a UK house to pay for the Spanish house. The old school of expat early retired renters generally didn't have much in the way of fluid capital. As already mentioned, the high end of the market is fine for expats for those reasons.

There are 3 main types of buyer; holiday home owner, investor and full time expat. The first is usually financially secure and buys a house or higher end apartment without a loan, the second is looking at looking at high returns on rent and third is looking for somewhere to live with a mortgage. The category that's disappearring is the investor who bit off more than they could chew by buying a holiday home and trying to make ends meet with holiday rentals.

Back to the original question, the big cities have large expat communities but as mentioned they are mostly of working age. The Brit enclaves are dotted around the country depending on their interests; golf, sun, cheap wine, A Place in the Sun, anything but Boris a peaceful life close enough to pop over the the UK to visit family.

As for the areas, I would suggest searching for areas that appeal to you and take several winter holidays then rent in your favourite for a year. For me, Valenica is ideal as it has the city, the beach, the mountains and flight schedules for the places I regularly visit. I'm not interested in golf, curry nights, Sunday roasts or liver damage but it's also close to places that specialise in those pastimes.
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Old Aug 17th 2021, 8:56 am
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Default Re: Where is everyone?

Originally Posted by SanNico
Whilst there's no criteria to rock up and buy, there's the personal criteria of having cash in the bank. Someone without the cash or a substantial wedge of cash isn't getting a Spanish mortgage and getting a loan from the UK is pretty hard unless you're remortgaging a UK house to pay for the Spanish house. The old school of expat early retired renters generally didn't have much in the way of fluid capital. As already mentioned, the high end of the market is fine for expats for those reasons.

There are 3 main types of buyer; holiday home owner, investor and full time expat. The first is usually financially secure and buys a house or higher end apartment without a loan, the second is looking at looking at high returns on rent and third is looking for somewhere to live with a mortgage. The category that's disappearring is the investor who bit off more than they could chew by buying a holiday home and trying to make ends meet with holiday rentals.

Back to the original question, the big cities have large expat communities but as mentioned they are mostly of working age. The Brit enclaves are dotted around the country depending on their interests; golf, sun, cheap wine, A Place in the Sun, anything but Boris a peaceful life close enough to pop over the the UK to visit family.

As for the areas, I would suggest searching for areas that appeal to you and take several winter holidays then rent in your favourite for a year. For me, Valenica is ideal as it has the city, the beach, the mountains and flight schedules for the places I regularly visit. I'm not interested in golf, curry nights, Sunday roasts or liver damage but it's also close to places that specialise in those pastimes.
You don’t need to be a big earner to own property or rent in Spain. My friend has just had to fork out £1200 for a weeks stay for a caravan in Devon. You can rent a 4 bedroom flat in Spain for £300 a month. It’s peanuts. I bought my house out right it was that cheap. Needs a bit of work but still it’s 20 times cheaper than it would have been if it was in England. That’s why Brits will continue to buy , rent and stay in Spain.
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Old Aug 17th 2021, 9:31 am
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Default Re: Where is everyone?

Originally Posted by Stingychips
You don’t need to be a big earner to own property or rent in Spain. My friend has just had to fork out £1200 for a weeks stay for a caravan in Devon. You can rent a 4 bedroom flat in Spain for £300 a month. It’s peanuts. I bought my house out right it was that cheap. Needs a bit of work but still it’s 20 times cheaper than it would have been if it was in England. That’s why Brits will continue to buy , rent and stay in Spain.
That's the point, you bought it outright and you're not a resident so don't need to meet any requirement. I very much doubt anyone would get a Spanish mortgage to buy a Spanish property as an holiday home and the only way around it is to remortgage a UK property and use the proceeds. Our bank wouldn't entertain a mortgage until we had the account and residency for over 1 year and 30% deposit despite being well over the national income requirements for residency and having overseas assets. Renting for a holiday is very different to renting to live, unless you go the AirBnB or cash route which is only suitable for holidays and living under the radar. We had to prove income, employment status, show bank statements, have NIE, give a 2 month deposit etc..

Brits can't stay permanently in Spain unless they meet the requirements. The likelihood of someone renting a 300 Euro flat meeting those requirements are slim.

Where are you seeing 4 bedroom flats for 300/month and are they habitable? You can add a zero for that in a lot of places.
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Old Aug 17th 2021, 9:34 am
  #22  
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Default Re: Where is everyone?

Originally Posted by Lou71
Why on earth would people who are established in Spain and own a property go back to the UK because of Covid? The British people I am referring to left Spain before Covid kicked in and they will not be replaced because of Brexit. Spain have run an excellent vaccine programme and have now overtaken the UK. They have also been vaccinating non residents.

However, ​I do agree that future looks very bleak in the UK.
Spain has now a 1% lead over the UK on single vaccination but is behind on the full vaccination programme IIRC. Here in the UK if you want the jab you can have it and youngsters are next on the list to be vaccinated so its more the case of getting people off their bums and going for vaccination more than Spain having a better programme.

Economic growth ratings put the UK 5th and Spain 14th so can you expand on whats 'bleak' for the UK?
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Old Aug 17th 2021, 9:48 am
  #23  
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Default Re: Where is everyone?

Originally Posted by Stingychips
You don’t need to be a big earner to own property or rent in Spain. My friend has just had to fork out £1200 for a weeks stay for a caravan in Devon. You can rent a 4 bedroom flat in Spain for £300 a month. It’s peanuts. I bought my house out right it was that cheap. Needs a bit of work but still it’s 20 times cheaper than it would have been if it was in England. That’s why Brits will continue to buy , rent and stay in Spain.
Quote...."You can rent a 4 bedroom flat in Spain for £300 a month"

I think you are exaggerating a little bit there...unless it's a dump in the middle of nowhere.

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Old Aug 17th 2021, 10:07 am
  #24  
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Default Re: Where is everyone?

Originally Posted by SanNico
That's the point, you bought it outright and you're not a resident so don't need to meet any requirement. I very much doubt anyone would get a Spanish mortgage to buy a Spanish property as an holiday home and the only way around it is to remortgage a UK property and use the proceeds. Our bank wouldn't entertain a mortgage until we had the account and residency for over 1 year and 30% deposit despite being well over the national income requirements for residency and having overseas assets. Renting for a holiday is very different to renting to live, unless you go the AirBnB or cash route which is only suitable for holidays and living under the radar. We had to prove income, employment status, show bank statements, have NIE, give a 2 month deposit etc..

Brits can't stay permanently in Spain unless they meet the requirements. The likelihood of someone renting a 300 Euro flat meeting those requirements are slim.

Where are you seeing 4 bedroom flats for 300/month and are they habitable? You can add a zero for that in a lot of places.
As long as you have the required deposit, It is still possible to get a mortgage as a non resident and this still seems to be the case:

For GBP earners wanting a fixed rate, there are only a few banks we can approach. One of these usually insists on the client taking out a single-premium life cover policy, which many clients don’t like. Also, for British clients only, the same lender has reduced the maximum debt-to-income level from 35% to 20% and they have also reduced maximum borrowing for British clients from 70% to 60%. The result is that far fewer British clients can now qualify for a mortgage with this lender.

Despite the increased difficulty of qualifying with the above lender, for a standard enquiry and loan of around €200.000 the fixed rates are still very attractive at 2.15% fixed for 20 years, for example. Another bank offering fixed rates to British clients does not require them to take any life cover out and is offering a slightly higher rate at 2.65% fixed for 20 years, although we are usually able to secure a discount for our clients.



For us based in Ireland it is of course easier and switched to a fixed rate myself now. I spoke to the agent and she said that there are still plenty of Brits getting mortgages approved.
In relation to SanNico's comment about renting a 4 bed for 300 a month I totally agree. You would not get anything in our area and certainly not near the coast were most people want to be.
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Old Aug 17th 2021, 10:21 am
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Default Re: Where is everyone?

Originally Posted by tebo53
Quote...."You can rent a 4 bedroom flat in Spain for £300 a month"

I think you are exaggerating a little bit there...unless it's a dump in the middle of nowhere.

Steve
I rent a 4 bedroom flat with two bathrooms and air conditioning for €350 a month. Electricity is expensive though lol especially with these record breaking heat waves. And that’s in Catalonia in a middle class area in a nice peaceful village in the mountains. Council houses are twice that in the UK.
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Old Aug 17th 2021, 10:25 am
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Default Re: Where is everyone?

Originally Posted by Stingychips
I rent a 4 bedroom flat with two bathrooms and air conditioning for €350 a month. Electricity is expensive though lol especially with these record breaking heat waves. And that’s in Catalonia in a middle class area in a nice peaceful village in the mountains. Council houses are twice that in the UK.
Yes exactly....in the mountains is not where most Expats choose to rent apartments!! That's why it's so cheap.

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Old Aug 17th 2021, 10:32 am
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Originally Posted by tebo53
Yes exactly....in the mountains is not where most Expats choose to rent apartments!! That's why it's so cheap.

Steve
The mountains are full of expats as the river Ebro runs right thought it making it one of the best places on the planet for anglers. So many British here buying up land and houses. Fishing is big business here people get bookings year in advance.
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Old Aug 17th 2021, 10:40 am
  #28  
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The more I read your posts the more I think this is a wind up account. You rent this as well as owning another place there? Or do you mean you bought the place and rent it out for 350 per month? 4 beds and 2 baths with a/c in a middle class tranquil area sound very appealling for that price. Send me a link and I'll rent it as a weekend bolthole.
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Old Aug 17th 2021, 11:11 am
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Default Re: Where is everyone?

Originally Posted by Stingychips
I rent a 4 bedroom flat with two bathrooms and air conditioning for €350 a month. Electricity is expensive though lol especially with these record breaking heat waves. And that’s in Catalonia in a middle class area in a nice peaceful village in the mountains. Council houses are twice that in the UK.
Sure with the rates so low these days many peoples mortgage would be around this or only slightly higher in parts where you only need to borrow 100K. But if I look on Idealista and we are based in Catalonia (Girona) the cheapest to rent is €350 https://www.idealista.com/en/alquile...or=precios-asc
Maybe because of depopulation you will find cheap rentals in parts Lleida but then it wouldn't be classed as desirable.
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Old Aug 17th 2021, 11:16 am
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Default Re: Where is everyone?

Originally Posted by SanNico
The more I read your posts the more I think this is a wind up account. You rent this as well as owning another place there? Or do you mean you bought the place and rent it out for 350 per month? 4 beds and 2 baths with a/c in a middle class tranquil area sound very appealling for that price. Send me a link and I'll rent it as a weekend bolthole.
Yes I rent as well As own. And I just had a quick look on idialista then and seen flats for as little as €250 a month. And people tell me that catalonia is one of the more expensive provinces as well.
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