Originally Posted by lynnxa

yep - I've had tortilla with all sorts of things - my favourite was in a bar in Denia with prawns- I've had similar since, but the guy who made the tortilla there is a master of tortilla-making

Originally Posted by Domino

why didnt you introduce yourself, I would have made you one of my 4-cheese special tortilla's

Originally Posted by Domino

I have just had a small piece of English translated and 3 words of the 24 have got the wrong Spanish word in. They use the same root but the wrong meaning. I know it is a little technical, but ........
back to Google Translator

luckily it wasnt a rental agreement

Originally Posted by evamar

WHITELINEN: NEVER Not in the UK, which is the point, just as you seem to have NEVER met a Spanish person talking fluent English in Spain... In the UK, again the point, some of them told me how lovely Spain is and that they have been spending their holidays in Spain for many years, or that their parents have been living there for decades and the weather is gorgeous. The ones with some Spanish were quite far from being fluent or only knew some greetings, and all of them had very little contact with Spanish people. As they couldn't speak Spanish, they simply had contact with other Brits or as you said other foreigners who made the effort to learn English (as your cultivated Germans, Dutch and Belgians). The parents of a friend of mine are living somewhere in Murcia and were very interested in learning Spanish, I met them I think 3 times and were improving quite fast. 2-3 years more and they will be fluent.

I'm just saying this: Brits living in the UK don't HAVE TO speak English, just as Spanish living in Spain don't HAVE TO speak Spanish. I don't expect British people in the UK to be fluent in Spanish. Really, what do you find so terrible about that? If somebody decide to live abroad for many years, even if it's only to avoid problems and make their own life easier, they should learn some of the language. With this I'm also saying that foreigners living in the UK should learn English.

Foreign languages have always been a "non important" subject in Spain till very recently, just as it's not considered the most important in the UK. I think that British people are supposed to learn a foreign language for at least 4 years or so, cannot remember now, but that is not taught in depth and forgotten very quickly. Very few British people actually decide to go further and become fluent in another language. Exactly the same happens in Spain. Unless one likes the language or has to use it for work or personal circumstances, people don't usually take the time and effort to learn another language. I simply think that living in the foreign country fits the need of learning the language for personal circumstances. French is the most common foreign language taught to my previous generation (in their 60s-80's) younger people normally learn English... and some are now learning Chinese too. This makes it evident that interest is there now. There are lots of young people in Spain speaking fluent English, but many others (young and old) only speak Spanish because they only HAVE TO speak Spanish.

I really cannot see why are you so "quisquillosa" about this. You said that you are using your best Spanglish, fantastic. The more you use the faster you will actually improve it and you will be able to expand your circle and see more places, thus improving your life as you won't have to spend time trying to communicate in English, French or performing mime.

Originally Posted by cricketman

Did you use a proper qualified translator or just someone who said they do translations?

My OH is a qualified translator and can lose her job if she translates wrong, or even taken to court

Originally Posted by Domino

It was a QT but the problem was has no experience in the subject matter so the translation took no account of the technicalities.
It is my fault because I didnt specify properly, and even with my poor Spanish immediately spotted the errors.
But it is the same as asking a general translator to do medical, electronic or engineering without experience. Each of the words have a "meaning" out of the dictionary but in this context have a technical meaning covering an amalgam of other unwritten subject matter.
Its hard to describe but as I say, I didnt specify properly and the individual had no experience of the subject matter.

Originally Posted by cricketman

Sorry this isnt true at all

If you were using a legally qualified translator, one who owns a stamp to say it has been professionally translated then there should be no errors or you can actually sue them for professional misconduct.

It does not matter about experience, if a translator feels they cannot do it then they must refuse the work. My OH spends time on technical forums making sure things are translated correctly. She recently translated an 80 page report for Renfe about what measures to take when it snows on the tracks even though she obviously isnt a railway engineer

There are many amateurs mascarading as translators just as there are amateurs mascarading as language teachers

Originally Posted by Domino

Well as the last time Britain was invaded it was by Vikings, but we absorbed them, before that the Normans and we absorbed them, and then of course the Romans were also absorbed. Along the way we picked up bits of their language. Thats why our language is a bit of a hotchpotch and is one of the most successful languages to ever exist.

So what is Spain's excuse, its only 200 years since you very nearly had to start speaking French - if it hadn't been for Arthur Wellesley and his band of prison rejects and cut-throats.

Originally Posted by Domino

ah but the work isnt stamped, it was a favour.

Originally Posted by cricketman

Ah a favour This is the reason why I advise my OH not to target the expat market for translations. Unwilling to pay for anything

Originally Posted by cricketman

Language change is about two things; who legally rules the country and who actually settles in the country.

The Romans ruled the UK but few settled. The Vikings settled and ruled. The Normans settled and ruled. Meaning the influence of each on the English language was great

In Spain, the Romans ruled and settled, the Moors ruled, but rather sporadically and few settled and those who did deliberately spoke Castillian so not to be persecuted. Spanish was affected by Arabic but not in a huge sense. The brief French invasions of 1812 (I believe) were by the army and were short lived, therefore no effect.

All of which is hugely irrelevant! It is very simple, both English and Spanish are two of the most important international languages. You can do anything you want in half of the world by just speaking Spanish, or just speaking English

Currently English is slightly more important internationally which is why Spanish people learn English at school. However, 30 years ago Spaniards actually learnt French at school because this was seen as the more important international language. In 10 years, who knows.

The English and Spanish speaking cultures have been at loggerheads for over 500 years, mainly in their battle to rape and pillage the Americas. This is the basis by which the Anglo culture continues to try and belittle the Spanish speaking culture, but the truth is for 90% of Spaniards, they will never have to speak English even if they want an international career as Spain has so many links to other parts of the Spanish speaking world.

Btw, Spanish is one of the major languages being taught at Chinese schools, along with English of course

Originally Posted by whitelinen

I expect they wash the paella pan in the UK.

Did you detect a whiff of Fairy?

Originally Posted by Domino

Evamar, could there be a suspicion that the paella was going to be different because it wasnt in Spain.?
I have a Spanish Cookbook and hear of the "standard" paella, but then find that different villages have their own "paella maker" who makes their own version. And then paella can be different in Andalucia to Catalunia. So exactly what is a Spanish Paella ? And surely a recipe is there to provide the bones, where you add or subtract as available, increase or decrease to suit the number of people eating.
Surely if someone makes English Roast Beef lunch or Full English Breakfast they don't have to be English or French for a crepe suzette or even a shepherd to make Shepherds Pie.? We had a lot of trouble with some people wanting immigration rules lifted to employ chefs from particular countries as the only way to make a restaurant and its meals "genuine".

As to drinks, if in a work environment it is only common courtesy to make a drink to suit the individual, it is part of the teamwork that brings you all together.

Originally Posted by jackytoo

I know a lot of spanish who speak English very well (in tourist areas) but none who do not make mistakes in grammar ie. fluent.

Originally Posted by evamar

I don't agree. One can make mistakes in grammar, and still be fluent. If one can speak 2 languages at mother tongue level then they are bilingual, not fluent. Normally only people with international parents or who have been exposed to both languages since they are little can truly achieve this.

If their English is good enough for you to understand them in nor particularly easy situations, then they are fluent. I don't expect foreigners to be able to speak and construct very complicated sentences that many natives wouldn't use... I just want to be able to communicate with them without performing mime, making too many stops to think and getting a dictionary all the time looking for words.

I make lots of silly grammar mistakes, but I think that my English is quite fluent. I know that it will never be perfect, I'm Spanish at the end of the day.