Property prices increase...
 

Ok, so it's probably a rare occurrence, but it shows that there are still buyers out there when the price is right.

Santander decided to offload properties in Seseña (an infamous building development in Toledo province).
In just 3 weeks the minimum price of a property there has gone from 65,000 to 78,000.
It's not a place that would appeal to anyone here I think - it's aimed more at families who commute to Madrid and can't afford the high property prices there.

Article is in Spanish

http://www.idealista.com/news/archiv...-sesena-toledo

According to this news report, more than 400 units sold! Astounding, really.

http://www.elmundo.es/elmundo/2012/0...332876562.html

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Apparently this was a video promo by Santander for these properties. I suppose they look fine inside, but very bleak from the outside!

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Bleak's not the word:ohmy:

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Well yes, and yet the buyers have swarmed in apparently. Just shows how tight the market must be for reasonably priced places in Madrid - I'm assuming most of the buyers work in Madrid but want to have a place their family can live.

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Ever the eternal optimist Stevie, though I suppose it's kind of you to try lifting a little bit of the doom and gloom for a short while at least.

Not really astounding though at those sort of prices.

More a sign of desperation unfortunately methinks, that such a godforsaken place is the best many can hope for at present.

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Actually, if a an average wage is say 18k, then I don't think 65 or 73k is an astonishing low price , in fact that should be more the level for a starter place. It's only about 12 years ago that you could get houses in many midlands and northern cities starting from about 35k.
400 homes sold in just 3 days. I still think it's quite astonishing considering no-one's supposed to have any money.

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As I've said before, the market for good properties is very strong. They are getting snapped up very quickly by clever buyers.

It's only the rubbish that is left and they'll dump that on foreigners when the time is right.

Spain has a very bright future. By 2025, I expect Spain to be the number 2 country, not only in the Eurozone, but in Europe, overtaking UK, France and Italy who are all a bit jaded.

The Spanish are very good at adapting to changing circumstances or austerity as it's currently called. Today's strike will be forgotten in a couple of days.

Don't be fooled by the doom and gloom, it's all just media spin.

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many Spanish dismiss this story as sales hype. Perhaps there were only a couple of tempters at 65,000 to generate interest. Businesses do this all the time. How many times have we seen in the media, and on this forum that agents are selling them like pasties. They have been saying it for years yet sales and prices are still dropping. On one spanish forum this comment says it is lies and trolling, it points out that to sell 400 in that amount of time is impossible administrationally!

Mentira y GORDA. Para vender 400 pisos en 3 dias tendrian que haber ido a un ritmo de 2 o 3 minutos por piso y eso es imposible, solamente en sentarse a la mesa y explicarles la financiacion o caracteristicas de la vivienda se va mucho mas de eso. Una trola intentando crear sensación de que se acaban y luego van a estar mas caros. Lo dicho MENTIRA.

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Poor Jacky. Getting upset by positive news in Spain.

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especially if she is reminded that many of those who are watching but not contributing cannot speak or read Spanish
:rofl:

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thought Pasties were a rude word in the UK at the moment over VAT but also since Mr Cameroon professed a love for them but the BBC has reported the company concerned ceased trading 5 years ago.

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Well there weren't my comments:p Anyway that positive story is a flea on an elephants ear. Why would it upset me:confused: I have friends and relatives in Spain who i am very fond of and feel sorry for them. Just balancing out the hype to prevent others making the mistake of thinking there will be a turnaround soon...cos there won't!

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Well she's probably (edit, cant be 100%) quoting from a comment posted on Burbuja - the Spanish equivalent of HousePriceCrash forum - a site she's rubbished in the past!

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Well I did translate the gist of it and how difficult is it to change it to English, not a novel just 3 sentences. :rofl:

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Jacky its nice to have feelings for the friends and family, things will change, but it will take time. In the same way as it did 20-25 years ago.

What Spain needs now is really positive stories about export wins, large companies moving in etc etc not gum flapping from a house salesman

who if employing 10 sales people on commission only would probably be able to make those sales if the buyers are really there and ready to go. Its surprising how fast a gullible buyer will gobble up the patter and sign on the dotted line if they think they are getting something someone else isnt.

Pride and Fall come into it somewhere

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I wonder if most of them were bought by individual families or possibly snapped up in large blocks by already filthy rich, in the know, property investors, seeing a golden opportunity to make a killing from tenants with limited options and finance.

It would be one quite feasible explanation for the quick turnover.

Only asking like. :unsure:

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Actually it's a very good question. I'd like to know the make-up of the buyers too. The ElMundo articles did interview some buyers, but we have no way of knowing if they were representative.
Given the location I doubt they are good places to rent out, which is why I feel it's probably families seeking a reasonably priced home. But yes, there could well be speculators and/or landlords who've swooped in.

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Well if I was into it on a more sizable scale, I might look on it as a golden opportunity.
Brand new property at a knock down price, when the market is close to the bottom, in the vicinity of a big city, probably a good long term investment.
Buy blocks of apts close together, easy to manage and very few maintainance and repair bills for quite a few years, a very big bonus for landlords.
Could afford to dump some older properties at knock down prices and rent the new ones out at very attractive rates.
No doubt many tenants living in deteriorating old edificios in even scruffier areas would be attracted by a brand new start in a brand new apt.

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It's a knife edge thing - do you praise Spain to encourage more immigrants, which I normally do, or do you tell the truth to save fellow expats a few bob?

I'm going for the latter, too many Brits have come over and lost their life's savings on the Spanish property market.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2012/0...82Q02J20120327

11% down in the last quarter of 2011, and another 30% fall forecast for this year.

Sorry.

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I think HBG has got the wrong end of the stick. No-one to my knowledge is stating this is the start of milk and honey, nor that property is now a sure bet if you want to make money - see the first line of the first post

Seseña is not even a place I can imagine Brits wanting to live in. But again, once the price is at a reasonable level, it seems you get buyers. Even if as some have stated, they are speculators/property investors. Problem is, that many private buyers can't sell at "reasonable levels" because they bought in the boom years. Lower prices are great news for those who want to buy a home now, but obviously less good news for those who bought at the peak.

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Wouldn't they be wiser to invest in all the successful spanish co's that stevie keeps telling us about:D

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I just gave my opinion based on what little info is shown in this thread, so possibly I could be way off the mark, as I haven't even seen the place, nor do I know the area at all.
Somehow though based on previous experiences, I think maybe there are possible opportunities in such a situation.

Looking at the worst scenario,I don't see prices ever dropping much below those shown above for brand new properties.

On the other hand now that families are moving in, some sort of community can be established bringing with it the need for some basic infrastructure, so opportunities can well arise for such as small shops, bars and other minor businesses to move in, which in turn will encourage more ppl. to take advantage of what's still on offer at reasonable prices, eventually making it a more pleasant location to live and thereby stabilising or in the long term increasing the present low property values.
It may only have needed the first new residents and property investors to set the ball rolling and help buck the trend, which I admit in general countrywide is unlikely to change for quite a while yet.

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I've seen better looking apartments in East Berlin, a legacy from Russian rule.

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There's a forum for Seseña residents here, may be able to see what type of person has moved in.

http://www.forosesena.com/

Interesting - they're looking for an English teacher - may be of interest to Madrid or Toledo based teachers with transport

http://www.forosesena.com/empleo/815...de-ingles.html

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Most of them already live in such places, many of which are getting a bit dilapitated, so for those it could well be a step up.

In addition the Spanish in general usually seem quite happy with that type of accomodation, noise, hustle bustle and all.

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Good point. Outside of London, flats and apartments don't seem so popular with the English. In Glasgow and Edinburgh it's fine to move into an apartment, but in most of England people seem to prefer the old 2 up 2 down house over a flat.

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I've lived in flats several times over the last three decades or so, never for long and not my favourite to be honest but served their purpose at the time. London was lonely, hard to strike up a chat, the States was much more friendly and Cyprus was just an 'open door' sort of living, neighbours children would think nothing of walking in and taking fruit from the fridge (best 'hello' and 'thank you'); came home one day and the lady next door was beating the rugs from my lounge because 'You have no woman to do it for you' (I was on my own there for three months); a lovely couple and we kept in touch for years until her hubby passed away in 2005.

That said Stevie, more and more apartments have been built in the UK the last decade or so, big improvements over the post WW2/60's tower blocks that seemed to kill community spirit.

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its not just the flats but remember the underground silence, with flat pan faces, eyes downcast, twisting and turning to keep the amount of personal contact to the absolute minimum ?? Then a couple of "foreigners" get on and chatter away ten to the dozen in their own language despite all the dirty looks from the locals ??

London - one of the most unfriendly cities I had the "pleasure" to live and work in.

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Depends whereabouts in London you are. I'm certainly no fan of the place or any other big city come to that and I understand what you say about the underground effect which is not unique to London.
However I have a property in the suburbs where my daughter lives and I've usually found the locals there quite sociable during my occasional visits, though as in similar cities it has it's share of hard cases and foreigners whose English is very limited.

Strangely enough some Swedish friends of mine visited London a couple of years back and the thing they were most impressed with by far was the friendliness and helpfulness of the people they met.
Not sure if thats a true reflection of London or the general standoffishness of their own people back home.

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Dick, perhaps my commuting experience is the thing I remember most.
But, both I and BH have agreed that London could actually be a better place to live than in the sticks.
As a city it is made up of dozens of little community areas, each individual, each with its own shops, people, in just the same way as we are now experiencing in Spain.
Out in the sticks it is locked doors, snooty people who don't even wave when driving past in their Chelsea Tractors.

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It's the same in all parts of Spain I know. On our road everyone had automatic gates and even in the campo they have them or if not they are heavily padlocked gates.

The village where I live now most have their gates open all day. They drive out to work and leave them open, even the million+ pound ones.

I couldn't live in an apartment in Spain or the UK. Have done in London and there was a good community but they were mainly middle aged people. People are less considerate nowadays. We bought a bolthole in kingston whilst in Spain. Thought it would be great right on the Thames with lots of nice restaurants underneath:blink: Didn't think that one through, lots of young people living there, late parties on the terraces, noise from the restaurants during summer.....:frown:

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Oh Jacky - fancy you of all people denying Young :eek: people their rights to do as they want, late parties, dining at restaurants, being well yes Young :eek:

actually agree, its a right royal PITA when they come make a noise make a mess and then leave it all to the locals with ringing ears wondering what hit them. Theres alot to be said for living in a location that isnt "popular".

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I've often heard people tell me there is no crime in the north of Spain - which is patently untrue. Yet it's still the case that in many towns and villages (even near the coast there) people leave their doors unlocked, even open when they go out. Totally different atmosphere to the Med. I suppose it's down to the millions of tourists and casual workers who descend on the area. Or perhaps the rain deters the criminals? ;)

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We live in the middle of the med, and our doors are almost always left open or unlocked. But we're in a rural (non touristy) area, and I suppose that's true of almost anywhere like this.

Still, if a break in or major robbery occurred even in the nearest town, it would probably make front page news in the local paper.

And yes, I think the major tourist resorts have more occurrances of this sort of thing. Especially in the most popular and densely populated hotspots.

Just an observation: "Tourists" are almost always foreigners.

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Every village always has at least one villain! Rural Andalucía has a huge drug problem. Then there are the Albanians etc "passing through"

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There is crime everywhere of course, although stating the obvious, there is more in some places than others

In almost all Spanish villages you see the doors wide open even when people are not home. I even see that in Benalmadena Pueblo!

I actually think that Spanish people have a lower perception of the rate of crime, because they spend more time out on the street. British people are cooked up in their homes much more so have to rely on the unreliable press to tell them what is and is not safe.

Although saying that, it is also what you know. My wife would happily walk back on her own at 4am in Oviedo, but never would do this in the UK. In Barcelona I saw teenagers out on their own at midnight, but then the streets were busy and safe, unless you looked like a tourist with a camera dangling from your neck. I saw 2 and 3 people get mugged like that.

I must also say that when I see Spanish teenagers I think they are friendly, but when I see UK teenagers I think beware!

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even when I went on a staycation from East Anglia to Bournemouth as many others do ??
in the "good old days" we used to have Miners Fortnight when miners took their families to B&B's by the sea.

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The only thing we have in common with Britain is that we too are an island. A much smaller one that is popular with the British, Germans, French, Dutch, Russians, and arabs.

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as Britain has British, Germans, French, Dutch, samovars of Russians and lots of Arabs we have more in common than you think

swop you 20 Russians for 15 Poles and 1 Lithuanian.
AK47's included.......

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Crime follows the money and the crowds in every country, making tourists a common and often easy target.

Very few rich pickings in a remote mountain village, where a stranger would stand out like a sore thumb anyway.

Those Spanish teenage yobs trashing Barcelona last week didn't look quite so friendly to me. :confused: