Moving to Spain maybe
 

Hi all I am Dubdave was thinking of moving to Murcia and opening up a Chocolate shop been doing it for years here so thought I would give it ago in spain Iknow how to run the business but don't know what will be needed in spain such as lawyer accountant retail unit to buy or rent Have all contacts in chocolate business for supplies What do you all think of this Idea

Re: moving to spain maybe
 

Hi dubdave and welcome to,the forum :)

As your question relates directly to Spain, I'll shift your thread over to the Spain section of the forum. All the best with your plans.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Chocolate is not so popular in Spain as UK. I guess you know the recipe will need to be modified to avoid melting in the heat?

Good luck.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

As Concierge for the Spanish section of BE I would like to say hello and welcome.

BE is a very large expat website, so if you have problems finding your way around we have concierges who will try to direct you. The moderators for the Spanish forums are Mitzyboy and Fred James, moderators are there to ensure that the site runs smoothly within the rules of BE. Problems and complaints should always be addressed to a moderador who will look into the matter and deal with it efficiently and fairly. Our members who post in the Spain Forums are friendly and helpful with a wealth of knowledge of the issues of living in Spain. At the top of the page you will find a quirkily named thread called Free Beer which is full of important and useful information. Hope you enjoy your time participating in the forums.

Please let me know if you need any further help.

Rosemary

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Hola and Welcome to the Spain forum,

As an occasional chocolate eater, I have come to understand the large differences between "British" and "European" chocolate. Completely different products and each to their own but people take sides in this ;-)

I recently visited a chocolate factory in Pampaniera in Las Alpujarras (Abuela Ili). Many different flavours of chocolates to try - you may strike lucky if you can emulate their type of business - but how large a business do you want to run? I guess not "Cadbury" size

Davexf

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

You have listed all the people you need, but as missile has said, the recipe will have to be adjusted for Spain as the high summer temps, 35+, mean that the normal UK recipe would just melt all over the place, and the beaurocracy to get licences will drive you crazy.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

are you serious??

I don't know a single Spanish person who doesn't like chocolate!

and breakfast for kids consists of chocolate cereal with chocolate milk!

they then progress to churros con chocolate (with brandy in it when they get to clubbing age)

napolitanas con chocolate are sold in every school canteen


I could go on....

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Oh yes.They truly love their chocolate.Even when dieting, they still have to have their chocolate fix, just a smaller amount.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

A well air condition unit should be fine I have been to many chocolate shops in Madrid Majorca Valencia some of my supplies come from spain and hope to sell hot and cold drinks as well

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Beaurocracy and licences are your likely problems, get a gestor or lawyer who has good local council contacts, and you may be fine.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Nocilla/nutella goes in bocatas for merienda,colacao is a staple etc etc...........But I do find the hard chocolate bars have a different consistency than say Cadburys.More waxy?..or hard??..and its seems harder to bite into and sometimes looks shinier.I was at a friends house recently and she still had it in her cupboard.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

The ones made for Spain and the med countries is a different recipe from the UK one, it has special ingredients added so that it will stay hard even in the temps found there, which is why it tastes so different.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Yes, Spanish chocolate actually contains chocolate i.e. cocoa.

British chocolate is just vegetable fat and palm oils. Cadbury's is found to be repulsive by chocolate fans outside of the UK (my wife would vouch for that)

Spain has a proud history in chocolate although it didnt travel to the South very well because, well, it melts :) Which is why the chocolate there is often the hot kind. The Museo de chocolate in Barcelona is worth a visit

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

That's true. But look in any supermarket (the ones around here are Mercandonna and Consum) and they have a very limited range, and a small amount of shelf space for actual chocolate confectionery (as opposed to "foods" with chocolate in, such as cereals and biscuits).
Compare that with yer average Tesco or Sainsbury, where an entire aisle sells chocolate in it's various forms.
So yes,while the spanish do eat some chocolate the sales volumes seem much smaller than a UK supplier might be used to.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Sorry but am smiling at the comment they plan to sell hot and cold drinks, dont think anyone has thought about selling those before. :rofl:

On another note I agree with others that the Spanish do not like UK chocolate, none of our Spanish friends do, and as already said, they dont eat much of it, as in the supermarkets have very Little on the shelves. :):)

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

That's maybe because Spaniards are less likely to shop at a supermarket

We buy at least half of our shopping from independent shops

We buy our ice cream from heladerias, our chocolate, churros and crisps from churrerias and buscuits, pastries, bread etc from panaderias and pastelerias

It's a whole different world you know!

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

I think there are two main problems with your plan. The first, which may be minor if you find your niche, is the location of Murcia. Now from the pictures it looks a beautiful place, but it has always had a rep as being one of the poorer parts of Spain. Surely you'd be better heading to a northern city with far more middle class people with spending power.
The second, and main problem, will be marketing. As mentioned already the Spanish generally have a poor opinion of British chocolate (and British cuisine). It doesn't matter if you think they are mistaken (and they are not alone in this, it's a viewpoint held by many European countries) they will not be tempted to patronise your store, unless you have some brilliant marketing tricks.
Of course you could just target the tourists for 4 months in the year, but again, I'd suspect a very, very low % of tourists come to Spain to sample the local chocolate.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

I went there a few weeks ago! We loved all the free samples on the counter, I could have started at one end and worked my way through the lot.:rofl:

We did actually buy some as well, of course - the white chocolate with mint was my favourite, yummy.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

my chocolate comes from Belgium france swiss and England all hand made not from factories oh and valour in spain my only concern is location

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

My wife loves the stuff. In fact she´s told me she put on a lot of weight when she first moved to the UK. As did the friends she was living with. In fact, it´s one of the few things she misses back in Spain :p

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

I presume that's in the perfect world that is Oviedo. :cool:

The rest of Spain, like the rest of the Western world has moved on for better or for worse.

I would guess that at least 90% of Spanish food supplies are now bought in Supermarkets much the same as anywhere else.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

We have a choice of umpteen Spanish supermarkets and they're all full to the gunnels of all different kinds of chocolate, and other nasties for someone on a perpetual diet (me). I hurry past the chocolate rows to head for the fresh fish and vegetables, but I keep glancing back at them until my sensible wife nudges me.

But Mercadona, Consum, Lidl and the others have a clever marketing ploy, while you're queuing at the check-out, the chocolates are back. Right in your face where you can smell them and touch them.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Hi

We DID work our way through the samples; we bought over 80 euros worth by the time we finished - including 5 chilli and 4 mint bars. We were given a bar or two as freebies as we ate our ice creams! But the whole raspberries covered in white chocolate were my favourite

Davexf

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

I don't example this as any form of evidence one way or the other, but a speciality chocolate shop opened in the centre of Moraira a couple of years or so back. It sold only chocolate (Belgian/Swiss I think!).
Never saw many customers and it closed a few months back and I was surprised it had lasted that long to be honest. Of course price could have been a factor as I have no idea what prices they were charging as I never went in.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

It seems a strange business altogether. I've seen quite a few speciality chocolate shops open over the years in both London and Oxford. Sometimes they never seem to catch on, and close again within months - others seem to have more staying power, and they generally have a more recognisable trade name. Although that didn't help Thorntons, who had to close nearly 200 of their shops - they decided a better route was selling through supermarkets and other affiliated stores. Maybe an answer would be a combined ice-cream/chocolate type store, and obviously concentrate on the ice cream side in the summer?
Another idea would be to open a cafe/teashop/upmarket bakery as per Patisserie Valerie or Le Pain Quotidien (I've seen these already open in Madrid recently) and to include a chocolate counter?

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Have seen Spanish women in Gibraltar buying up huge amounts of Cadburys so they must like it.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Hi and Good luck with your plans. Have you any idea where in Murcia you would settle? my friend wants to make a permanent move to that part of Spain. Hope all goes well and you get plenty of advice to help with your decision.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Good idea:D Spanish love their afternoon cakes after siesta. Those type of shops did very well in Marbella.

I wonder why choose Murcia:confused:

Is it because property is cheap, noticed we have had a sudden surge of newbies wanting to move there.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Big sensation around here is frozen yoghurt shops. I know of 3 that have opened in the center of town just within the past year. Always full of people.

I do notice they all have a certain look about them. Super clean, brightly lit, modern, efficient. Compared to the rest of the shops, they stand out like a shiny new car in a used car lot.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

They are here up north too

This was also a craze in the UK around 15 years ago when I was a teenager. It lasted about 2 years and then all the shops closed

For now it is something new, but I doubt it will last, frozen yoghurt just isnt very nice!

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Yes, this has been popular in Madrid for a few years. We are now seeing a few open up in London. But it must be difficult to make money, I can't see sales being good between November and March.:unsure:

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

I'm not sure if it's the product or the "shiny modernity" that attracts them. I happen to like frozen yoghurt, but I won't stand in a queue for it.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

I have often wondered (just idly, have no intention of opening one!) if a traditional British teashop with cakestands, doing cream teas, and the home made style cakes the British are so good at like Victoria sponges, lemon drizzle cake, coffee and walnut cake and so on would do well in a Spanish city (not enough trade anywhere else, I wouldn't have thought). Kind of like Betty's in Harrogate, Ilkley and York.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Possibly here;)

http://www.ciudadpatricia.nl/index.php/en/

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Went to a lovely chocolate shop in Cartegana last year, operating as both a cafe and a seller of chocolate. You should probably go on a reccie and spend a week travelling around the areas and surrounds that you want to be in and see what's working and what isn't. There were plenty of Spanish in this place as well as tourists of different nationalities. You probably will do best if its upmarket looking, clean lines etc like the aforementioned frozen yoghurt places. that way you can have a higher mark up as it will be about the product and the place. I don't agree that th Spanish don't like chocolate, that isn't my experience also they don't seem to mind the poor quality stuff their own supermarkets churn out.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Don't forget a lot of the ingredients that you take for granted in the UK are not readily available in Spain - if my list is too long someone will tell me that they saw it once in an obscure outlet someone in a sleepy Spanish town - but as I said readily. Things like self raising flour, dried fruit, custard etc.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Dried fruit really? We've managed to get it everywhere. Raisans, apricots, dates etc. Natillas is pretty much custard and delicious, although most people make it from scratch. No self-raising four is no hurdle for a basic cook

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

See how this American succeeded in starting a pie business in Madrid (main customers up-market hotels)

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/07/30/bu...html?c=&page=0

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

I guess we shall disagree on this.

In CB South there are not so many corner shops and supermarkets displaying chocolate bars and sweets in the selection and vast quantities that I see in the UK.

I would suggest chocolate milk, chocolate cereal, churros, chocolate ice cream, et al are not relevant to this thread. I doubt dubdave intends to sell those in his chocolate shop.

Re: Moving to Spain maybe
 

Spanish people do not snack as much as the British

Most Spaniards have 3 big meals a day along with 2 smaller ones, and will have no snacks in between, except maybe at paseo time before dinner.

Before my wife moved to the UK she had a large breakfast, a sandwich at 11am, a 3 course lunch, a snack (pastry or sandwich) at 6s and a two course dinner/supper, ever day! She has a bit less now because she has to cook it herself ;)

British people snack at every opportunity, which is why crisps and chocolate bars are sold everywhere. Quite simply because they think that a sandwich is a main meal, so they are hungry

Spaniards will eat chocolate as a desert, for breakfast or perhaps as the late afternoon snack, but they very rarely eat things like mars bars etc