Hi, We are planning to move to Spain in the near future so may I please ask a couple of questions. We would apply for the Retirement Visa, I’m over 70 my wife is 61 but doesn’t work does have a nominal private pension plus saving over £50k also we will bring her mother who is an extremely fit 93 yr old ( no medications ) with pensions plus savings my question is can my mother in law be counted as a dependent, she lives with us now, will they count all three sets of incomes into one pot and plus we will be selling our UK House £500k ish. Advice please.
My second question is will my wife and myself be able to exchange our UK driving licence for Spanish without taking any Spanish tests ?

We did previously live in Spain 2003 to 2005 so did comply with NIE and we had Spanish Driving Licence but changed them on return to UK
No doubt will have more questions later, can anyone advise of a good up to date book I could buy covering all aspects of making the move ? Thanks

Books get out of date very quickly - suggest you use reliable/official websites

https://www.ageinspain.org/post/moving-to-spain

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/living-in-spain

https://www.pellicerheredia.com/en/open-library/

Here is another Non Lucrative visa guide that will be useful:

https://www.exteriores.gob.es/Consul...lucrativa.aspx

It will explain the income and healthcare requirements.

Steve

Yes, your mother-in-law will be counted as dependant family member on the ascending line and requires 1 x IPROM per month or 7200 euro per year. Your wife too will require 7200 euro a year. Plus you need 4 x IPROM = 28800 euro. All three of you will be covered by S1 - you and mother-in-law as state pensioners and your wife as your dependant, so no private health cover needed. Remember you need further documents such as police checks. You and your wife should be able to exchange your UK driving licence into Spanish ones, which should be done within 6 months of moving to Spain. You need medical checks at a private clinic where they carry out basic checks such as BP, sight, hearing and reaction test. All being well, your wife should get 5 years' validity and you will get between 3 and 5 years depending on test results.

Thanks for all that information it gives me most of the answers at this stage but may I ask another

Can my mother in law’s pensions which are guaranteed income count for her 7200 requirement for visa application, she actually receives far greater amount but not the 28000 for the main applicant she also has a good savings, do they take any saving into account when considering self sufficiency?

Yes it's perfect that her income is from her pensions as its proven regular income and as a dependent she only needs the €7200 per annum to qualify. Some (but not all) areas do take into account a good bank balance but I've not heard a stated amount required.

Steve

I would like to take a moment to thank those members who have responded to my questions with really good advice, Thank you 🙏

Hello T23
IMO go back and delete much of what to wrote about your income Etc Etc, the internet is full of scamming shysters who would be very interested in your income details.

You might want to consider cost of medical insurance

For visa purpose, they don't need private medical insurance as they all qualify for S1: Two of them are UK state pensioners and one is a dependant.

You also need to make sure you don't sell your UK property in the same Spanish tax that you move or you could face Capital Gains Tax. The other thing to be very sure about is that you are comfortable with the fact that you will be having to rely on hospitals, doctors, carers etc more than most people as your mother in law will at various points need medical attention being at such an advanced age. What is important to remember is that this will involve a lot of contact with Spanish individuals, some who might speak English some who won't and it is not their obligation to do so , simply a courtesy. So you need to be prepared for that and perhaps having to pay for a translator at times. Some folk might find doing these things stressful and frustrating - it is hard enough in UK dealing with the NHS and care for the elderly never mind Spain. My ex works as an interpreter for 112 and says it is a nightmare with British people phoning for emergencies ( especially ambulances). Half of them don't even know how to correctly say their addresses and then when the paramedics get there people are panicking and shouting in English and the paramedics can't understand anything so it often results in precious time being lost. These are things that you at least need to think about and be prepared for.

Just for a little extra information about Carers. In Spain you are expected to look after family members and organise their daily care which could result in paying for private carers attending daily and in the worst situation having to pay for a residential home. Carers in my area cost around €20 per hour and residential home fees can be astronomical. There is not care systems in Spain like the UK provide.

Ste

Yes. It is important to understand that the system for care for elderly is very different from UK and that the unwritten law is that the bulk of the work falls to the family. I found the whole process difficult enough in UK when dealing with my mother. Lots of phone calls and lots of time spent trying to arrange things and then filling out forms, visits to hospitals for tests etc- it was very stressful. Personally I would find it extremely hard to have tried to do the same in Spain. You can't just phone these places and start talking in English you would definitely need a translator. Of course this is simply my opinion so others will differ but if you ask me during my final years the one place I would like to be is in a familiar place with people who I understand and I feel close to home. It must be horrible being in a completely foreign atmosphere. However, different strokes for different folks.

I don't think it is accurate to say that in Spain there are not care systems such as exist in the UK. There are most certainly domicilary carers in the public sector (in my own town they work for an arms length company set up by the Ayuntamiento called Emvipsa, which also provides cleaning services for public buildings). This link to the Junta de Andalucia's webpage about the Servicio de Ayuda a Domiclio outlines the type of services that can be provide which is pretty comprehensive, and differs from the domiciliary care typically provided by local authority Adult Social Care departments in the UK which is almost always limited to personal care only (ie help with getting up and going to bed, washing, toileting, meal provision - which given the length of carer visits means putting something in the microwave) and giving medication). When I was investigating care at home for my late father in the event that he might recover sufficiently to be able to return home from hospital, I asked Social Services what could be done to help someone who needed help with shopping, cleaning, laundry etc. and they were very clear that that would either have to be provided by the family or contracted and paid for separately by the individual or their family.

Servicio de ayuda a domicilio - Junta de Andalucía (juntadeandalucia.es)

It is true that assessments are needed of a person's needs and capabilities before any such assistance could be provided, and those together with the application process would be conducted in Spanish which could be problematic for a foreigner without a good command of Spanish. It can take a long time for assessments to be done - and the same applies in the UK. It is also true that the individual or their family would have to contribute towards the cost of any assistance granted, or pay for it in full, depending on their income level. But the same is true of care in the UK, where anyone with savings of over 23.5k must pay for domiciliary care in full. I know of people here who are, or were before their death, residents in care homes here in Spain and the staff of the home helped their families deal with the local Social Services Department to obtain financial assistance which resulted in their pension being used to contribute to the costs (with the individual being able to keep a smalll amount as pocket money) and the local authority paying the rest - again no different from the UK where people with means over a certain level have to fund their own residential care in full (and are charged considerably more than the rate the local authority pays for people whose care they are funding).

In my town over 300 people are now employed to provide this service and every day when I am out and about I see their uniformed carers accompanying their carees on walks or in the supermarket, or just sitting on benches so the old people can chat with friends and neighbours. My next door neighbour on one side has one such carer who comes twice a week to do cleaning, etc. My neighbour is not housebound and goes out either on her own (she uses a walking aid) or with her husband who lives with her and doesn't appear at all frail, goes to the hairdresser every week and her daughter lives 3 doors away on the same floor of our block of flats, so obviously people don't have to be extremely seriously disabled or without family help to qualify for some level of assistance.

Los Servicios Sociales de Vélez-Málaga destinan 11,5 millones a atender a 5.100 personas | Diario Sur

As to fees for residential care homes being astronomical, when I type in my area on this webpage to find residencias within my muncipality (I know of at least 7) it displays a message saying that the average cost of a place (obviously it would cost more for residents with complex needs like dementia) is €2,234 per month - under half what self funders are now being charged in the UK.

Residencias geriátricas: Hacemos una búsqueda personalizada por tí | inforesidencias

Yes I know there are limited services that can be applied for but as it can take many months to get assessed and (if) any financial assistance it can result in, unfortunately, being to late. Illness can happen within days and help is needed immediately hence many private care companies available. Families cannot wait for the Spanish social security to catch up. I've been caught up in this system so I do know something about it.

Steve