Healthcare in Spain
 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-22712790

It appears that the EU are going to step in to ensure to try and sort this one out.

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Am sure it happens, but have to say last year with a friend from UK the hospital at El Ejido couldnt be more helpful, registered our friend with his EHIC card and was seen and treated with upmost care. Not all bad

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

The implication in that report it isn't just Brits that may have been denied but others - just not stated which countries

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Well it must be true or it wouldn't have got so far in Brussels without proof! However, we had a thread on this when some seemed to be in denial:lol:

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

yes, but then there are people on both sides of the EHIC who know little as to what it is for and as users try to get their lives put back together in the same way as they do in the UK (or other countries?) so the medical/support staff also are confused. Very few have any proper training and probably can't remember the "safe place" they filed the confusing document from Central Medical.

even my local medical centre seem to think I don't need an Andalucian Tarjeta Sanitaria but can get everything from my EHIC.
They don't seem to understand that EHIC is a dumb card and their Tarjeta system is actually light years ahead of what they have in the UK.

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

It certainly needs sorting, but so too does the issue of expats, living in Spain permanently, being early retirees, having no medical insurance cover and relying on their EHIC for routine medical treatment (with no care or concern that it is the UK taxpayer paying for it)....

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

I think the attitude is "I've paid for it so I'm entitled !!"

The same as some go home for their medical attention although resident in Spain.

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Precisely, and why not ???

Judging by some of the more recent reports it appears that some of the Spanish hospitals are running some sort of a scam, which seemed to be the case from my own personal experience.

Really difficult to believe that something like that could be happening in such a corruption free country as Spain. :confused:

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Ah right, I didn't realize we could pick and choose what rules, regulations and laws we wanted to abide by just because we live in a foreign Country, now you have put me straight I can cancel my health insurance policy - thank you :whistle:

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

well........it is my understanding that Spain seems to be at the front of the queue to sign up to every little thing that comes out of Brussels, like all good Europeans.
But they then are the last to implement things, usually getting red letters.

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

According to some reports it's to get the money faster and into their own hands, so they make the customer pay, and then claim it back from either their insurance or the NHS, or they are even saying the problems are occuring because the person is going to a private hospital and not a public one.

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

I can see that happening. A foreigner calls an ambulance and the assumption would be that he didn't qualify for the NHS so they take him to a private hospital or local private clinic.

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Surely the EHIC is for accidents and emergencies. Private hospitals do not normally have an A & E unit so why are they being taken to them unless it's not actually an emergency ?

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

The EHIC is not just for accidents and emergencies. It is for any treatment that may be required while you are away.

It even covers routine treatment such as dialysis.

Yes, using an ambulance would imply something serious but what about people who are not well calling a taxi or asking the hotel where they can find a doctor.

It's circumstances like these where the result could that the patient gets taken to a private facility.

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

The larger private hospitals do have Urgencias departments - Clinica Rincon in Rincon de la Victoria, for example, and their own ambulances. That's where I'd have to go if I needed emergency treatment as I'm not currently in the Spanish state health system.

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Well on BBC they were interviewing someone who had been to the CDS state hospital. The man said he handed over his health card, signed the required form, he was also asked if he had insurance. When he said not they asked for his credit card. I wonder if they have actually been charging twice:blink: as they had his completed form for the EHIC claim.

When OH worked at the hospital I saw the accounts and the income for treating other EU citizens was massive. However using the EHIC there was never a problem before. I would think the hospital charges an insurance co. more than a EU Government for a procedure.

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Thinking about it, when we took my friend's daughter on to the Materno y Infantil Hospital in Malaga from our local one, the receptionist there did ask if they had travel insurance after we had handed over her EHIC. They did, and the hospital took details, but as far as we know the insurance company were not charged as my friend never heard anything from them. I wonder if some hospitals are doing this as a way of ensuring that patients are covered for every eventuality (repatriation, for example) that an EHIC might not cover?

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Yes it possibly could happen, but that is not what the complaint is all about.

It is about patients with a perfect right to treatment in a State hospital being knowingly and deliberately sent away to private clinics, as has been fairly clearly demonstrated these past few days.

As I mentioned earlier it is nothing new, because the same thing happened to me quite a long time ago, despite the fact that I'd been warned about them trying it on, as they had done with others I knew back then.

What interests me is their motives for continuing this despicable practice ?

Are they getting backhanders ?
Are they trying to reduce their workload ?
Are they trying to ease the financial strain on the State resources ?

Whichever may be the case they surely are no doubt fully aware that their actions are wrong.

You may think the term despicable to be a little harsh, however consider the patient who feels absolutely desperate for treatment and is sent elsewhere.

Under such circumstances I think their actions stink to high heaven, as little doubt they are taking full advantage of a vulnerable person whose only thought is probably to get rapid treatment anywhere, regardless of who should do what and who will foot the bill. :thumbdown:

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

There really is no excuse for it ... according to today's Daily Mail, official figures published three weeks ago revealed how Britain spent £247 million treating Spanish citizens last year. However, Spain spent just £3.2 million treating British people.

When taking into account the fact that some younger expat residents may incorrectly use an EHIC card to obtain free treatment in Spain, it is a very small amount, considering the number of British tourists and holidaymakers who visit Spain every year.

Sort of suggests that the Spanish aren't averse to a bit of 'health tourism' themselves?

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

What a load of b*llocks

Can you show the sources of those figures.

Given that there are half of million Brits in Spain and less than 100,000 Spaniards in the UK this cannot be true. And also given that many more Brits come on holiday to Spain than Spaniards who go to the UK

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

This is the link http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-tourists.html

Have to say, I cannot understand either how the figures could be true...

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

I see that the Daily Mail do not put a source for the figures either

The DM should be shut down, isnt it illegal in the UK now to spout off hate towards other nationalities?

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

if I ever do move to spain I will definitely take out private medical insurance, I feel its the only way to be sure..........

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

And it is surprisingly cheap if you shop around.

Not a lot of use though if you have a load of pre-existing conditions.

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

I have high blood pressure and hi cholesterol but I had these when I joined the Benenden Health scheme here which costs me£7 a month and accepts pre existing conditions, theres not much point in taking out insurance against something you already have if they wont insure you. As with all insurance, you have to read the small print and worth getting a solicitor to look through it beforehand. For the cost it would be well worth it I think.
You hear so much about people holidaying in spain, being taken ill or having an accident and the insurance companies finding a way out so its not just the Spanish - lets face it , all insurance is a big rip off............

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

I would not be too upset if I read that the local hospital in Mallorca had refused to accept this guy's EHIC card:-


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...y-Majorca.html

Why do these idiots persist in this kind of behaviour? I bet travel insurers would not pay out if the insured person had been indulging in something so dangerous, so why should the British taxpayer have to pay? Or the resources of a Spanish public hospital be tied up in dealing with it, even if the UK picks up the bill eventually.

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Don't know what the attraction of balcony hopping is for British youth:rolleyes: That is the problem with cheapie booze and sun holidays. Perhaps insurance should be made compulsory!

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

But don't travel insurance policies have standard exclusion clauses for dangerous pursuits - and you don't get many more dangerous than jumping off balconies or climbing from one to another!

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Unless you are autonomo or a pensioner, you wouldn't have much choice if you want to be covered!

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

I said in the original thread on this issue (Spanish state hospitals refusing to accept EHIC cards) that I would like to know some figures to demonstrate the real scale of this problem.

Well, now I know. In today's Sur in English (unfortunately I can't post a link because the story doesn't seem to be on their website yet, only in the pdf version of the online paper) is an article which states that the EC has complained to Spain about 20 such cases (that's 20 across the whole of Spain). For four of those cases they supplied supporting documentation, and three of those four related to the Costa del Sol Hospital in Marbella, where according to a hospital spokesperson 85,000 foreigners are treated each year. 3 out of 85,000 is an absolutely miniscule proportion, and I am now confirmed in my belief that (surprise, surprise) this story was greatly exaggerated by the British tabloid press.

This is of course a separate issue to tourists either presenting themselves at private hospitals for treatment, because they aren't aware of the distinction (easily done especially in the stress of an emergency situation) and where naturally an EHIC card will not be accepted, or being directed to such hospitals by hotel staff or taxi drivers who may be receiving financial inducement to send them there. There isn't much that can be done about that except raising awareness amongst tourists of the need to make sure it is a state hospital they go to.

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

So you automatically believe sur in English:huh:

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Given the conspicuous absence of any concrete figures in any of the British press reports, I have seen nothing to contradict it. I wondered why none of them included the numbers (well no, I didn't actually).

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

I work in a private clinic - very small, just my husband and me. Several times a week, I get someone in with their EHIC asking if they can use it with us. They are always very surprised when i say No and that they can only use it in the Spanish state system and that the nearest centro de salud is a 15 min taxi journey away. The Uk government was very good at advertising the use of the EHIC advising everyone to get one, but use of it has caused some confusion to the traveller. People also believe that the card holds all sorts of information about them and that i can somehow use it to tap into their records in the UK
As far as financial inducements, thats the bit that annoys me and the more people can be made aware of this practice and what they should be asking for, the better.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvxzJjmEhiE

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Many thanks for finding this. It puts my mind at rest. :thumbup:

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Now come on try and be serious, Stevie, even if it's just for this once.

Is anyone naive enough to believe that the EU would even bother considering a case, let alone pressing forward with it, if it only applied to those twenty cases ?

As has already been made clear the numbers in the UK alone are far, far in excess of that and then take into account that there are 27 countries in the EU many of which have also put forward their complaints.

Are you really stupid enough to believe that the EU would try to bring forward documentation and everything else involved, on every single case they have been presented with ?

I would have thought it is fairly obvious to anyone with even half a brain cell that the cases presented are simply to prove their point to the Spanish authorities.

To put forward the full documentation of every single case brought to their attention would be ridiculous even by their own standards and probably keep them busy for the next fifty years or more.

I know you prefer to live in cloud cuckoo land, but what's the point of making it so obvious ?

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Are they so lazy that they couldn't be bothered supplying the documentation for the other 16 cases they included in the complaint? Or could it be that there isn't any?

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

I would have thought it only basic common sense just to supply enough evidence to the Spanish authorities to prove that it is actually happening.
Beyond that what's the point ?
To get involved in making a case and supplying whatever evidence is required on even a small percentage of the total number of complaints involved would more than likely be mind boggling.

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Sorry Dick, but I hear the distinct sound of straws being clutched at in your responses.

I believe what has happened is that the British press has lumped together the two separate elements of this problem
a) the small number of people who have been refused treatment with an EHIC by Spanish public hospitals, and
b) the larger number of people who have been unable to use their EHIC at a private clinic or hospital, in some instances because they have been deliberately directed there.

in order to make a better story. It is perfectly obvious that no actual figures whatsoever were included in any of the British press reports, just vague statements like "an alarming number", "an increased number of complaints" and so on.

Mary's experience bears out the fact that many tourists still aren't aware that private establishments will not accept EHIC's, even after to my certain knowledge the British consulates have highlighted this issue every year for the past 3 years at least.

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Laughable how the happy clappers hang on to something published in a Spanish ex-pat newspaper:lol: The official EU Commission press release talks about "an increasing number of complaints" ...not just from the UK either! Here it is:

http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release....htm?locale=en

Re: Healthcare in Spain
 

Not hard to see who needs the straws.

I could probably pick up on that many cases myself from my small circle of friends and acquaintances back in TF if I was still in touch with them, plus my own personal experience as well.
The mere tiniest of tiny drops in the ocean.
If you want to join Stevie in cloud cuckoo land then I wish you all the best.

As I mentioned before my concern is not only that it is happening, but why it is happening.
A coincidence maybe but strangely enough the private clinic to which myself and my friends were repeatedly being redirected was right next door to the state clinic.
Makes you think a bit eh, considering the slightly less than impecable record regarding corruption that seems to exist down here ?