Gibraltar 2

Old Feb 13th 2019, 10:47 pm
  #1186  
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Default Re: Gibraltar 2

Originally Posted by MikeJ View Post
I'm getting a bit fed up with this. Whether you think it's a colony or not is neither here nor there since you are not the ICJ. I suggest you brush up on your history before you carry on with you ridiculous opinions. NI is populated mainly by Irish people, although a large number of Scots migrated there a couple of centuries ago. NI is part of the British Isles and could never have been considered a colony, despite the fact that the Republic of Ireland achieved independence it was a result of self determination and not decolonisation since it was never a colony. Neither is NI.
Gibraltar was ceded to England by the treaty of Utrecht at which time it became a British possession and was garrisoned with British troops. As it was a safe haven for many peoples from all over the Mediterranean area including Spain it soon became populated by a multicultural and multiracial community. At no time was it "colonised" as you put it (note it's colonised with an s not a z)

I am not going to continue banging my head against a wall trying to educate an ignoramus so you can have the last word!
A large number of Scots migrated there and were given land: colonised. The British colonised Ireland. They took the best land. At least don’t leave facts out that are convenient to your argument.
So just because NI is part of the British Isles it was never a colony? Are you for real?
Cromwell was only handing out sweets was he? As it happens my family is descended from the new model army.
NI is populated also by people who would consider themselves British only and wouldn’t have anything to do with being Irish.
Are you saying the Irish war of independence was only a bit of a laugh then while they were waiting for self determination and Northern Ireland was left there for the laugh too after 1922.
The troubles were just the result of those uppidy Paddys not being grateful enough? The British army were on the streets just for the laugh too...
Ok, call NI a country/statelet/province/compete **** up.
I’ll have to guess that the vast majority of people in Gibraltar would consider themselves British. Ok Gibraltar wasn’t colonised as Ireland was but I still see it as a colony. I’m wrong. I don’t care if it offends you. Sorry.

Last edited by criodain; Feb 13th 2019 at 11:10 pm.
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Old Feb 13th 2019, 11:48 pm
  #1187  
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Default Re: Gibraltar 2

If we take the following as a definition of colony, it can be argued that Gibraltar was a colony, but not necessarily a British one.

Colony
5. a number of people coming from the same country, or speaking the same language, residing in a foreign country or city, or a particular section of it; enclave:
Gibraltar as a colony

British Empire - Seizing the colony

Whether the locals agree or not, it was seen as a colony when Britain took it.
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Old Feb 14th 2019, 1:54 am
  #1188  
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Default Re: Gibraltar 2

Oh come on, Mike. "Colony" is just a word! Writing from a British Overseas Territory (a BOT,, no less!), I - like most of us here - casually refer to our Islands as a colony. We also speak of "gringo colonies" of English-speaking retirement communities in Mexico and other Latin American countries. When speaking of youngsters from the British Commonwealth and the USA living in London, people often refer to them as "colonials". We have a colony of fire-ants near our garbage bins... they're not necessarily a colony of any other group. It's just a word. Surely any resident of Gibraltar who resents being categorised (or categorized, indeed) as a colonial is being unnecessarily sensitive, and pedantic. How do the citizens of the Channel Islands react to their respective Islands being called "colonies"? I don't know, but I would hope they take it in a spirit of charity. Why wouldn't they?

"Province" is also mis-used. Although it's perfectly reasonable to refer to Britain (oops, the United Kingdom, I mean!) as a province of the EU, there are probably some who would object to that. I guess...!
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Old Feb 14th 2019, 8:19 am
  #1189  
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Default Re: Gibraltar 2

I've dragged the thread off topic. Yup, colony is just a word. That's how I see Gib and NI. I have no desire as such to see it returned to Spain. I think the Spanish right wing are provoking provoking all the time in any case, using loaded language (much like the Brexiteers).
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Old Feb 14th 2019, 5:47 pm
  #1190  
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Default Re: Gibraltar 2

Originally Posted by Gordon Barlow View Post
Oh come on, Mike. "Colony" is just a word! Writing from a British Overseas Territory (a BOT,, no less!), I - like most of us here - casually refer to our Islands as a colony. We also speak of "gringo colonies" of English-speaking retirement communities in Mexico and other Latin American countries. When speaking of youngsters from the British Commonwealth and the USA living in London, people often refer to them as "colonials". We have a colony of fire-ants near our garbage bins... they're not necessarily a colony of any other group. It's just a word. Surely any resident of Gibraltar who resents being categorised (or categorized, indeed) as a colonial is being unnecessarily sensitive, and pedantic. How do the citizens of the Channel Islands react to their respective Islands being called "colonies"? I don't know, but I would hope they take it in a spirit of charity. Why wouldn't they?

"Province" is also mis-used. Although it's perfectly reasonable to refer to Britain (oops, the United Kingdom, I mean!) as a province of the EU, there are probably some who would object to that. I guess...!
I think you are missing the point here. The locals may be more relaxed about what they are called if it did not have political implications. Spanish insistence on the status of Gibraltar as a colony is an attempt to bring the subject back up at the United nations (specifically the Special Committee on Decolonization) which oversees the path to independence of former colonies and of course in the case of Gibraltar there is no path to independence without being given to Spain whose constitution does not permit independence to any region (hence why 10 years later they still do not recognise Kosovan independence from Serbia).
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Old Feb 14th 2019, 8:57 pm
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Default Re: Gibraltar 2

Originally Posted by EllisG View Post
I think you are missing the point here. The locals may be more relaxed about what they are called if it did not have political implications. Spanish insistence on the status of Gibraltar as a colony is an attempt to bring the subject back up at the United nations (specifically the Special Committee on Decolonization) which oversees the path to independence of former colonies and of course in the case of Gibraltar there is no path to independence without being given to Spain whose constitution does not permit independence to any region (hence why 10 years later they still do not recognise Kosovan independence from Serbia).
No, I understand the point all right, Ellis. And if we were having this conversation in Gib with Spaniards listening in, I might be silent - or maybe not. But this is a world-wide BE thread, and we really shouldn't need to be politically correct here. Cayman's politicians too have been hauled before the UN's Committee of 24 or whatever the decolonisation committee is called these days, and have been chastised there for not going independent. So we know what the Gibbers are up against. Believe me, it doesn't matter what they call their little rock. They should call it a colony at every opportunity, just to piss of the enemy.
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Old Feb 15th 2019, 9:14 pm
  #1192  
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Default Re: Gibraltar 2

Wow! An actual discussion on this thread. It makes a change from the endless boring news reports quoted from the Gibraltar press.

Keep it up guys, I’m enjoying it!

Pity that our only Gibraltar resident, so far is not getting involved.

Last edited by Fred James; Feb 15th 2019 at 9:17 pm.
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Old Feb 16th 2019, 11:02 am
  #1193  
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Default Re: Gibraltar 2

Well said Fred, you can read the Gib.newspaper if you are so inclined.To be a little bit naughty...I go to Gib.sometimes from southern Spain as I have a bank account there & like to keep up to date & it is a little break also.Why,you may ask,have I a bank balance there?That's because the British Govn.don't allow me one in UK,so instead of adding to the British economy I help Gibraltar instead which to my elderly feeble mind doesn't make sense.Whatever you want to call that big lump of rock I personally think our good old Winston C.has a lot to answer for.Those blinkin' apes are absolutely out of control making some areas "no-go livable places"& since they are protected you can't even defend your property.I gave up wanting to buy one of the properties which were being renovated into apartments from previous military units.
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Old Feb 16th 2019, 11:12 am
  #1194  
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Default Re: Gibraltar 2

Originally Posted by Fred James View Post
Wow! An actual discussion on this thread. It makes a change from the endless boring news reports quoted from the Gibraltar press.

Keep it up guys, I’m enjoying it!

Pity that our only Gibraltar resident, so far is not getting involved.
oi ....he's not the only one
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Old Feb 16th 2019, 8:45 pm
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Default Re: Gibraltar 2

Originally Posted by dougal03 View Post
Well said Fred, you can read the Gib.newspaper if you are so inclined.To be a little bit naughty...I go to Gib.sometimes from southern Spain as I have a bank account there & like to keep up to date & it is a little break also.Why,you may ask,have I a bank balance there?That's because the British Govn.don't allow me one in UK,so instead of adding to the British economy I help Gibraltar instead which to my elderly feeble mind doesn't make sense.
I've been in (on?) Gib only twice, but liked it both times. The first time in 1975 or '76 when we were living in Fuengirola - the Spanish immigration officers were on a go-slow, I remember, in protest against Britain's "occupation"; the second time was for four or five days at some human-rights conference in 2004. That second time allowed me to wander around the graveyards and be impressed with the number of British soldiers who died there on their ways to or from India in times gone by. I've recommended it ever since.

When Barclays made me move my bank account out of England 20 or 30 years ago, because I wasn't a resident there (bastards!), I didn't even think to move my account to Gib. I wish I had; instead, I shifted it to the Isle of Man, and the buggers kicked me out of there too, some years later. I have bad-mouthed Barclays ever since!
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Old Feb 16th 2019, 8:58 pm
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You mention graveyards in Gib. I was very impressed with the one that contains the remains of many British sailors who died in the battle of Trafalgar. Many visitors fail to see that as it is tucked away but well worth a visit.

I’ve been going there on and off for about 25 years. We spent a few years sailing around the Med and Gib was always an interesting place to refuel and take on real duty free goods and spend a few days exploring.

Now we live permanently in Spain we rarely go. The attractions of Morrisons for English goods has waned now that Iceland have a shop in Fuengirola.

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Old Feb 17th 2019, 4:35 pm
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Default Re: Gibraltar 2

Originally Posted by Gordon Barlow View Post
When Barclays made me move my bank account out of England 20 or 30 years ago, because I wasn't a resident there (bastards!), I didn't even think to move my account to Gib. I wish I had; instead, I shifted it to the Isle of Man, and the buggers kicked me out of there too, some years later. I have bad-mouthed Barclays ever since!
Barclays closed down here a few years ago so your account would have ended up in the same place anyway
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Old Feb 17th 2019, 4:40 pm
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Default Re: Gibraltar 2

Originally Posted by Fred James View Post
You mention graveyards in Gib. I was very impressed with the one that contains the remains of many British sailors who died in the battle of Trafalgar. Many visitors fail to see that as it is tucked away but well worth a visit.

I’ve been going there on and off for about 25 years. We spent a few years sailing around the Med and Gib was always an interesting place to refuel and take on real duty free goods and spend a few days exploring.

Now we live permanently in Spain we rarely go. The attractions of Morrisons for English goods has waned now that Iceland have a shop in Fuengirola.
There are many gems tucked away on this rock just stay on foot and be prepared to climb to them
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Old Feb 23rd 2019, 8:04 am
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Default Re: Gibraltar 2

Originally Posted by dougal03 View Post
Those blinkin' apes are absolutely out of control making some areas "no-go livable places"& since they are protected you can't even defend your property.I gave up wanting to buy one of the properties which were being renovated into apartments from previous military units.
42 years living in Gib and only once have I seen Monkeys or Macaques near my home
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Old Feb 23rd 2019, 8:04 am
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Default Re: Gibraltar 2

Originally Posted by Fred James View Post
You mention graveyards in Gib. I was very impressed with the one that contains the remains of many British sailors who died in the battle of Trafalgar. Many visitors fail to see that as it is tucked away but well worth a visit.
Trafalgar cemetery previously known as Southport Ditch is believed to contain only 2 people from the Battle of Trafalgar

Other cemeteries include
North Front 1756 and still in use today , vey crowded, We have only recently aquired a crematorium.
:
Jews Gate 1765 - 1850 can be seen on a trip up the rock

Witham's Cemetery 1765 - 1850 named after Captain Witham from the 18th century who was involved in a number of sieges.View from my flat My other view is over the Bay of Gibraltar to Spain, Ceuta and Tangier.


View from my flat
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