YMF

This article in El Pais makes scary reading.
"Up against a brick wall
During Spain's decade-long property boom, thousands of buildings were illegally constructed in protected areas
Getting them demolished is proving a challenge"

Wouldn't they fight to protect the home they bought in good faith and paid taxes on at the time and continue to pay taxes on to the local council?

Yvonne

olivefarmer

Idiots.

agoreira

I suspect the lack of interest in your thread is that most of the members hate to admit there is anything wrong with Spain, that there is corruption on a unprecedented scale, that all the Brits caught up in these massive scandals left their brains on the aircraft and it's purely down to them for the sad state they find themselves in.
Forget the hundreds of thousands of illegal builds in Spain, if you could find a case of an illegal house in UK and posted that, you'd be swamped with replies! I posted an almost identical article recently, I wish you luck, you have my sympathy, I can imagine what you must be going through. http://sociedad.elpais.com/sociedad/...30_335439.html

amideislas

I have to question what exactly, is (or was) "illegal? Was it simply that nobody registered the build or attempted to, and blatantly built without any attempt to do it legally?

Or was it that the regulations were designed in such a way that made it nearly impossible to build "legally" without paying someone off.

Or were some of the properties actually "legal" at one time, but then later some Einstein decided they weren't anymore, simply because he or she didn't get their cut.

If you compare the number of supposedly "illegal" properties in Spain with the number in other countries, you have to wonder what is actually the reason for it.

Blaming it all on a few foreigners is very short-sighted. Why don't foreigners engage in this equally elsewhere then?

jackytoo

Or were some of the properties actually "legal" at one time, but then later some Einstein decided they weren't anymore, simply because he or she didn't get their cut.

That seems to be the problem, certainly in Axarquia. Retrospective planning laws from the Junta to curb the excesses of small tinpot Mayors. There seems to be a consensus amongst the Spanish that it is the foreigners fault...along with a lot of Brit appeasers too The I'm alright Jacks are alive and well!

cricketman

Well not exactly

The situation is that there were many corrupt town mayors who gave permission for vast developments on their village/town land, knowing that they were actually illegal according to national and regional town planning laws

But they gave the go ahead anyway because they personally got a slice of the action, and the property taxes boosted the coffers of the ayuntamiento

They concluded that by the time national or regional law caught up with them, then they would already be out of office and have several million in a Swiss bank account

It doesnt help that everytime PP are in power nationally they say that they will not apply national planning laws, but every time PSOE are in, they say they will demolish illegal buildings. So it is a political game.

Individually as a house buyer, it is your respoinsibility to know the law or hire a lawyer who can explain it to you. Then you decide whether to take the risk or not. Unfortunately as an outsider, it is difficult to know which lawyer to trust, or what the risks actually are

jjh

I haven´t replied as I know YMF. There are so many illegal houses in Chiclana that it´s difficult to know what is and what isn´t.

Also, I don´t know one person, who has bought here in the last 10 years, that hasn´t been badly advised.

We now have a new, NEW town plan, if we can get to see it, which means the goalposts have been moved yet again.

agoreira

Agree, but you'll still get the "plastic Spanish" here insisting that it's all your fault! You have only yourselves to blame. Stupid, I know, but that's what they'll be telling you. Nobody buying in a foreign country can be expected to know property law inside out, so you employ a man that does, a local lawyer. That ensures everything is 100% safe, doesn't it? Well in a lot of countries it might do, in Spain it means anything but that. True, you might be lucky and get a legal house, but all too often that's not the case.

Looking on the bright side, whilst some have seen some horrendous drops in the value of their property, you might be able to pick up a real bargain, just make sure it's legal. A local lawyer maybe?

amideislas

I have always been given plenty of reason to believe that the system makes it necessary to engage in "dodgy" things to succeed at anything.

Those who naively play it perfectly straight have traditionally been the losers in far too many cases. But I admit that's changing for the better.

EMR

As we all know none of the EXpat estate agents, british sales companies like Atlas , MRI, Paradour etc had nothing to do with the problems.
They were as innocent as the poor buyers they helped to dupe.

me me

Typical.

ALL PRACTISING LAWYERS SHOULD BE TRUSTWORTHY OR STRUCK OFF.

cricketman

Of course they should.

I do not have enough information to know if they are or not. From my experience with Brits on the Costas, so much gets lost in translation that it is impossible to know what they actually have and have not been told.

For me, I would want to know the law backwards before committing to an expensive purchase in a country I do not know. There are things you can do to spot a good lawyer, but I can see that for someone with no local contacts and no cultural references how difficult this could be.

jackytoo

It shouldn't have to be like that. All Lawyers should be impeccable. Other countries mange to get it right. Why pay a dog and have to bark yourself.

me me

Well obviously they are not struck off, because all those that did the paperwork on illegal houses, did not due their duty with enough care and attention or got a nice little sum on the side, either way despicable..

You make it sound as though only Brits who don´t speak the language get ripped off, although they are in great numbers of those who have had the misfortune to find themselves in this position.

As for knowing the "law backwards" as a lay person, who does that, not even the Spanish property buyers. THAT IS WHY THEY HIRE A LAWYER IN THE FIRST PLACE.

It is the lawyer who should know the law.

Why should a client have to know the "ins and outs" of anything when they are paying a professional?

Because according to you, you would not be satisfied with seeing the lawyers premises and the certificates on the wall.

When you go to the dentist for a filling, Do you check that the instruments are fully sterile, do you check the mix of the filling to be put in your tooth, do you check that the dentist has drilled deep enough, or that he is using the right drill?


I don´t know anyone who does that, of course, being you, you will tell me different.

So if a dentist can be trusted to fix your teeth without you knowing the procedure "backwards", why shouldn´t we be able to trust a lawyer to do it right when dealing with a house purchase?

Oh don´t answer that, as we all know you have a sister in law, who is a tax lawyer, so possibly you know about a lot of "shenanegins" that we don´t know about.

One of the major problems in Spain is that people (think CMAN as a prime example) put the blame on the "victim" instead of the professional who has duped them.

In that respect you have a more Spanish attitude than either JLFS or myself.

jjh

And what about all the local Chiclaneros or Las Isletas, from San Fernando, who do have local contacts and have been duped? It´s not all ex-pats that have bought these illegal houses.