Spineless
Aug 11th 2015, 5:37 am
#1
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Joined: Feb 2011
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Spineless
What's the most spineless thing anyone has ever done to you / about you / with you / for you?
Is it always best to face the music or is the sense of satisfaction that you owned up / fronted it actually worthless pride?
I just had somebody drop out that we've bent over backwards at times for to extend notice, to bump the cash up a bit etc. 6 days before starting and email - 'not joining'.
In fairness, they took the call and grovelled. Basically been bought back, I didn't even have the strength, will or patience to explain they'll be on the market again in X Months time. Even though the explanation came and the conversation was polite and I accept they've made a decision etc, it's still a bridge probably burned so smashing it down or taking it gently.... the end result is just the same, right?
I think it looked weak sending an email with no explanation. But everyone is different...ultimately it just means I have to do the work again, this time with a hoard breathing down my ****ing neck.
Is it always best to face the music or is the sense of satisfaction that you owned up / fronted it actually worthless pride?
I just had somebody drop out that we've bent over backwards at times for to extend notice, to bump the cash up a bit etc. 6 days before starting and email - 'not joining'.
In fairness, they took the call and grovelled. Basically been bought back, I didn't even have the strength, will or patience to explain they'll be on the market again in X Months time. Even though the explanation came and the conversation was polite and I accept they've made a decision etc, it's still a bridge probably burned so smashing it down or taking it gently.... the end result is just the same, right?
I think it looked weak sending an email with no explanation. But everyone is different...ultimately it just means I have to do the work again, this time with a hoard breathing down my ****ing neck.
Aug 11th 2015, 6:54 am
#2
Hit 16's
Joined: Mar 2010
Location: Of all the gin joints, in all the towns, in all the world, she walks into mine
Posts: 13,112
Re: Spineless
), and realised that your talking about a candidate who pulled out at the last moment, and he's someone who you bent over backwards to help.I think you need to take a step back and take a wider view. By putting himself forward for a new position he's indicating that he's interested in it. It doesn't mean either a) he's definitely going to take it, or b) he's obliged in any way to take it even if he's offered it.
Employers constantly change their minds, plus they often keep candidates hanging on till the last moment while they debate, defer, deliberate, delay and are finally ready to select one from many. I get really pissed off with recruiters who believe that I have some form of obligation to take a job if the prospective employer offers it, despite them (the recruiter) spouting the usual HR mantras. I know it's your commission hanging on the line, but candidates shouldn't give a flying **** about that. I've pissed off a few agents along the line, who got really shitty when I turned down offers (usually because I was expecting another, more attractive offer--which is the equivalent of the employer keeping candidates waiting till they can chose the best one--or, because after interview and due consideration, I decided that the position wasn't right for me--which is equivalent to an employer putting a candidate through numerous interviews, only to say they've got someone else more suited to the position).
If more employers actually acted as if they believed that their employees are their greatest asset, they wouldn't treat prospective ones as just a commodity during the selection process.
So, on this occasion Scamp, not a lot of sympathy.
Aug 11th 2015, 7:02 am
#3
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Nov 2012
Location: bute
Posts: 9,740
Re: Spineless
Bahtatbpy, you are prejudiced against those who are doing an honest day's graft, hunting heads ! !
Aug 11th 2015, 7:08 am
#4
Hit 16's
Joined: Mar 2010
Location: Of all the gin joints, in all the towns, in all the world, she walks into mine
Posts: 13,112
Aug 11th 2015, 7:54 am
#5
**** it we'll do it live
Joined: Oct 2004
Location: Dubai
Posts: 7,892
Re: Spineless
turning down an offer etc is perfectly fair enough after all there's no commitment yet on either side. Signing a contract and backing out at the last minute is just a wank move, that ****s up way more people than just the recruiter
Aug 11th 2015, 8:00 am
#6
Hit 16's
Joined: Mar 2010
Location: Of all the gin joints, in all the towns, in all the world, she walks into mine
Posts: 13,112
Re: Spineless
Agreed. I didn't read Scamp's post to the effect that the candidate had actually signed a contract...
Aug 11th 2015, 8:12 am
#7
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Joined: Feb 2011
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Re: Spineless
Got through your tangled English eventually (), and realised that your talking about a candidate who pulled out at the last moment, and he's someone who you bent over backwards to help.
I think you need to take a step back and take a wider view. By putting himself forward for a new position he's indicating that he's interested in it. It doesn't mean either a) he's definitely going to take it, or b) he's obliged in any way to take it even if he's offered it.
Employers constantly change their minds, plus they often keep candidates hanging on till the last moment while they debate, defer, deliberate, delay and are finally ready to select one from many. I get really pissed off with recruiters who believe that I have some form of obligation to take a job if the prospective employer offers it, despite them (the recruiter) spouting the usual HR mantras. I know it's your commission hanging on the line, but candidates shouldn't give a flying **** about that. I've pissed off a few agents along the line, who got really shitty when I turned down offers (usually because I was expecting another, more attractive offer--which is the equivalent of the employer keeping candidates waiting till they can chose the best one--or, because after interview and due consideration, I decided that the position wasn't right for me--which is equivalent to an employer putting a candidate through numerous interviews, only to say they've got someone else more suited to the position).
If more employers actually acted as if they believed that their employees are their greatest asset, they wouldn't treat prospective ones as just a commodity during the selection process.
So, on this occasion Scamp, not a lot of sympathy.
), and realised that your talking about a candidate who pulled out at the last moment, and he's someone who you bent over backwards to help.I think you need to take a step back and take a wider view. By putting himself forward for a new position he's indicating that he's interested in it. It doesn't mean either a) he's definitely going to take it, or b) he's obliged in any way to take it even if he's offered it.
Employers constantly change their minds, plus they often keep candidates hanging on till the last moment while they debate, defer, deliberate, delay and are finally ready to select one from many. I get really pissed off with recruiters who believe that I have some form of obligation to take a job if the prospective employer offers it, despite them (the recruiter) spouting the usual HR mantras. I know it's your commission hanging on the line, but candidates shouldn't give a flying **** about that. I've pissed off a few agents along the line, who got really shitty when I turned down offers (usually because I was expecting another, more attractive offer--which is the equivalent of the employer keeping candidates waiting till they can chose the best one--or, because after interview and due consideration, I decided that the position wasn't right for me--which is equivalent to an employer putting a candidate through numerous interviews, only to say they've got someone else more suited to the position).
If more employers actually acted as if they believed that their employees are their greatest asset, they wouldn't treat prospective ones as just a commodity during the selection process.
So, on this occasion Scamp, not a lot of sympathy.
Sorry, wasn't very clear. Agreed offer, signed contract, client approved, resigned, due to start. The works.
I'm actually being a bit unfair, they at least got in contact and said they weren't joining - more than can be said for some.
Commission on this is irrelevant - i'm not earning any at the moment because in a different kind of role and just paid nicely to do the work regardless
Recruiters are *****, candidates are *****. The whole process and rigmarole is a **** and I'm adamant it's the hardest 'sell' because you're selling both ways to unpredictable, complicated monsters.
On the spineless front (to avoid it purely becoming a recruitment / candidate bash session) I've done some poor stuff in my time. I once left a job by simply never returning. Long and short of it was I had my shifts switched (part time whilst at college) permanently by doing a favour for a guy one weekend. Tried reasoning with an unreasonable boss. Was fixated on doing my Sunday activity which I loved and was being told I couldn't. So after a few weeks of pulling sickies I just stopped turning up.
Was pretty poor from me but felt quite hard done by at the time. Found another job, moved on. Probably could have been handled better by all parties but looking back I was pretty immature.
