Re: Scaremongering?
 

Ha ha ha, another display of your breathtaking naiveity.

Replace 'wealth' with 'oil' and you sum up this region perfectly.

Re: Scaremongering?
 

This isn't about Europe though.

Re: Scaremongering?
 

What about the Dutch? they're fairly chilled out.

Re: Scaremongering?
 

This wandered off topic remarkably quickly.

Re: Scaremongering?
 

They're very busy trying to forget they ever held an Empire

Re: Scaremongering?
 

the Friesland Liberation Army can be a nasty bunch with their sharpened cheeses!

Re: Scaremongering?
 

RLD?

Re: Scaremongering?
 

I can see RedShark's point in so far as if the standard of living were a little higher in Palestine/Iraq/Syria and there was as much economic suffering and envy of the west in Pakistan/Afghanistan etc the struggle wouldn't be as great. Who gives a fck about Israeli settlements when we live in our own (albeit Islamic themed) Lakes/Greens etc development in Ramallah/Gaza.

Re: Scaremongering?
 

So what exactly have you got your knickers in a twist about this time? You agree that the definition is accurate with regard to the Middle East, and no one here is denying Europe’s history. The fact Europe has a wealth of meaningful history doesn’t mean we can’t comment on the historical or present situation in the Middle East, indeed perhaps that history makes us better placed to do so.

Are you just demonstrating the usual Middle Eastern small-minded defensiveness, and inability to take criticism of any kind without seeing it as an insult, and throwing your toys out of the pram?

And, really, excluding the Scandinavians? That betrays your lack of knowledge of European history, ever heard of the Vikings? They were a peaceful lot.

Re: Scaremongering?
 

:goodpost:

Not even the wealth he talks of, the civilized, modern, integrated, cooperative unions that have been long established. The mechanisms that were set up to lower any chances of future conflicts.

Western Europe has been through all the tit-for-tat religious (etc) wars in the last X centuries. Some still exist but in the 'newer' countries it seems.

This whole region (Middle East) is still archaic in attitudes and still lets religion rule. The factions of those religions will continue to fight like the Protestant/Catholics did in England under different leaders throughout history (and still do if you look at Ireland/N.Ireland) etc.

I don't really know what I'm talking about sometimes but I definitely know that this region is ****ing light years behind Western Europe in it's maturity and ability to be sensible. Even 'Merica is way behind.

Re: Scaremongering?
 

But the very reason the standard of living is not higher is because of the tribal squabbling and religious sectarianism in the region, despite all allegedly being Arab Muslim brothers. Let us not forget this region is home to many of the greediest people in the world who could, if they wished, solve many of the regions economic and standard of living issues very quickly. Unfortunately the lure of giant yachts, holiday homes in Kensington and owning football clubs is more important – I forget which chapter of the Quran teaches about those things.

Re: Scaremongering?
 

I think the point here is that it was, in real terms, a very short time ago that Europe was a pretty uncivilised and constantly warring mass of loosely bordered countries (sound familiar?). It’s only relatively recently (the past 2 or 3 generations) that there has been significant and consistent improvement. By that token can we really sit in judgement of the Middle East, or should we just sit back let them get on with f**king each other over for another couple of generations and hope they eventually get tired of it and/or wipe each other out?

Re: Scaremongering?
 

I wonder if Red Shark is proud of his Muslim brothers in Rotherham?

Rotherham: failures led to sexual abuse of 1,400 children | Society | The Guardian

Re: Scaremongering?
 

Yeah, maybe you're right, Minnow. Europe is only about wealth. But, once again, your inability to think, appreciate, reflect and consider wider implications leads you to equate wealth to money. The following are some of the examples of Europe’s wealth which are in addition to, and the product of, industrious, collaborative and flexible peoples:

• A secure place to live
• Self-sufficiency in food production and water
• Freedom of religion
• Freedom of speech and thought
• Freedom of sexual orientation
• Rule of law
• Absence of slavery or practices equivalent to slavery
• Democratic institutions
• Universal suffrage
• Universal education
• Equal opportunities, regardless of gender, race or religion
• Absence (or minimal existence) of corruption
• Abundant cultural opportunities accessible to all

And although not everything’s rosy in the garden, there are checks and balances which come into play to try to right the situation.

That is wealth.

Re: Scaremongering?
 

redShark
This message has been deleted by mikewot. Reason: You've been told, very often, not to go wandering off the subject.

Bloody Hell Mikewot.... if you deleted everybody's posts that wander off the subject, this bored would be quieter than it is now!!