britexpat76

But an evangelical Christian, Hindu or Buddhist will say the same as you above. So who is right? With the current religion business model you are all sending each other to hell.

Yoohoo

My very religious mother says exactly those same words. She's not Muslim.

Her religion doesn't preach that you, an unbeliver, will go to Hell though - you simply won't be given as many bonus points as she's going to get.

redShark

like I said, the religion of truth has to satisfy both the heart and the mind of a person. No doubt all religions in the world are able to satisfy the former, otherwise they would’nt be able to have followers in the first place. The acid test for any religion is to satisfy the mind, i.e provide logical explanations as to the basic of its faith. This simple basic faith question is enough to reveal the logic of any faith, ‘who is behind the creation’. In the faith of all the religions you mentioned there is utter confusion as to that question, and their answer mostly boils down to the idea that the creator is contained in the Time and Space, which to me is illogical because the next damming question will be who then created this creator!!

shiva

Logic and faith do not make good bedfellows as you yourself have just pointed out

Boomhauer

Red, your contention that Allah exists but the laws of physics dictate life on earth is contradictory of not just the Quran but Abrahamic religion that preceded and is the base for Islam.

Throughout Abrahmic religion starting with Judaism, we see that the monotheistic god Muslims call Allah has directly intervened in human life. If you ascribe to the laws of science for life on earth then you must know that science can not prove the existence of Allah and infact rational and logical thinking would rule out there being such a supernatural entity.

britexpat76

You didnt answer the Question. Anyone that believes is going to hell as another religion has condemned you by believing in something else.

I actually think the only ones that will make it into a heaven are athiests - As most religions promote forgiveness and no one else is there to condemn us for worshipping the wrong god.............

shiva

If, and it's a huge if, there is a god and heaven then from what I can see its atheists who are getting in.

God gave us free will, atheists ignore god, act under own free will, don't judge or condemn, ironically adhering to more religious tennents than most of those with faith, atheists die, arrive at pearly gates and get the keys to the kingdom for doing the right thing regardless if dogma.

redShark

I wonder who gave you the liberty to speak on behalf of science and scientists? You are of that type of people that Albert Einshtein despised, look at what he said:

“"In view of such harmony in the cosmos which I, with my limited human mind, am able to recognize, there are yet people who say there is no God. But what really makes me angry is that they quote me for the support of such views.”

redShark

I already answered your question and told you to use the faculty of the brain as your only guide. What you are suggesting is similar to that cancer patient who says: since there are so many different medical healers in the world, who all claim they have right treatments for my illnesses then that means that they are all wrong, and since I am feeling fine right now therefore, I don’t need to seek cure. I am sure you find his idea ridiculous, but I can assure you that you are doing exactly the same thing to your soul, which too suffers from illinesess

The reason why people seek medicat treatment for their bodies is because the effect of the illnesses is immediate on the body and that is why they are desperate for a real authentic treatment. The illness in the soul, however, is like a rot, slowly but surely eats at you and without the real treatment the tragic outset is inevitable , but not in this life.

redShark

So the creator gave you a free will and your reply to him is I don’t need you. Let me tell you why you are wrong from an Islamic perspective, and it starts from this first question, ‘why we are here in this life’. The Quran has provided an answer, we are here on earth to represent the creator, the Quran used an Arabic word similar to the English word ‘vicegerent’. In other words our job here is to complete the harmony on earth which is part of his creation. Unlike plants, animals and trees which are doing the same job but without a will, we humans were actually given a will, i.e a choice as to whether or not do this job properly. The creator did not leave us alone, however. He gave us instructions in the form of revelations on how to carry out this job. Now, let me give you an example that explains what you are actually suggesting. Imagine Obama sending an envoy to a troubled region with strict instructions of what to do to bring about peace. Imagine now if this envoy after arriving there, and with his limited knowledge of the whole region decided that he does not need Obama’s instructions. He ignored Obama’s orders and started acting and doing things his way (trial and error way) and plunged the whole region into further ciaos. In the light of justice, therefore, it would be quite logical if Obama punishes this envoy when he comes back, but your argument, however, suggests that Obama should rather reward that envoy for being brave enough to be disloyal!!

Meow

We aren't here for any specific purpose. We're just here by way of a long line of coincidences and random actions. That's how the universe works.

shiva

I give up your trolling powers are too mighty for me

Boomhauer

Anyone can speak on behalf of science since it is a system that is based on provable facts.People use science to back up or shoot down claims in everyday life, so why do I or anyone else need some sort of 'permission'.

What was the point of quoting Einstein, since a) I did not quote Einstean and b) it is a fallacy to appeal to authority.

You didn't answer my question, all you did was deliberately deflect it , which says a lot about you and your argument.

Bahtatboy

What about all the poor bastards who were born more than 1,434 years ago, and therefore bereft of such revelations? Or other poor bastards who are born into a strict religion which forbids them from converting to Islam? They're doomed by circumstances, not their own choices. Hamdulilah?

redShark

Because you are repeating the same question that I have already answered earlier. I also gave you an example of the rain phenomenon which you chose not to comment on suggesting to me that you don’t have any answer. I, however, am going to be generous with you and will follow your line of argument that we need a scientific prof of God. What you really are asking for is a scientific experiment that allows you to communicate directly with the creator, i.e a measuring device that can detect his presence and measure him up, just like scientists do with the subatomic world. You will not find him in this way, I am afraid, because there is an error in this approach which is to do with the initial assumption. You’ve made the assumption that the creator exists in the physical world, when he actually does not. However, there is another line of argument quit similar to what you want but this time it is viable. In science we may not necessarily be able to reach a certain fact in the tangible way but we may be able to do so mathematically. In other words, since mathematics is hailed as the mother of all sciences, through which we can understand the world in a logical way, can mathematics help us to know who the creator is? The answer is yes, because the creator has left in this physical world a mathematical model that logically represents him, it is the numeral infinity, a model that represents the creator’s attribute mathematically . This numeral infinity is a well known figure to scientists that appears regularly in their formulas. So when I say to you that the creator is infinite in everything I have a mathematical model to back me up.

This is yet another prof to the Quranic claim that the creator has left the humans with no excuse to disbelieve in him