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British Expats (https://britishexpats.com/forum/)
-   The Sand Pit (https://britishexpats.com/forum/sand-pit-116/)
-   -   Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE (https://britishexpats.com/forum/sand-pit-116/illegal-tourists-drink-uae-706967/)

al dente Feb 26th 2011 5:04 am
Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
http://www.thenational.ae/news/uae-n...hol-conviction

The case illustrates what judges have called "confusing" rules about enforcement of alcohol regulations.

A chief prosecutor at the Dubai Public Prosecution said yesterday that tourists cannot get alcohol licences, making any consumption on their part technically illegal, even though it is sold in the hotels where they stay.

"I acknowledge that this is confusing and is a grey area to tourists, but to be on the safe side, they should not drink based on the fact it's an Islamic country," he said. "Tourists should stay away from trouble and not drink at all or drink in secret."

Lawyers, judges and police have said in recent months that although UAE law requires everyone - even tourists, in theory - to have an alcohol licence before drinking, the rule is not enforced as a matter of practicality.

Blue Cat Feb 26th 2011 10:18 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
laughable! won't do much for their economy if tourists didn't drink :rofl:

Meow Feb 26th 2011 11:06 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
It is such a ridiculous situation. I really don't see a good reason for licences (apart from the small amount of revenue they generate) as the country, Dubai especially, needs the revenue that alcohol sales generate, as well as to keep attracting tourists.

lionheart Feb 26th 2011 11:16 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Let's hope that the UK dailies pick-up this story and run with it. Will serve the greedy Emiratis right. Trying to attract business they cannot serve.

Jim Smith Feb 26th 2011 11:38 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by lionheart (Post 9203108)
Let's hope that the UK dailies pick-up this story and run with it. Will serve the greedy Emiratis right. Trying to attract business they cannot serve.
Plus it happened more than 4 months ago and not yet resolved!! Wonder if the guy still has a job etc, if he had one??

Boomhauer Feb 26th 2011 11:43 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
That sums up the Gulf, intentionally wishy washy laws to let the locals apply them in an inconsistent & biased manner and still claim to be good Muslims.

A US founder said how the US is meant to be a nation of laws and not of men; the opposite it true for the UAE.

DXBsocial Feb 26th 2011 12:39 pm
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by Meow (Post 9203097)
It is such a ridiculous situation. I really don't see a good reason for licences (apart from the small amount of revenue they generate) as the country, Dubai especially, needs the revenue that alcohol sales generate, as well as to keep attracting tourists.
I was told last week that there are something like only 30,000 current licences in circulation in Dubai. It only nets the gov't something like 160 aed per licence, so really what is the point?

The import and municipality taxes however make a shedload of cash, so the more sold the better it will be for them!

The Dean Feb 26th 2011 1:18 pm
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
When I was working for a Dubai 'government entity', I made a suggestion to the big boss that he thought was brilliant, and which would have solved this problem to everyone's satisfaction.

Issue 'Short Term Alcohol Licences' at Dubai Duty Free in the arrival terminals to any visitor that wants one. A nominal charge of say AED 30 would not deter anyone and would solve the legal anomaly of booze being on sale in hotels but technically banned.

I've been a bit out of touch lately, so could somebody please just confirm that this measure was indeed introduced..........? :huh:

al dente Feb 26th 2011 1:29 pm
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by The Dean (Post 9203275)
When I was working for a Dubai 'government entity', I made a suggestion to the big boss that he thought was brilliant, and which would have solved this problem to everyone's satisfaction.

Issue 'Short Term Alcohol Licences' at Dubai Duty Free in the arrival terminals to any visitor that wants one. A nominal charge of say AED 30 would not deter anyone and would solve the legal anomaly of booze being on sale in hotels but technically banned.

I've been a bit out of touch lately, so could somebody please just confirm that this measure was indeed introduced..........? :huh:
Now that is a solution, so of course, not implemented.

Autonomy Feb 26th 2011 3:02 pm
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by The Dean (Post 9203275)
When I was working for a Dubai 'government entity', I made a suggestion to the big boss that he thought was brilliant, and which would have solved this problem to everyone's satisfaction.

Issue 'Short Term Alcohol Licences' at Dubai Duty Free in the arrival terminals to any visitor that wants one. A nominal charge of say AED 30 would not deter anyone and would solve the legal anomaly of booze being on sale in hotels but technically banned.

I've been a bit out of touch lately, so could somebody please just confirm that this measure was indeed introduced..........? :huh:
While I applaud your initiative, the whole thing is ridiculous. What is the point of the license? It's against the law for Muslims to drink - so why the need for a license that I have never been asked to show except in government regulated and 30% taxed shops. Never once anywhere else.

It's a total sham, confusing and intentionally so....

lionheart Feb 26th 2011 3:05 pm
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
More UAE justice.:frown::eek::thumbdown:

al dente Feb 26th 2011 3:11 pm
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
It's a law that purposefully tries to ensure that the majority of expats are in the wrong should there be any altercation. No need to proof anything else, just do a blood test.

Spugsy Feb 26th 2011 4:01 pm
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by al dente (Post 9202744)
http://www.thenational.ae/news/uae-n...hol-conviction

The case illustrates what judges have called "confusing" rules about enforcement of alcohol regulations.

A chief prosecutor at the Dubai Public Prosecution said yesterday that tourists cannot get alcohol licences, making any consumption on their part technically illegal, even though it is sold in the hotels where they stay.

"I acknowledge that this is confusing and is a grey area to tourists, but to be on the safe side, they should not drink based on the fact it's an Islamic country," he said. "Tourists should stay away from trouble and not drink at all or drink in secret."

Lawyers, judges and police have said in recent months that although UAE law requires everyone - even tourists, in theory - to have an alcohol licence before drinking, the rule is not enforced as a matter of practicality.
'you should drink in secret - WHAT??

Boomhauer Feb 26th 2011 5:02 pm
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by al dente (Post 9203439)
It's a law that purposefully tries to ensure that the majority of expats are in the wrong should there be any altercation. No need to proof anything else, just do a blood test.
That is an outstanding point:thumbup:, and I don't use the word outstanding flippantly. I never thought of that. Bloody cunning of the local authorities.

Ethos83 Feb 26th 2011 5:10 pm
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Got to say...I was left wondering what his actual nationality...er...skin colour is?

That he stayed with a friend in Deira caught my attention. Very few white Britons live in Deira and if I had to bet on anything it'd be this poor bloke is a British Asian or even British African. If he was white he'd be slapped with a fine and perhaps a night or two in jail. But four months in jail?

Methinks it's the police pulling a racist act and abusing their power to have a bit of fun.

Jim Smith Feb 26th 2011 5:53 pm
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
It only nets the gov't something like 160 aed per licence, so really what is the point?



But they give you a voucher for the 160 Dhms to claim back booze to that value, so net profit for Govt from licence in nil!

lionheart Feb 27th 2011 3:36 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by Jim Smith (Post 9203650)
It only nets the gov't something like 160 aed per licence, so really what is the point?But they give you a voucher for the 160 Dhms to claim back booze to that value, so net profit for Govt from licence in nil!
No, the voucher is issued by the retailer to ensure that you shop there rather than driving to Barracuda and avoid paying tax. This year it seems to have fallen to only Dhs100 worth of booze. Surely the government gets its alcohol revenue from the ridiculous 30% tax.

Millhouse Feb 27th 2011 4:05 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
30% tax isn't that high considering - look at other countries:

The UK applies 20% VAT on top of duty so all in it is something like:

Beer 30% - Wines and Spirits 50%.

As for the vague laws in the UAE - The law is clear, it is illegal for a mulsim to drink and illegal for non-muslims without licenses to drink. The confusion becomes around the lax enforcement of the law.

I'm sure if you were in a minority in your own country you would design a legal framework that always makes the expat at fault. I'm not saying it is nice or fair (it clearly is not), but I'm sure we would all come up with something fairly similar. I know I would.

Apart from Meow of course, who would just put all men at fault. :rofl:

Norm_uk Feb 27th 2011 4:55 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by Boomhauer (Post 9203148)
That sums up the Gulf, intentionally wishy washy laws to let the locals apply them in an inconsistent & biased manner and still claim to be good Muslims.

A US founder said how the US is meant to be a nation of laws and not of men; the opposite it true for the UAE.
A better solution would be for the Federal Government to pass a law that states "Tourists may drink alcohol served in licensed premises in any Emirate that decides to serve them. Residents must apply for an alcohol license if they wish to drink at home otherwise they may also drink in licensed premises."

They can keep the rules for public intoxication but stipulate that it's not illegal to quietly walk or cab it home after drinking in a bar.

The problem in the UAE is the laws are not well thought out so they are even more vulnerable because as you rightly pointed out it is a nation of men not laws.

N.

Blue Cat Feb 27th 2011 5:49 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
apparently they were stopping everyone on the Ranches last night and breathalysing them all

Millhouse Feb 27th 2011 5:51 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by Blue Cat (Post 9204446)
apparently they were stopping everyone on the Ranches last night and breathalysing them all
I didn't see it, but let's hope so. Anyone drinking and driving deserves what they get.

There is always a reasonable police presence on the Ranches. No idea why, maybe all those bored teenagers getting pissed in Saheel.

Blue Cat Feb 27th 2011 5:53 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by EmiratesMillhouse (Post 9204448)
I didn't see it, but let's hope so. Anyone drinking and driving deserves what they get.

There is always a reasonable police presence on the Ranches. No idea why, maybe all those bored teenagers getting pissed in Saheel.
7.30 last night at the main gate, read it on EW

Ethos83 Feb 27th 2011 6:14 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
And there's me driving back to the Greens after one drink at Barasti.....I know I should take a taxi but there are moments when I rebel against forking out 40AED in taxi fare just for one drink.



Originally Posted by Blue Cat (Post 9204451)
7.30 last night at the main gate, read it on EW

Millhouse Feb 27th 2011 6:18 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by Ethos83 (Post 9204472)
And there's me driving back to the Greens after one drink at Barasti.....I know I should take a taxi but there are moments when I rebel against forking out 40AED in taxi fare just for one drink.
you only have 2 months to go... don't **** it up now!

lionheart Feb 27th 2011 6:19 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Carlton Palmer got pulled over for drink driving in Dubai the other day, although he did go through a red traggic light first.:thumbdown:

Spugsy Feb 27th 2011 6:20 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by Blue Cat (Post 9204446)
apparently they were stopping everyone on the Ranches last night and breathalysing them all
There's no reason for people who live here not to have an alcohol licence. We're doing new packs for A&E about this, it's really simple and saves you a lot of hassle.

Ethos83 Feb 27th 2011 6:24 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
This was the situation -

Two hour training on the water followed with a Bulmer (for which Barasti charged me the privilege of 55AED!). I didn't leave for a full hour after I had the Bulmer.

Ok, I still 'drank' and then 'drove' the five minutes to the Greens. Normally I do take taxis but every now and then I like to risk a walk on the wild side. It's exhilarating!

Originally Posted by EmiratesMillhouse (Post 9204476)
you only have 2 months to go... don't **** it up now!

Millhouse Feb 27th 2011 6:24 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by lionheart (Post 9204479)
Carlton Palmer got pulled over for drink driving in Dubai the other day, although he did go through a red traggic light first.:thumbdown:
Is it true that he teaches at the Repton? Hilarious

Millhouse Feb 27th 2011 6:26 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by Ethos83 (Post 9204488)
This was the situation -

Two hour training on the water followed with a Bulmer (for which Barasti charged me the privilege of 55AED!). I didn't leave for a full hour after I had the Bulmer.

Ok, I still 'drank' and then 'drove' the five minutes to the Greens. Normally I do take taxis but every now and then I like to risk a walk on the wild side. It's exhilarating!
what is wrong with diet coke? I never understand drinking 'just one'. For me, it is 10 or nothing. I'm normally on nothing as the hangovers are just not worth it anymore.

Ethos83 Feb 27th 2011 6:26 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
You can only get an alcohol licence if your company approves. This won't work for everyone.

You can only get a licence if you have a lease in your name. When I shared a villa, as did most young expats did back in 2008-2009, you couldn't get a licence.

Apparently the law is such that you need a licence to drink but it's still illegal to leave the premise afterwards, and this includes taking a taxi home from the bar instead of checking in for the night.

Other words - pointless.

Originally Posted by Spugsy (Post 9204481)
There's no reason for people who live here not to have an alcohol licence. We're doing new packs for A&E about this, it's really simple and saves you a lot of hassle.

Blue Cat Feb 27th 2011 6:26 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by Ethos83 (Post 9204472)
And there's me driving back to the Greens after one drink at Barasti.....I know I should take a taxi but there are moments when I rebel against forking out 40AED in taxi fare just for one drink.
not worth it :rolleyes:

Blue Cat Feb 27th 2011 6:27 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by lionheart (Post 9204479)
Carlton Palmer got pulled over for drink driving in Dubai the other day, although he did go through a red traggic light first.:thumbdown:
and it was alcohol from the night before, he was damned unlucky if you ask me

Ethos83 Feb 27th 2011 6:27 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
I'm gone in two months. Ok. I promise, no more drinking and driving.


Originally Posted by Blue Cat (Post 9204494)
not worth it :rolleyes:

Blue Cat Feb 27th 2011 6:29 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by Ethos83 (Post 9204493)
You can only get an alcohol licence if your company approves. This won't work for everyone.

You can only get a licence if you have a lease in your name. When I shared a villa, as did most young expats did back in 2008-2009, you couldn't get a licence.

Apparently the law is such that you need a licence to drink but it's still illegal to leave the premise afterwards, and this includes taking a taxi home from the bar instead of checking in for the night.

Other words - pointless.
not so easy for us either, villa in company name, residency visa's in AD but reside in DXB, the paperwork is horrific, police clearance here etc. We just don't go out much or have a drink in the house with the door locked. Had licences in the past but not currently.

NorthernLad Feb 27th 2011 7:04 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by Blue Cat (Post 9204496)
and it was alcohol from the night before, he was damned unlucky if you ask me
It hasn't put him off the drink...he was knocking them back in the Habtoor Grand on Friday night.

Blue Cat Feb 27th 2011 7:06 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by NorthernLad (Post 9204549)
It hasn't put him off the drink...he was knocking them back in the Habtoor Grand on Friday night.
:eek:

commander Feb 27th 2011 7:10 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by Blue Cat (Post 9204501)
not so easy for us either, villa in company name, residency visa's in AD but reside in DXB, the paperwork is horrific, police clearance here etc. We just don't go out much or have a drink in the house with the door locked. Had licences in the past but not currently.
same same, Jafza visa, live in AD...the hassle getting a licence is unbelievable.

kittycat1 Feb 27th 2011 7:15 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
But the odd thing is I see loads of people drinking and driving- and generally older people as is the case in the Uk- absolutely crazy if you ask me, all you need is another bad driver to bash into you and you're screwed. Not worth the risk and you're stupid if you do in my opinion!

Madam Medusa Feb 27th 2011 7:45 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by EmiratesMillhouse (Post 9204489)
Is it true that he teaches at the Repton? Hilarious
yeah he is, and it's not hilarious, he is a really good guy, a fantastic teacher and the kids love him...i can't believe he's been so bloody stupid, i don't see how the school can keep him on...

MM, xx

commander Feb 27th 2011 7:56 am
Re: Illegal for Tourists to drink in UAE
 
Originally Posted by Madam Medusa (Post 9204600)
yeah he is, and it's not hilarious, he is a really good guy, a fantastic teacher and the kids love him...i can't believe he's been so bloody stupid, i don't see how the school can keep him on...

MM, xx
its a shambles if he keeps his job to be fair. He is prob still reeling after i whipped him in the Dubai 10K a few years ago..Fit?? my arse.


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