Was Malaysia Your First Choice As A Place To Retire?
Nov 20th 2013, 2:54 pm
#31
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,274
Re: Was Malaysia Your First Choice As A Place To Retire?
As we seem to be discussing the pros and cons of asian countries where expats may wish to either retire or spend certain amounts of time may I introduce Bali. You will all know that Bali is a separate island just 1.5 hours flight from Jakarta on cheap budget flights. I just booked one way back for US$25.
Bali is very popular both as a tourist destination and a place to permanently reside...and many, mostly Australians do.
However. Bali does not offer anything like the MM2H visa.
What is available is a Visa on Arrival (VOA) which costs US$25 for 30 days...it is extendable locally for another 30 days ($25) then you must leave...there is a big fine for those overstayers.
Another visa available, and can be applied for at the nearest Indonesian Embassy/Consul of the applicants country of residency, is the Tourist Visa. This lasts 60 days straight. It is not supposed to be extendable but I've known it happen up to total 6 months.
If you know any Indonesians who can sponsor you can get a SUSBUD visa. He submits a letter of invitation saying he is responsible for your behavior. This initially lasts 60 days and can be extended monthly till a total of 6 months...then leave and repeat if desired. This can also be done, for a fee, by an agent
The final one is a retirement visa and the criteria is...you need to be 55+, have a little money and enough to pay the agent for the visa. Only an agent can do this and I just received my 3rd one for a year and it cost US$650.
This is just the start of my contributions for those thinking of Bali...any questions?
Bali is very popular both as a tourist destination and a place to permanently reside...and many, mostly Australians do.
However. Bali does not offer anything like the MM2H visa.
What is available is a Visa on Arrival (VOA) which costs US$25 for 30 days...it is extendable locally for another 30 days ($25) then you must leave...there is a big fine for those overstayers.
Another visa available, and can be applied for at the nearest Indonesian Embassy/Consul of the applicants country of residency, is the Tourist Visa. This lasts 60 days straight. It is not supposed to be extendable but I've known it happen up to total 6 months.
If you know any Indonesians who can sponsor you can get a SUSBUD visa. He submits a letter of invitation saying he is responsible for your behavior. This initially lasts 60 days and can be extended monthly till a total of 6 months...then leave and repeat if desired. This can also be done, for a fee, by an agent
The final one is a retirement visa and the criteria is...you need to be 55+, have a little money and enough to pay the agent for the visa. Only an agent can do this and I just received my 3rd one for a year and it cost US$650.
This is just the start of my contributions for those thinking of Bali...any questions?
Nov 20th 2013, 6:06 pm
#32
Forum Regular
Joined: Sep 2013
Location: Northern NSW
Posts: 85
Re: Was Malaysia Your First Choice As A Place To Retire?
Hi Gobbledonk – I would be very interested in more information on this $25, 1-year business visa to Cambodia, not for me but for my son-in-law who is currently (and with great difficulty) trying to make his way in Vietnam.
All I can find on the internet is a 1 month business visa for $25 and a 1 year extension for $200 plus a mountain of red tape.
I’m not sure if this is on-topic or off-topic so I’ll let you decide if it’s best to PM me.
Cheers, IVV
All I can find on the internet is a 1 month business visa for $25 and a 1 year extension for $200 plus a mountain of red tape.
I’m not sure if this is on-topic or off-topic so I’ll let you decide if it’s best to PM me.
Cheers, IVV
(If not, I'll PM you IVV, but I'd prefer to provide the link for everyone)
Edit: going back through that thread - and I admit I had only skimmed it the first time - you are correct in that you need to pay extra to renew the initial one-month business visa for 6 or 12 months, but there is nothing about a 'mountain of red tape':
I got my last Cambodian 1-year business visa at the airport on arrival: handed an Immigration colonel ~$250 in cash (no receipt), & left him my passport & photo. He personally delivered the passport & visa to my home next day.
As scary as that might sound to some - leaving your passport with a stranger - its precisely how I get my Tourist visas for Thailand from (you guessed it) Penang
Last edited by gobbledonk; Nov 20th 2013 at 6:23 pm.
Nov 21st 2013, 2:37 am
#33
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 15,526
Re: Was Malaysia Your First Choice As A Place To Retire?
You’re right bakedbean – this is a great discussion – and it would be a shame to stop it now the fun has started! I also think it’s right to carry on this thread because people thinking of retiring to Thailand will almost certainly come across references to MM2H and will want to dig deeper into the pros and cos of the two countries.
Turning to your comments, gobbledonk, you’re quite right that you can buy property in Thailand through your Thai wife (if you have one) - but once she moves her family in, and moves you out, you pretty soon find out that, legally, it’s not your property at all.
I alsop agree that it’s very uncommon to find non-Thai couples in Thailand – I think that, in itself, speaks volumes.
Here is a link concerning the tax situation on funds remitted to someone who is resident in Thailand: http://www.rd.go.th/publish/6045.0.html
In Malaysia, there is an automatic right for holders of MM2H to work for up to 20 hours per week (I even read somewhere that they are thinking of increasing this). There is also an automatic right to start a business in Malaysia. In both cases there is paperwork involved but my point is that in Thailand you are not entitled to do either.
Phuket News carries news from all over Thailand and bad things don’t just happen in Phuket, Pattaya and Bangkok! I do regularly check out the news in Penang and Malaysia - either nothing terribly dramatic happens or it is not reported.
I do wholeheartedly agree that a move to Penang need not to be for life and one can always dig out the map if things don’t turn out for the best but as we get older this becomes rather less appealing hence the desire to check out all the angles before taking the plunge.
I know there are many people on this forum with experience of both countries – come on let’s hear your views!
Turning to your comments, gobbledonk, you’re quite right that you can buy property in Thailand through your Thai wife (if you have one) - but once she moves her family in, and moves you out, you pretty soon find out that, legally, it’s not your property at all.
I alsop agree that it’s very uncommon to find non-Thai couples in Thailand – I think that, in itself, speaks volumes.
Here is a link concerning the tax situation on funds remitted to someone who is resident in Thailand: http://www.rd.go.th/publish/6045.0.html
In Malaysia, there is an automatic right for holders of MM2H to work for up to 20 hours per week (I even read somewhere that they are thinking of increasing this). There is also an automatic right to start a business in Malaysia. In both cases there is paperwork involved but my point is that in Thailand you are not entitled to do either.
Phuket News carries news from all over Thailand and bad things don’t just happen in Phuket, Pattaya and Bangkok! I do regularly check out the news in Penang and Malaysia - either nothing terribly dramatic happens or it is not reported.
I do wholeheartedly agree that a move to Penang need not to be for life and one can always dig out the map if things don’t turn out for the best but as we get older this becomes rather less appealing hence the desire to check out all the angles before taking the plunge.
I know there are many people on this forum with experience of both countries – come on let’s hear your views!
When I told a fellow Hong Kong workmate about my interest in Malaysia he said it's a very violent and unsettled place. Maybe thats the Chinese view ?
Then he came up with some news yesterday about new Chinese visitors getting killed and kidnapped within their first week in Malaysia.
I'm totally confused now, but he was very very anti Malaysia.... This is from a very conservative and well educated bloke who is training to become A Chinese doctor.
So who has the correct view... or is it different for Chinese nationals in Malaysia ? In much the same way as Indians have had a tough time in certain parts of Australia ?
Nov 21st 2013, 4:05 am
#34
¿uo buıob s,ʇɐɥʍ
Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,762
Re: Was Malaysia Your First Choice As A Place To Retire?
When I told a fellow Hong Kong workmate about my interest in Malaysia he said it's a very violent and unsettled place. Maybe thats the Chinese view ?
Then he came up with some news yesterday about new Chinese visitors getting killed and kidnapped within their first week in Malaysia.
I'm totally confused now, but he was very very anti Malaysia.... This is from a very conservative and well educated bloke who is training to become A Chinese doctor.
So who has the correct view... or is it different for Chinese nationals in Malaysia ? In much the same way as Indians have had a tough time in certain parts of Australia ?
Then he came up with some news yesterday about new Chinese visitors getting killed and kidnapped within their first week in Malaysia.
I'm totally confused now, but he was very very anti Malaysia.... This is from a very conservative and well educated bloke who is training to become A Chinese doctor.
So who has the correct view... or is it different for Chinese nationals in Malaysia ? In much the same way as Indians have had a tough time in certain parts of Australia ?
I live in Penang, I think it's peaceful here. Compared to the UK there's a lot less alcohol-related misbehavior. The different races seem to rub along well. Whilst bag-snatching is common, violent mugging is not. But burglary is common, and something to be careful about. Burglars can, and do, break into occupied homes at night armed with parangs.
In KL there have been several cases of people being 'kidnapped' by taxi drivers. A young Malaysian woman I know, was only released after several thousand ringgit was paid. But I think the people doing this have now been caught.
In Malaysia this year there appears to have been an increase in gang-related crime - particularly shootings, but you are very unlikely to be caught up in this. See: http://www.economist.com/news/asia/2...drive-shooting
Crime happens worldwide. You can do a rough comparison between cities at Numbeo.com
Personally, I'd say Malaysia was a peaceful place, but I rarely wander the streets very late at night, get into worn out taxis alone, or go to remote areas.
JC3
Last edited by JC3; Nov 21st 2013 at 5:49 am.
Nov 21st 2013, 5:38 am
#35
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Mar 2012
Location: Living in Melaka, Malaysia
Posts: 472
Re: Was Malaysia Your First Choice As A Place To Retire?
I have been out and about in Melaka at various times at night, admittedly mostly in my car, but have never seen anything. My wife has also been out quite late at night without mishap.
On the other side of the coin, about a month after we arrived here, I had gone to bed one evening, leaving my wife downstairs on her own. Sometime in the early hours of the morning, she heard some noises at the back door which is in the kitchen. She immediately called the police and woke me when they arrived. The police checked around the outside of the house, but there was no-one to be seen. My wife was convinced there were 2 people and they were on a motorbike. Up until then, the outside light at the back wasn't working, but we replaced the bulb the following day and leave both that, and one at the front on all night. We also, to be on the safe side, moved a garden statue and chest freezer to the back door (we are only renting, and haven't fully unpacked yet, hence the statue in the house!) so that it would be almost impossible to open from the outside.
One disturbing thing we did hear of though is that a few days before we arrived (in March) armed police had broken into a house in the next street and some people were arrested. We believe that they also found a cahce of arms and this was supposedly connected with the incursion in Sabah/Sarawak in February. Whether all of what we heard is true, or not, is anyone's guess!
We haven't had any problems since and nor have we heard of anyone else in this area.
On the other side of the coin, about a month after we arrived here, I had gone to bed one evening, leaving my wife downstairs on her own. Sometime in the early hours of the morning, she heard some noises at the back door which is in the kitchen. She immediately called the police and woke me when they arrived. The police checked around the outside of the house, but there was no-one to be seen. My wife was convinced there were 2 people and they were on a motorbike. Up until then, the outside light at the back wasn't working, but we replaced the bulb the following day and leave both that, and one at the front on all night. We also, to be on the safe side, moved a garden statue and chest freezer to the back door (we are only renting, and haven't fully unpacked yet, hence the statue in the house!) so that it would be almost impossible to open from the outside.
One disturbing thing we did hear of though is that a few days before we arrived (in March) armed police had broken into a house in the next street and some people were arrested. We believe that they also found a cahce of arms and this was supposedly connected with the incursion in Sabah/Sarawak in February. Whether all of what we heard is true, or not, is anyone's guess!
We haven't had any problems since and nor have we heard of anyone else in this area.
Nov 21st 2013, 6:17 am
#36
Forum Regular
Joined: Aug 2013
Location: Penang/Malaysia
Posts: 85
Re: Was Malaysia Your First Choice As A Place To Retire?
I don’t think it will be an easy to get the work permit for the 20 hours per week under MM2H. As CJ3 already highlighted this work permit is subject to quite a number of conditions. In another forum the question was raised about experience with working under MM2H but no answers - maybe no one wants to - either answer or work. I would like to through the ball back to Bakedbean and ask her if she could start a thread about experiences to work under MM2H regulations.
Nov 21st 2013, 8:06 am
#37
Forum Regular
Joined: Aug 2013
Location: Penang/Malaysia
Posts: 85
Re: Was Malaysia Your First Choice As A Place To Retire?
Although it is already quite some years back when I moved to Asia Phuket was my first choice. The idea was to start a small hotel (I was in this business in Germany) and before relocating I visited Thailand many times. I was introduced to a Thai partner who studied in Germany and who had the same ideas.
For the first three months I stayed with an Australian doctor married to a Chinese Thai and who lived there already since 15 years. He told me the stories about foreigners who wanted to start business there. Without going into the details they were quite scary. Other aspects of not feeling so comfortable any more were: 49:51 partnership for foreigners, legal issues like court cases in Thai, difficult to get work permit, shortage of water in the dry and power failures in the wet season, language barriers, difficulties in making friends with locals, one is welcome to spend but not to earn.
With the obligatory visa runs I came to know Malaysia, particularly Penang. What a difference: business wise in needing (that time) only a 30% local partner, all contracts in English, good infrastructure and very helpful government agencies. And socially: pubs with a good mixture of locals and foreigners and not locals or foreigners only, people who are interested to talk to you (not only: whe’ do you come f’om) and enhanced social recognition (which should be appreciated and not exploited). After 2 years Phuket I moved to Penang.
I still go many times to Thailand because I like driving there, their beautiful beaches and the good service in restaurants and hotels..., but I don’t want to live there.
For the first three months I stayed with an Australian doctor married to a Chinese Thai and who lived there already since 15 years. He told me the stories about foreigners who wanted to start business there. Without going into the details they were quite scary. Other aspects of not feeling so comfortable any more were: 49:51 partnership for foreigners, legal issues like court cases in Thai, difficult to get work permit, shortage of water in the dry and power failures in the wet season, language barriers, difficulties in making friends with locals, one is welcome to spend but not to earn.
With the obligatory visa runs I came to know Malaysia, particularly Penang. What a difference: business wise in needing (that time) only a 30% local partner, all contracts in English, good infrastructure and very helpful government agencies. And socially: pubs with a good mixture of locals and foreigners and not locals or foreigners only, people who are interested to talk to you (not only: whe’ do you come f’om) and enhanced social recognition (which should be appreciated and not exploited). After 2 years Phuket I moved to Penang.
I still go many times to Thailand because I like driving there, their beautiful beaches and the good service in restaurants and hotels..., but I don’t want to live there.
Nov 21st 2013, 8:43 am
#38
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Joined: Sep 2013
Location: Northern NSW
Posts: 85
Re: Was Malaysia Your First Choice As A Place To Retire?
ozzieeagle, your HK friend sounds like the Singaporeans who seem to live in fear of the crime in Johor, yet continue to visit and even live over there. I grew up in Sydney, but if someone from overseas asked me if it was a good place to live I would warn them about the crime, particularly violent assaults on complete strangers. Sadly, I dont know of any big city which doesnt have it's share of problems, but Sydney is a lost cause as far as I'm concerned.
As far as burglaries are concerned, I'm hoping that living in a highrise will lessen the likelihood of that happening, but an ex in Sydney had her apartment burgled and she was on the 8th floor. Apparently they climbed up the side of the building (!) and 'no-one saw anything' : another aspect of life in Sydney that really drove me nuts. That and waking up with a guy at the end of the bed trying to tell me he 'didnt think anybody lived here' before he left via the window he had just broken to get in ....
Getting back to Thailand, several lengthy stints in walk-up apartments in Bangkok and Pattaya and I've never had so much as a 10-baht coin go missing - others arent so lucky, but many of those thefts seem to be maids and girls they've bought home. More concerned by the increasing prevalence of ATM scams in Thailand than the prospect of being burgled on a trip, and the vast majority of those scams arent being perpetrated by Thai people.
As far as burglaries are concerned, I'm hoping that living in a highrise will lessen the likelihood of that happening, but an ex in Sydney had her apartment burgled and she was on the 8th floor. Apparently they climbed up the side of the building (!) and 'no-one saw anything' : another aspect of life in Sydney that really drove me nuts. That and waking up with a guy at the end of the bed trying to tell me he 'didnt think anybody lived here' before he left via the window he had just broken to get in ....
Getting back to Thailand, several lengthy stints in walk-up apartments in Bangkok and Pattaya and I've never had so much as a 10-baht coin go missing - others arent so lucky, but many of those thefts seem to be maids and girls they've bought home. More concerned by the increasing prevalence of ATM scams in Thailand than the prospect of being burgled on a trip, and the vast majority of those scams arent being perpetrated by Thai people.
Nov 21st 2013, 12:42 pm
#39
...............
Joined: Feb 2009
Location: Far North Queensland
Posts: 17,625
Re: Was Malaysia Your First Choice As A Place To Retire?
I would be happy to post a link to the post in question, but felt I should check with bakedbean first. Is it OK to do this, BB ? Its a ThaiVisa thread - one of the more civil examples of same, but that is a much wilder board than this one and wont improve anyone's impressions of Thai-based expats, I'm afraid
Nov 21st 2013, 12:44 pm
#40
...............
Joined: Feb 2009
Location: Far North Queensland
Posts: 17,625
Re: Was Malaysia Your First Choice As A Place To Retire?
I don’t think it will be an easy to get the work permit for the 20 hours per week under MM2H. As CJ3 already highlighted this work permit is subject to quite a number of conditions. In another forum the question was raised about experience with working under MM2H but no answers - maybe no one wants to - either answer or work. I would like to through the ball back to Bakedbean and ask her if she could start a thread about experiences to work under MM2H regulations.
Nov 21st 2013, 6:13 pm
#41
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Joined: Sep 2013
Location: Northern NSW
Posts: 85
Re: Was Malaysia Your First Choice As A Place To Retire?
I'm not a Moderator but my interpretation of rules is that, if you are a regular poster on here (which you are) and it's a relevant link and not connected with you or your business, it's OK. I have certainly done that a few times where I see fit and if the answer cannot be found on here.
IVV, this is the thread:
http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/...cambodia-visa/
The Admins have now moved all the Cambo-specific threads into a single sub-forum, and most of it is overseen by the best moderator on that forum, Sheryl. Enjoy.
Nov 22nd 2013, 10:16 am
#42
Hostage Negotiator
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 5,173
Re: Was Malaysia Your First Choice As A Place To Retire?
Thank you for the link gobbledonk - I have looked at it twice but each time it gives me a headache 
I think you have to be younger than I am to to accept the insecurity of not knowing exactly where you stand so, for me, I'll just stick to MM2H.
I have passed it onto my son-in-law, who is 21, and won't have any problem at all rising to this kind of challenge - although I'm convinced he'll end up in jail one day!
Thanks again
I think you have to be younger than I am to to accept the insecurity of not knowing exactly where you stand so, for me, I'll just stick to MM2H.
I have passed it onto my son-in-law, who is 21, and won't have any problem at all rising to this kind of challenge - although I'm convinced he'll end up in jail one day!
Thanks again
Nov 23rd 2013, 6:50 am
#43
Forum Regular
Joined: Sep 2013
Location: Northern NSW
Posts: 85
Re: Was Malaysia Your First Choice As A Place To Retire?
At 21, I think he'll survive Cambo - I just don't know about some of the characters in that thread I linked to ! I wasted far too much time in my 20s and 30s chained to a desk when I should have been travelling - live and learn, I guess.
Nov 24th 2013, 4:44 am
#44
Joined: Feb 2010
Location: Buraydah , Saudi Arabia
Posts: 2,863
Re: Was Malaysia Your First Choice As A Place To Retire?
He should have some great fun in Cambodia . Used to be like the Wild West . I imagine you can still do pretty much anything you want there . PP is on the up too.
Sep 14th 2014, 1:14 pm
#45
...............
Joined: Feb 2009
Location: Far North Queensland
Posts: 17,625
Re: Was Malaysia Your First Choice As A Place To Retire?
Just getting back on first choices and second choices, hearing of a few folks leaving Penang (their first retirement choice) to go live in Thailand . Aiyoh opposite direction to what I did. Horses for courses I suppose or...... maybe some feeling that Thailand is now much cheaper than Malaysia perhaps?
. Aiyoh opposite direction to what I did. Horses for courses I suppose or...... maybe some feeling that Thailand is now much cheaper than Malaysia perhaps?