Deep Floyd Mars wrote:
    >

    > Me neither, but after a couple of years of visiting the same city I would be
    > tempted to try somewhere else. Paris is just so hackneyed. Rome, Barcelona,
    > Budapest, Vienna and Prague are all friendly, romantic, safe, and have
    > immense amounts of their own form of magic to offer that it seems a shame
    > people miss out on them. Variety being the spice of life!
    >
    > Also, I find Paris suffers from the immense volume of tourism there. As
    > such, it's hard to find those out of the way places where the patrons are
    > predominantly locals. Each to their own.

Oh well, as far as that goes, I'd choose Vienna over practically any
place else on Earth, but then I fell hopelessly in love with the city
the first time I saw it!

    > ---
    > DFM

"EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)" a écrit dans le
message de news: [email protected]...


    > I agree about Paris and London, however, I'd
    > add Vienna!

I couldn't find anything to do in Vienna. It seemed like a very small,
sleepy town. The highlight of my visit was finding a McDonald's.

In article ,
The Reid wrote:
    >Following up to Mxsmanic
    >>In fact, I can't think of any single sight anywhere that justifies a
    >>long-distance trip.
    >Everest

Giza

--
/* _ */main(int k,char**n){char*i=k&1?"+L*;99,RU[,RUo+BeKAA+BECACJ+CAACA"
/* / ` */"CD+LBCACJ*":1[n],j,l=!k,m;do for(m=*i-48,j=l?m/k:m%k;m>>7?k=1<<m+
/* | */8,!l&&puts(&l)**&l:j--;printf(" \0_/"+l));while((l^=3)||l[++i]);
/* \_,hris Brown -- All opinions expressed are probably wrong. */return 0;}

"Mxsmanic" wrote in message news:...
    > "me" a écrit dans le message de news:
    > [email protected]...
    >
    > > I tend to like 'em either really large,
    > > or fairly small. In the latter case only
    > > for a day or so however.
    >
    > The problem is that a day or two isn't practical if you're coming from
    > overseas, which effectively limits you to the large cities where there is
    > enough to occupy you for a week or more.

Oh, you can, I do it annually. There are even tour companies
which will book such itineraries. It's definitely not for everyone
though. And it really takes some local knowledge to ensure the
right combination of size, infrastructure, and relative location to the
NEXT town, else one will spend all their time in transit.

    > > I also find it both a bit funny and convienent
    > > that they are great places to buy simple gifts for
    > > friends back home. A box of chocolate cookies
    > > in a box all in french is vastly cheaper than
    > > anything at the duty free, and since often what
    > > I'm probably getting is the "store brand" it is
    > > also something they'd never be able to get back
    > > home. But they are "french" cookies!!!!
    >
    > I agree. I buy gifts like that, too. They make good souvenirs because they
    > are simply impossible to obtain anywhere else.

One "danger" is when you find something you personnally REALLY
like and then can't get any back home. My wife found some flavored
teas she really liked in London last time we were there. Although
Twinnings sells them in the UK, their US arm does not yet sell them.
She's starting to run low and we are now asking friends that head that
way to pick up a small bushel of them for us.

    >
    > > There is often a "business district" in large
    > > towns that at lunch time, or in some cultures
    > > early evening, where it will be absolutely
    > > packed with locals. I find them excellent chances
    > > to see locals "in their natural habitat".
    >
    > In Paris, visit the La Défense business district just outside the city
    > limit. Just about everyone there is a local, and it's crowded on the
    > pedestrian plazas in the morning, at lunch, and in the evening.

Is that where the "other Arch" is that I see in the distance?
Or is that the area around that ugly black tower/building one
sees in the distance "that way" from the Eifel Tower?

"me" a écrit dans le message de news:
[email protected]...

    > One "danger" is when you find something you
    > personnally REALLY like and then can't get
    > any back home.

Yes, that has happened to me several times.

    > Is that where the "other Arch" is that I
    > see in the distance?

There is a very large, square arch predictably called la Grande Arche at La
Défense, if that's what you mean.

    > Or is that the area around that ugly black
    > tower/building one sees in the distance
    > "that way" from the Eifel Tower?

The solitary ugly black tower would probably be the Montparnasse Tower,
which is the tallest building in Paris. It is ugly indeed, although it
provides a better view of the city from its rooftop than the Eiffel Tower
does (it isn't as tall as the Eiffel Tower, but the roof platform is much
more open and roomy).

me wrote:
    > "Mxsmanic" wrote:

    > > In Paris, visit the La Défense business district just outside the city
    > > limit. Just about everyone there is a local, and it's crowded on the
    > > pedestrian plazas in the morning, at lunch, and in the evening.

    > Is that where the "other Arch" is that I see in the distance?
    > Or is that the area around that ugly black tower/building one
    > sees in the distance "that way" from the Eifel Tower?

I suspect that the "other arch" is what you mean: le Grand Arch
de La Defense. It is at the western end of metro line 1, "in the
distance" if you are looking west down the Champs Elysees.

The "ugly black tower" is probably Tour Montparnasse, located in
the southern part of Paris. The area surrounding it seems also to
be mostly filled with "locals".


--
greg byshenk - [email protected] - Leiden, NL
hate spam?

greg byshenk wrote in message news:...
    > me wrote:
    > > "Mxsmanic" wrote:
    >
    > > > In Paris, visit the La Défense business district just outside the city
    > > > limit. Just about everyone there is a local, and it's crowded on the
    > > > pedestrian plazas in the morning, at lunch, and in the evening.
    >
    > > Is that where the "other Arch" is that I see in the distance?
    > > Or is that the area around that ugly black tower/building one
    > > sees in the distance "that way" from the Eifel Tower?
    >
    > I suspect that the "other arch" is what you mean: le Grand Arch
    > de La Defense. It is at the western end of metro line 1, "in the
    > distance" if you are looking west down the Champs Elysees.

I noticed it whilst standing atop the 1st Arch. I believe I
have a photo of it. I sorta thought there was some attempt to
"align" the two, although it coulda just been wishful thinking.
Two points of course do a line make.

    >
    > The "ugly black tower" is probably Tour Montparnasse, located in
    > the southern part of Paris. The area surrounding it seems also to
    > be mostly filled with "locals".

Yeah, that sounds familiar. We went walking through there.
Lotta locals, notalota tourists. (#1 clue you've left the major
tourist areas. Single servings of soda become vastly less expensive.)

In article ,
[email protected] (me) wrote:

    > greg byshenk wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > me wrote:
    > > > "Mxsmanic" wrote:
    > >
    > > > > In Paris, visit the La Défense business district just outside the city
    > > > > limit. Just about everyone there is a local, and it's crowded on the
    > > > > pedestrian plazas in the morning, at lunch, and in the evening.
    > >
    > > > Is that where the "other Arch" is that I see in the distance?
    > > > Or is that the area around that ugly black tower/building one
    > > > sees in the distance "that way" from the Eifel Tower?
    > >
    > > I suspect that the "other arch" is what you mean: le Grand Arch
    > > de La Defense. It is at the western end of metro line 1, "in the
    > > distance" if you are looking west down the Champs Elysees.
    >
    > I noticed it whilst standing atop the 1st Arch. I believe I
    > have a photo of it. I sorta thought there was some attempt to
    > "align" the two, although it coulda just been wishful thinking.
    > Two points of course do a line make.
    >
    > >
    > > The "ugly black tower" is probably Tour Montparnasse, located in
    > > the southern part of Paris. The area surrounding it seems also to
    > > be mostly filled with "locals".
    >
    > Yeah, that sounds familiar. We went walking through there.
    > Lotta locals, notalota tourists. (#1 clue you've left the major
    > tourist areas. Single servings of soda become vastly less expensive.)

and it all has precisely the ambience of plastic shopping malls
everywhere

The Reid wrote:

    > >Don't forget the dull-as-hell Istanbul, Krakow, Copenhagen...
    >
    > Moscow! Leningrad, Birmingham, Barcelona, Bath....dull dull dull


Barcelona dull? I wouldn't say.

--
Luca Logi - Firenze - Italy e-mail: [email protected]

"me" a écrit dans le message de news:
[email protected]...

    > I sorta thought there was some attempt to
    > "align" the two, although it coulda just
    > been wishful thinking. Two points of course
    > do a line make.

The several arches are indeed aligned. The Grande Arche is not perfectly
aligned because the requirements of its foundation mandated that it be
shifted a bit.

    > #1 clue you've left the major tourist areas.
    > Single servings of soda become vastly less expensive.

Cans of soda pop vary in price by at least 3 to 1 depending on which part of
the city you are in. Sometimes they are only ¤0.76; sometimes they are
¤3.50. The average price for a can of soda is probably a bit over one euro.

Mxsmanic wrote:
    > [...]
    > The solitary ugly black tower would probably be the Montparnasse Tower,
    > which is the tallest building in Paris. It is ugly indeed, although it
    > provides a better view of the city from its rooftop than the Eiffel Tower
    > does (it isn't as tall as the Eiffel Tower, but the roof platform is much
    > more open and roomy).

The other advantage of viewing the city from the top of the Tour
Montparnasse: it's one viewing place in the city where you can't
actually see the Tour Montparnasse. Worth it for that alone.
--
DGS

Mxsmanic wrote:
    >
    > "EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)" a écrit dans le
    > message de news: [email protected]...
    >
    > > I agree about Paris and London, however, I'd
    > > add Vienna!
    >
    > I couldn't find anything to do in Vienna. It seemed like a very small,
    > sleepy town. The highlight of my visit was finding a McDonald's.

With all the musical activity there, I could NEVER be bored! (I guess
it all depends upon what you're looking for.)

Well you are so right. Paris is even better than usual. The weather
is fantastic. I only had half a day to myself (as I was here on
business) so I did take a whirlwind tour with www.patmcclelland.com in
which I was photographed in front of all the main Paris monuments!
That was fun. Especially since there were a couple of places I didn't
even know. If you want to see them let me know. Robin

Following up to Luca Logi

    >> Moscow! Leningrad, Birmingham, Barcelona, Bath....dull dull dull
    >Barcelona dull? I wouldn't say.

I was being sarcastic, although Birmingham was perhaps more ironic
than sarcastic!
--
Mike Reid
"Art is the lie that reveals the truth" P.Picasso
The British hills, London & the Thames "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk"
Spain, food and walking "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" (see web for email)

Following up to Mxsmanic

    >> I agree about Paris and London, however, I'd
    >> add Vienna!
    >I couldn't find anything to do in Vienna. It seemed like a very small,
    >sleepy town. The highlight of my visit was finding a McDonald's.

If you go to cities starting in "V", what do you expect?

I just spent a long weekend in small towns and villages and on the
Thames, more to do than could be fitted in the time, fortunatly no
McDonalds.
--
Mike Reid
"Art is the lie that reveals the truth" P.Picasso
The British hills, London & the Thames "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk"
Spain, food and walking "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" (see web for email)