dannigirl

Or the alternative is [insert awful generalised stereotype of an entire country] that other cultures or ethnicities are uptight, prone to bouts of whingeing, humourless, dour and act and think in a superior manner.

You take the biscuit Assanah. So now as well as the conspiracy theory that people are "forced" to emigrate via marketing campaigns, we now as an entire country "pretend" we are happy with our housing. What boat did you get off, HM bitter and twisted I think!

Robbie2010

Kiwi's are happy with their housing 'cos they don't realize how crap it is!

Kiwi made for kiwi conditions = crap!

The Weezer

I think both of you are spot on. Certainly helps explain why the housing is so bad. I've often thought the same.

Some of my Kiwi family, for example, are only dimly aware that people from many parts of Europe and North America don't have to wrap themselves in blankets while sitting in the lounge in the evening, or wipe their soggy windows down every morning. Some of them have traveled abroad, but it doesn't seem to change their attitudes.

The harden up ethos, and the deeply ingrained belief that everything in New Zealand is better than everywhere else certainly adds to the problem. Greed is also a factor. Landlords want to squeeze every penny out of their beloved investment properties. Rental properties are not regulated in any way as regards to heating or insulation requirements. Only newer housing is somewhat insulated and dry, but even most of these wouldn't pass muster in places like UK or the US. (Single-glazed aluminium windows, or double-glazed aluminium windows with no thermal break).

Assanah is not exaggerating about the third world diseases, either. Look up rates of scarlet fever in New Zealand, for example, or the fact that 1/4 of New Zealand children suffer from asthma.

Builder UK

HMS bitter and twisted did that dock just before "HMS sweep it under rug, aye"



Nobody mentioned mass conspiracy theories, nz has just branded itself to the world with utter bull, GODZOWN God's Own Country - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
What's all that about then, Yorkshire folk have used this but it's more tongue in cheek sarcasm.

100% pure / clean, green - more marketing strategies that aren't true, the gentleman earlier pointed out the water quality, a quick google search show 61% and 52% are not safe to swim in, from stuff and herald. Your also chucking 1080 all over the place.

I have a generous '48% pure with added pesticide'

You'd have to be a fool, blind or both not to see the housing problems, iv seen better built static caravans in Skegness, thats exactly how I would describe being inside a NZ house, you never really feel 100% inside.

I think some people have the right to feel pissed off, when the penny drops that NZ is not how it was portrayed in promo videos or on certain forums.

I don't think people expect an easy life, handed to them on a plate when they move, or heaven on earth or some kind of utopia, but a decent heads up about the housing quality and living costs would soften the blow.

dannigirl

I am not saying that there isn't a problem with some NZ housing. There clearly is. BUT I just do not buy the whole generalisation of kiwis. If someone I knew, my friends or family had an issue with their housing, their attitude would not be harden up, it would be to do their best to fix the problem. Unfortunately we as a rule do not have mains gas. Can you imagine running a central heating system on bottled gas. What is the solution? I think you/we are very lucky in the UK to have central heating and I think it hides a lot of bad housing to be honest. I know my house would be a freezer box without central heating. My heating bills are testament to this.

Poverty is UK's hidden child killer | Society | The Observer

I don't want to get all tit for tat, but it just seems people seem to be a bit blinkered about all the same and relevant issues in the UK. I am not for one minute pretending it does not happen in NZ and the numbers on "third world diseases" is just disgusting and a disgrace. But I wonder if you all dissect the UK as much.

It is just my view but it is easier to distance yourself from all these problems in the UK. Most people do not see the poor standard of housing here, the deprivation, the grinding poverty a lot of people experience their entire lives. As long as they are ok, then all is fine. Well I visit families in their homes as a social worker and see every day families that live in sub standard housing, mould on the walls, no carpets, no heating, no cooking facilities, tower blocks with p!ss infused lifts, drug littered hallways. Rickets are making a come back, mostly due to poor diet and TB is also very prevalent due to the high immigrant population.


I'll bow out of this thread now, so carry on!

Builder UK

I think I'd bow out too, leaving a link to a 7 year old thread.

These piss filled lifts, heating-less flats with mould and no carpets, are they being sold for massively over valued prices.

If you are in the UK and have insulation problems and own your home simply get onto your energy provider who will arrange for you to have your cavity filled, or internal / external insulation.

If you live in a council/social house they are upgrading every house in the country to fall into line with the emmissions and so everybody can save money on heating.

All this for free

i agree fully about TB, look at the Ebola virus now and the recent outbreak of MMR in NZ.

The difference is the UK doesn't pretent to be anything we are not, the UK doesn't put misleading videos on the net, as the lads sing at the local football club from the stands on a Saturday afternoon "we're shit and we know we are"

NZ takes itself too seriously and cannot take critism at all, jeez, the all blacks lose and the whole nation has the tit on for a week, it's possibly why the housing is like it is, instead of letting someone show you the right way, you chose the kiwi way, whatever the outcome.

bourbon-biscuit

Dannigirl is quite right about the UK. I don't know what jobs you all had over there but my family and friends mostly work in situations where they see the real extent of Britain's poverty (social worker, mental health nurse, GP, ed. psych., criminal defence lawyer, among others) and it is gritty and hard. Plenty of families in the UK live through UK winters in damp squalid housing.

NZ has a curious mix of incredible housing and just dreadful housing. The old weather boards tend to be cold and draughty but they are not as damp as the really dire properties. I don't think there's a conspiracy here though, I just think NZ has a lot of substandard housing that runs right up the SES spectrum and so having a $750k budget does not necessarily protect you from weeping windows, mould, and cold, whereas in the UK you would pretty much expect that once you are punching at that level the house you buy will meet the bare minimum of warm and dry.

I slightly disagree with you here. Most British expats come here because they can by way of the skills they have that NZ needs. For most expats this means that they are of reasonable intellect and quite capable of researching something like an international move. I have lots of friends in Cambridge and I go to their houses and see their lives and it is pretty frequently the stuff of dreams. They are living in warm dry homes in beautiful locations, kids attending great schools with uni prospects far superior to the UK, and they are holidaying in amazing places. That's not to discredit those who have it tough and life does not work out for them here, but if you think about it, it's not really NZ per se that makes an emigration work or not; NZ is neither good or bad, it just is. What makes an emigration work is a mix of 3 things: circumstances (equity, job prospects, family who settle well, family back home who adjust well) attitude (sorry, but it really does make a difference; in hard times I have had to confront my attitude as the only thing I can change), and luck (or absence of bad luck!). Some expats have all three in their favour, some make it with one or two. I dislike it when successful expats attribute all their success to their own hard work without acknowledging the part of luck. I also dislike it when unhappy expats lack the insight to really think about the process beyond a fixation that NZ is bad and has tricked them. I have met a couple of families who have had absolute disaster emigrations and I really feel for them and wouldn't wish that sort of distress on anyone but they don't necessarily start to have the attitude some of the posters here are sharing. It is more useful to move forward with a better attitude, but that's not to say attitude alone makes a successful emigration - you need a lot more wind in your sails than that! I think I can fairly say this because I have experienced hard times in NZ and good times.

jmh

I've worked in Social Services in the UK too, and you see all sorts of appalling conditions that most of the population don't see. Sadly it's pretty universal. Doesn't mean you shouldn't attack it but don't imagine that it only exists in one country alone.

And I have 'fond' memories of renting in the UK: In one, the landlord only turned the hot water on for an hour a day and since there were two of us there was only enough for each person to have a shower every other day. Most had no double glazing and in one you could open the hall cupboard and see outside through the holes in the wall. In another the only heating provided was a tiny 2 bar heater, about a foot long.

When you live in your home country your entire life is constructed around a particularly view of the world and you are normalised to what you see around you. When you migrate to somewhere else, you become aware that people live differently. For many this is a very educating experience, but for others they never truly accept that their way of life is one of many that people can choose from. Problems only arise when you try to impose your view on other people's - they don't generally like it for some reason.

jmh

Good points BB.

RobClubley

You have something here. They seem to think the All Blacks have a right to win and they are poor losers!

The Weezer

aI think what's really relevant to this post is the fact that even people on middle incomes and the wealthy live in sub-standard housing in New Zealand, in fact, I think it's safe to say the majority. Most new houses I've seen built in the Auckland area lack proper insulation, in that the windows are still weepy because either they're single glazed or they are double glazed with aluminium frames with no thermal break. Add to this the extremely high prices you're paying for this quality. You can always add ventilation systems to help the damp, and add heat pumps or a central heating system, but all this will add to the cost of housing that's just about criminally overpriced. Having substandard windows also makes for higher heating bills and are a waste of energy and resources.

Surely there is something in the culture in New Zealand that prevents it from moving forward and catching up with more advanced countries as regards to housing quality. Whatever that something is, it definitely pervades, and it's affects other aspects of life beyond cr*p houses.

Builder UK

Look, it just seems a lot of the truths, be it mainly negatives, are glossed over. People do their research but to find this research they have to dig through a lot of exaggeration, "oh you can see the mountains" "the beautiful empty beaches" nice as the are, don't pay a mortgage on a $400,000 house.

Properties in the UK have lasted the length of time, if the property is in disrepair this will more than likely be reflected in the price, the weather is worse in UK, the proof is in the pudding the design and build quality is better, lifespan and general/average maintenance cost will probably back me up.

We have houses in the UK built just like they do in NZ, the only difference being the lawnmower lives in ours and we call it a shed ������

I'm going to leave this now, iv put my opinion across so that's me, cheers people, take it easy.

Mark Smith

This has been an entertaining/enlightening read, thanks to all the contributors.

Stormer999

garethwm

Quite amusing. Despite all the hideous diseases due to the so called crap housing and pollution, reading that better life index, I found people living in NZ have one of the longest life expectancies in the world. So which is it? NZers are disease ridden but have a wonder drug for long life, or the OECD statisticians are incompetent? Or perhaps its just that they lead fairly healthy lives, on the whole, in a fairly good environment.