mary1

Hi JAJ
I remember in a discussion ages ago that you were adamant that Northern Irish people were British whether they wanted to be or not.(My Northern Irish-Catholic- husband is pretty adamant that he is Irish and not British).

So with that in mind I would have thought that you would have thought all Shetlanders should be British or Scottish and not Scandanavian.

CPW

I suppose the thing is that how your husband views himself is not necessarily the same as his legal status, since he is (presumably) a British citizen and (presumably) also an Irish citizen (or could be an Irish citizen if he wanted to be). In his case, he could, of course, renounce his British citizenship and be solely an Irish citizen - and at present (and for the foreseeable future) he would be able to live in the UK as an Irish citizen.

The case of the Shetlanders is subtly different though - it is a question of whether they see themselves as fully Scottish or not, not of whether they see themselves as fully British or not: there is no question but that they see themselves (in the main) as British, and they are of course British citizens, while at the same time being very proud of their Nordic heritage.

And in any case, whether or not they see themselves as Scottish and whether or not they like to think of Shetland as part of Scotland, there is no question but that Shetland is part of Scotland for official and legislative purposes and so on.

Also, my strong suspicion is that for most Shetlanders this whole matter is felt rather lightly and is not something that is allowed to interfere with the important matters of day-to-day living.

mary1

My reply was directed at JAJ........

JAJ

British citizenship is not dependent on religious affiliation.


As part of the "Belfast Agreement 1998" the British government made an essentially political statement that those in British citizens born in Northern Ireland who did not wish to be regarded as British wouldn't be. This however does not cancel anyone's British citizenship under the law.

In practice, as Irish citizens can access most of the same rights in the UK as British citizens (eg voting), this policy is not going to be tested in any serious way. A future government could change it very easily (as well as limit or abolish the special rights given to Irish citizens in the United Kingdom).

In such a circumstance, with those from the Republic of Ireland no longer entitled to automatic permanent residence in the United Kingdom, Northern Irish Catholics might value their British citizenship more than at present.


If your husband really doesn't want to be a British citizen and would prefer to be solely Irish then there is a way to achieve this:
http://www.ind.homeoffice.gov.uk/ind...ionality.html?

Links are provided (in section BN18) to form RN1 and the associated guide for those wishing to renounce their British citizenship.

Persons who renounce British citizenship for a reason other than obtaining or retaining another citizenship have no automatic entitlement to resume it should they change their mind later on.

Very few Northern Irish Catholics choose to take the step of signing away their British citizenship.





Jeremy

CPW

Yes, I know that. That doesn't mean that I can't express an opinion though... Sorry if I offended.

Jensen Healey

Hmm, Uley, home of Old Spot and Pig's Ear beer. Nice.

mary1

No offence!
I should put more smiley things on my posts so that people know I like discussions with different opinions and ideas and that I'm not having a go at them!
However.......
I do think that it's rude and ignorant for people to refer to England when they mean Britain. Scotland isn't a COUNTY of England it is a different country and a hell of a lot of my ancestors died to keep our culture alive........not that I don't like England....I have a lot of English friends.

CPW

I agree - it's either rude or ignorant, usually. I don't really think of myself as Scottish but my mother was, so I supposed I'm biased, but still... I could certainly identify with Andrew Murray's irritation when some American interviewer, after a tennis match, asked him "how does it feel to be a young Englishman [etc, etc]?" I don't think the interviewer got the point even after it had been forcefully made by Murray!

And it always grates too when people who are not from the UK/Great Britain talk about "British" when they really mean "English" - "so-and-so's got a strong British accent" you often hear people say (again, typically Americans, I suppose) when what they usually mean is "English accent".

I guess it's complicated or people would get it right more than they do.

bourassa

You know what they think of people that use this kind of sentences in England?

mary1

No...go on tell me .............as long as you are being nice....!

mary1

Yes! I think they should educate all tourists to the UK on the English/British thing...give them a test before they get off the plane.....then again I am getting annoyed at petty things....just as well I don't work in the tourist industry.........I'd be a real Basil Fawlty!

possoms

They think they are racist

mary1

I'm quite the opposite.....I hate racism.