I've not got school age kids here but do lecture at a 'top 8' Australian university, and the standard of first years is nowhere near the standard of entrants at the lower end universities in the UK. My biggest observation is the very low standard of English among Australian students.

I'd just add that it seems that the state primary schools are really good here, but the state secondary schools are very poor. Most parents you speak to would only recommend private secondary schools, which are expensive.

I know that home ed wouldn't suit everyone and for many it is just unrealistic but have to say that perhaps its worth looking into even if not as a full time option but as an additional input. It needn't be overly time consuming and you might find it reassuring to take on that responsibility. Alan Thomas has published a book "Educating children at Home" that studied children in the UK USA and Australia who were taught at home and their educational outcomes and there are many more. There are lot of home ed lists and sites out there that could suggest fun activities that would supplement their education and you might just find it so rewarding you go the whole hog! Before I get too carried away I'll stop but if you want anymore info please ask. (mine are 12 next week and 14 in March)

Its amazing isnt it, that after 6 years or 16 years this is all still as emotionally draining.

I think the first 2 years were easier, rellies were keen to visit OZ, now thats totally died off, due to cost and time I suppose. If we want to see them its us doing the travelling and raising the $$$$$$.

Like you our concerns now include the the fractured family worry, eldest started an apprentiship last July hes tied into OZ till 2009 hes now angry we are considering a move again which of course would leave him behind.

Cant win, dont know the answer, right bloody mess really.

Extremely interesting post and more than a little scary I think for many people here or thinking of coming here.

The above description certainly fits in with what we have seen of schools in Perth so far (primary). It's a riot and they love it. Just as they love playing the PlayStation2. Whether it's good for them or not is a different matter.

Our experience in the Aus state school system was very short. Hollie, who was average in the UK found her work at state school ridiculously easy. Some days she would come home saying that she had watched a video in the afternoon - these were generally Disney films, Casper and the like - at the age of 11, grade 6. We lasted 5 weeks and in that time they hadn't even managed to assess her reading, spelling etc. They had nothing to give us for her new school. Since then she has been in the private system and we haven't looked back although I do worry that she will still be behind when we get back.

I hear this quite a bit and it does seem to tally with our experience so far. My daughter started school here in May 2004 and could barely speak English at that time (she's a native speaker of Japanese, and had a very basic, passive grasp of English). Within two terms she was the best reader in the class. Obviously I was pretty chuffed with how she picked up English, but it also tells you something about the general level -- my daughter is no genius. Socially, however, the fun environment was great for someone settling in to a strange, new country and just getting to grips with English. No complaints there.

I have considered private schools, but we are not religious and they all seem to come packaged with some faith or another. I know it's not always an entry requirement, but I'd prefer secular education for personal reasons. So I guess that means we're buggered! There are some good state schools, but they generally come in areas where a home for a family of five is pretty expensive. I guess I didn't do enough research on this one. There was one private school I was considering, where I was told the religion is low key. However, I've just heard they're raising money to build a church on the school grounds! Also, their results are pretty dire. It now looks like we've spent two years having the dream house built (total nightmare, still not finished, but that's another story) in the wrong place, and possibly even the wrong country!

If you go back, will you be heading back to Dorset? I grew up near Wimborne. Have you been back recently? My parents keep saying "you'll rue the day you ever came back" (read in broad Lancashire accent). He says it's changed, and the Poole and Bournemouth area is ridiculously congested now. Still miss it though.

Sorry to digress.

Must be an aussie thing..... my 7 year old says they frequently watch disney films at school?????

If its any comfort most children who do well academically have parents who are interested in their education and encourage them in the areas their talents lie. All children are born learners, its pretty much the point of being human. All you have to do is provide an environment where they absorb useful knowledge. That and not allow anything to turn off their natural desire to learn.

Terrible I know but we are 'playing the game' on the whole religion thing - needs must and all. Her primary was non denominational and very low key. The high school she starts tomorrow is pretty hard core catholic (if anything at all we are anglican!). I do feel a bit of a fraud and always feel guilty when they talk to me - feel that maybe they have religious x-ray eyes that can detect my true feelings! The whole nun, habit thing is rather disconcerting.

Yes we are going back to Dorset, we originally came from Wallisdown but intend to mve back to Westbourne. Paul grew up in Colehill, Wimborne but we can't move back there - I don't want to be walking distance from his parents as they tend to do the dropping in thing - drives me mad! We won't be able to afford much more than a masionette there now but it'll be great to be that close to the action. Poole and Bournemouth are very congested and pretty pricey but that is where we are from and we can't wait to get back!

Scarey eh? Will send you a pm soon - but until then glad you are enjoying yourself. Will get a little list of things to do in Brissie together for you!

re: education
its a different system to UK. My daughter has attended (fee paying) school in UK which focused on academic, kids learning to read and write at 4/5 yrs etc She now attends school in France which is similar to the Oz system. Emphasis is more on social skills as wells as learning to develop motor skills e.g. draw tight circles etc before actually learning to write, and learning to concentrate and other useful life skills.
Looking at the amount of grads from Oz who find no problem in working in UK and taking into consideration the newish problems of work/life balance, and my own experience of having been educated through the Oz system, I'm happy for my daughter and subsequent children to be schooled in Oz.
For information I attended a normal state primary and then all 5 of us children were sent to private schools for high school. I was put up a class at primary school as well.
I also have friends who attended state school all the way through and have had no problem obtaining qualifications and overeas work.

Jad/Rich Im really sorry to hear about your troubles; Ive just spent 10 yrs in UK with the worry of parents health probs back in Oz. Last year was the worst and I just hope we arent too late in returning (still waiting for house sale to go through). . Not sure if it helps but even after 10 years in the UK it still did not feel like home! Now we are going to have to leave family behind in Europe too
I wish you all the best with whatever decision you make.

hi jad and rich
how about getting the 16yr old an apprenticeship place in the uk, so when he arrived, straight into that, instant set of friends and interest etc on arrival? that might just soften the blow for him.
a lot of people who i know who migrated back to oz had 16yr olds who were too old to go to school, couldnt get work so bored, lonely and gave parents such a hard time, they felt forced to go back to the uk.
you also hear of people staying in oz as their children have got too grown up, established, they would never leave. i dont want to sound pessimistic, but at least at the mo, you have some kind of control over where he goes. imagine if you fast forwarded 6yrs...he has a baby , house etc. the grandkids may "keep" you here...
at least if you go sooner rather than later, you can take him too, but only you know how he'd manage if yoou didnt take him.
BLOODY HELL - its never easy is it! goog luck to you
c x

jad and rich
ps. tried to karma you - but when wrong..so ignore the message -it wont make sense! if you tell me where you plan to settle, i may be able to tell you about college apprenticeships in that area, if i can. at least you'd have sept start date, so time to get prepared. x

thanks so much for your thoughtful suggestions. Unfortunately our eldest is 20! the apprentiship required them to complete grade 12 first, then it took a year for a new intake after which the interview process took 5 months of interviews and tests. You know what its like here with rules regs and paperwork. So what we are faced with now is a person who is already in a serious relationship with an aussie girl whos close to her family and she would never leave OZ ........... He also has an attitude to it that he didnt want to come in the first place, and now hes settled were not, fair point too.

What you say about getting 'tied' here should be taken seriously by everyone with older kids education, work, relationships and eventually marriage and their own kids presents a nightmare for those who may want to return. I mean that sort of situation is managable if you live in spain but OZ is a bit further than that.

One further thing for those returning if you are going to do it think on regarding university etc, once back in the UK you pay overseas student fees until you have been back 3 years, so again it pays to get them back there in the early grades.

I know saying to people who have emigrated stick it out, get citizenship is sensible advice. BUT equally be very aware you are not locking yourself in with factors such as financial, career, childrens education and older ones relationships etc may later make that decision to stay for 3 years (citizenship I think now) one you pay heavily for later.