Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Yes I know there is another thread about this but Im doing this one from my perspective and looking at it from another angle that isn't talked about.
Its not just Syria there are other countries involved like Somalia for example or the Sudan and quite a few other places.
Sure we all sympathize with their plight especially when we see pictures of children affected by this. They are the innocent ones along with the rest of their families HOWEVER there are those who we might not wish to have integrated into whatever countries we live in that are stable and great places to live in.

How many can Canada afford to take in and where do we relocate them to. Im guessing not many would choose Iqaluit, Rankin Inlet, Thompson and a host of other places within Canada.
How do we screen these people who have no documents and we have no idea who they are or what their background is. The vast majority of refugees (not those chosen from UNHCR refugee camps) some would say almost all are allowed to make their claim once they arrive. They need to get medicals done and eventually are given work permits until their claim has been dealt with. if granted refugee status they then apply for PR status and eventually Canadian citizenship.

The vast majority move on to become productive members of society and indeed are thankful BUT there are those willing to not integrate or found to be not credible claimants or have committed serious crimes or indeed members of prescribed groups who will carry out their aims within Canada's borders. Yes I admit these numbers are only a small minority but the fact is they are already here or on their way and this is from experience not Harper fear mongering as others are claiming.
Yes we have our own citizens who commit horrendous crimes and we can't deport them but with those who are not Canadian citizens that is an option we have.

I have no problems with Canada accepting those who have been screened at UNHCR camps my problem is those who have NOT BEEN screened or it is very hard to do. Are ISIS posing as these refugees who knows but there are indications that they are.

Yes my view is somewhat different to others but its my opinion that we need to be somewhat careful and just not open the border to all and sundry. Those who choose not to register with the UNHCR or elect to make their own way to whatever country are the ones we should be concerned with to a degree.

There is no easy fix and no easy solution and yes we need to help but we should also be aware that there could be potential problems if we admit too many and what the costs will be to those unable to integrate etc etc.
Healthcare costs alone will skyrocket and is sufficient housing available?

I still haven't heard how many of these are destined to South American countries, China, Russia and the 5 richest Middle East countries i.e. Saudi Arabia, UAE, Qatar, Kuwait and Bahrain who have accepted ZERO yes ZERO of these refugees.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

My view is that in just one summer, ISIS has established the nucleus of an Islamic caliphate in Europe, even the most pessimistic of folk could not have envisioned this in such a short time.

I agree that there are far more genuine people in need and should and will be accepted as refugees, but we are not to know with any certainty at this time, how the second and third generation decendent of a refugee will act when they live in a secular or Christian country, that they feel is not a place they wish to live in harmony with others. What a bloody mess this is.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

As Canada has no easy route of access that can bypass the boarder you have a choice

Its those European countries that have been in effect invaded, the boarder controls bypassed that now have to live with this issue...

the talk of distribution fairly of these people within the EU is nice, but as they have shown, they'll walk to where they want to be and boarders are no issue...

it is many things... but one is clear its a mess and one that can't be easily tidied up

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Couldn't be bothered to read this.

Why on earth do we need a second thread on this?????

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Perhaps seeing it from a different perspective of someone who actually works in the system that deals with refugees and has 1st hand experience rather than listening to some MP or wannabe PM or pundit who has no clue and would rather Canada just open up its borders to all and sundry.
They just want to look good and pretend they are concerned without thinking of the ramifications that could ensue if we accept these people without proper screening.
I have heard talk from all the Premiers saying we can accept 5,000 in our Province but not one has put a definitive plan forward as to how they will be integrated and will the Provinces be paying or be expecting the Feds to pay for it all as last time I checked all Provinces are mired in substantial debt.
As has been said before its easy to spend other peoples money. And you seriously don't believe this is not a problem that cannot be easily solved but words will solve it?

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

If there's one thing that this has shown it's that 'economic migrants' are NOT all desperate to get to "soft touch" UK.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

You come back after not posting for a while and FL is still making all topics about his job. This must be what it's like to have seen Yes in concert, probably.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

True and I posted an interesting story on the other thread about Syrian refugees who arrived in Uruguay over a YEAR ago who are not happy and want to go back.
Syrians resettled in Uruguay: We want to go back - CNN.com

So what is it exactly they want? These were offered protection well before the events over the last month and today and tomorrow yet still want to go back.
Isn't Uruguay safer than Syria?

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Welcome back Alan2005. Im sure you have a solution for this;)

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Seriously, who is suggesting Canada opens its border to "all and sundry?"

As an expert, exactly how many Syrians have turned up at Canada's border claiming asylum?

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

It's a complex issue, but one thing most people don't seem to understand until I explain it to them is that I just don't care.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

I don't know as I only work at one POE. Now at another POE near me they are averaging around 50 Somalians a month making claims who crossed into Canada illegally from the USA. Im not claiming to be an expert (your words) but I do have a bit of knowledge on how the system works and how it is sometimes abused.
I have no idea how many will or won't turn up and neither does anyone else as they don't give us a heads up. Im sure many have families within Canada and will now make their way from Europe to Canada and make a claim be it on genuine or false documents.
I have no problem with those coming from the UNHCR camps who have been screened and vetted.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Droves. It's always droves.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Well Cameron reckons its a swarm.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

A tsunami is now the buzz word. On the tsunami theme there are waves and waves of them turning up on our shores.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

It is 233 so far this year. So a bit of extra work for your chums but Syria does not even make the top 10 of countries of origin of asylum seekers in Canada. You do realize that Syrians need a visa to travel to Canada so everyone that arrives has already undergone a level of security clearance? How on earth does issuing travel visas equate to opening the borders to all and sundry?

A storm in a teacup. At least I hope that is all it is.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

But of course, there isn't. The % is miniscule. I think Simon Jenkins was spot on in this OpEd...

If this is the best Britain can do for refugees, it’s sickening | Simon Jenkins | Comment is free | The Guardian

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Mmmm after speaking to several CIC colleagues who have worked in overseas visa offices it just might surprise you how lax some of those checks are which of course no CIC official will ever admit. There again you don't have to believe me.

Didn't the 2 Indian citizens who just recently drowned trying to be smuggled into the USA submit visa applications to be issued study permits to come and study in Canada and several days later after arriving ended up dead. Do you think they were being smuggled into the USA to do some weekend shopping?
Possible human smuggling on the river, two Indian men drown - News - Cornwall Seaway News

Human smuggling incident near Cornwall, Ont., ends in 2 deaths, police allege - Ottawa - CBC News

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Compare people to things they are terrified of and it puts fear in other people.

It just seems to me that, in this forum, there are too many people who invest far too much time on the wrong types of media.

You should be glad of the extra work and job security.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

I have enough job security without the current crisis and if called upon to do extra work then I will do it.
Because of the media and 24/7/365 online news and articles by some good journos and some not so good ones what are we to believe?
We as Canadians can't save the world but we can help and encourage others as well Im looking at you the 5 Gulf States who have not pledged to take in ANY of these people according to media reports.

I just hope and perhaps pray that in several weeks we are not reading about an incident in X country involving a group who entered X country as perceived refugees and welcomed and carry out some form of terrible attack. If this does happen then be prepared for the We told you so brigade to be out in droves and who will be accountable?

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

The "We Told You So" brigade will be out regardless.

It's what people who follow these negative media's do.

Sit there and live in fear and then sooner or later their fear is proved correct and they continue to live in fear.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Kicking off in the comments below.

Britain is a very paranoid country. I certainly don't miss that side of it.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

So to prevent this happening many innocent people will remain homeless. Seems fair, not likely to drive angry, insulted, tormented people towards an extremist group promises them what they want to hear it's a self fulfilling prophecy.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

So what are your thoughts on Canadians who are innocent and homeless don't they deserve priority care?
Some of those who were accepted as refugees several years ago before the Syria crisis began have turned their back on Canada as they have refused to integrate and committed some horrible crimes (not all terrorism offences) and have since been deported. Perhaps google Somalians and Sudanese deported from Canada to see what Im talking about.
We can't help everyone.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

I absolutely agree... What better way is there to create terrorists than for human kind to turn their back on them?

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

I guess you would have left the Jews to die in concentration camps? Stay where you are, don't try to flee, we can't help everyone. How is it different?

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Obviously you have not read my comments closely enough on the current crisis.
Are you now suggesting that the 1940s is the same as 2015. Is the world a better place now? I don't see any wars similar to WW2 taking place.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

I see a nation being persecuted, left homeless and starving, robbed of their belongings. How is it different? No the world isn't a better place now, I think people are disinterested and only out for their own gain. The western world let's all kind of atrocities happen now and actively participates in some of them..

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Because its their own Govt doing it to their own citizens. The Nazis i.e. Germany invaded several countries and rounded up the Jews in those countries and we have all seen what the end result of that was so yes there is a difference in my opinion FWIW.
Taken from another source
How many refugees are there?
Four million Syrians have registered or are awaiting registration with the United Nations High Commission of Refugees, who is leading the regional emergency response.
Thats 4 million registered not counting the estimated 8 million not registered with the UNHCR. So are you proposing Canada accepts 12 million when other countries including the 5 richest Middle East countries are accepting ZERO yes ZERO refugees who they have more in common with the Syrians than Canada has. You are now seeing the religious aspect coming into play with countries saying We don't need anymore or any Muslim refugees. Sad but true.
https://www.mercycorps.org/articles/...t-syria-crisis

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

If you saw someone being mugged would you bother to call the Police?

I'm guessing you wouldn't. Not your problem.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

You don't damn the many because of the few.

As for the claptrap argument about helping Canadians, how were you helping when they needed help and there weren't any damn foreigners to blame? Were you volunteering at the food bank? Serving dinners at the mission? Do tell.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Wow some reading this thread may think Im the cause of the Syrian refugee crisis and only choose to comment against my views in select areas as opposed to my views as a whole. I have made my point very very clear and in case its not sinking in I shall repeat it

I have no problems in the Syrian refugees who have registered with the UNHRC and are currently in refugee camps in various countries being accepted by Canada but I don't think we will be accepting the 4 yes 4 million who have registered. We also have a duty to help our own citizens who are in need as well and how I help others is my business not yours.
For all those who want to help then feel free to do so but for all the ones stating we must do this and do that then feel free to answer the following questions if you have the guts or answers because I certainly don't have them answers that is.

1. How may Syrian refugees should we accept?
2. How do we get them from Europe to here and what will it cost?
3. Where do we settle them?
4. Should these Syrians take priority over those who have been in the refugee camps longer than they have who also want a better life perhaps in Canada.
These figures are taken from the UNHCRs website

Number of forcibly displaced worldwide: 59.5 million
Number of Refugees
There were 19.5 million refugees worldwide at the end of 2014, 14.4 million under the mandate of UNHCR, around 2.9 million more than in 2013.
The other 5.1 million Palestinian refugees are registered with the United Nations Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA).
UNHCR:Facts and Figures on Refugees

Rather than venting your frustration on me vent in on others as Im not the cause.
And depending on the mugging situation I would either call the Police or if circumstances allowed intervene and subdue the mugger by any means necessary
is that a sufficient answer.
I hope to read some valid answers and carefully thought out plans to my questions posed above.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

No one needs to answer those questions. We have elected officials and public servants funded by our tax to deal with what ever we decide to vote for at the election.

The cost of human life should be immaterial.

Once you tell us where you live I'll tell you exactly where we should settle them.

In the meantime anonymously posting open ended questions into a forum where other people at best will only be able to guesstimate is a waste of poster time.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Why is it so important to you where I live and for the record the city in which I live in has already received some Syrian refugees in May 2014 and I suspect we have received some more and have pledged to take in more.

As for the cost of human life a doctor actually in my city was just found negligent in performing a supposed easy procedure and she was fined $18,000 so that is the cost in that case of a life. Some who kill others don't get fined and are sent to prison so what is that cost. Some people just get away with it at no cost or very expensive legal fees.

As for the guesstimate some posters won't even answer the questions posed as they don't have any answers or a clue yet want something done. And wanting elected officials to do something achieves the same as they don't know exactly how to deal with it etc etc they just want to look and sound good in media bites.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Wowsa, you have a hint of arrogance about you I smell with my impeccable canine nose

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

So the 200000 or so German Jews remaining in Germany at the start of the war didn't count as it was their own government? All the homosexuals, disabled people, Roma?

As you invoked Godwin's law I'll carry on with the theme. During that period several ships carrying refugees were refused entry by various countries, actions that really condemned the passengers to death.

For example the MS St Louis had 1000 Jewish people fleeing Germany. Mexico, Cuba, the USA, and Canada refused them entry so the ship had to take them back to Europe. Guess what happened to many of them.

Anti Jewish feelings were pretty rife then as is anti Muslim sentiment now, most people didn't want the Jews and the war wasn't about saving them. I worry when I see all this stuff about "look after our own first".

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

Arrogance is an unfriendly word my friend

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

You frequently in my humble opinion respond in a somewhat arrogant and belligerent manner, I chose my word carefully having read many of your recent posts. It has nothing to do with friendliness nor unfriendliness, just an observation that I felt was appropriate.

Re: Syrian refugee crisis.
 

1. Personal Attacks
BritishExpats.com is an interactive site, and everyone who participates is “in it together”, please treat others the way you wish to be treated. Personal attacks will not be tolerated. Challenge others’ points of view and opinions, but do so respectfully and thoughtfully … without insult or personal attack.

Just a reminder, as I can see this thread has the potential to get down and dirty.

Play nicely, please and thank you.

:)