Re: Masks
 

Most of the links were to assist in an application under the human rights code.. not showing they can refuse service, the link for the retail council with further links to each Province / City regulations will show where they can restrict access.

As I understand it, any business can refuse service for any reason - provided they give an accommodation....i.e. provide an alternative way for the person (disabled or not) to obtain service - it will depend on the Province and City bylaws/health and safety of employees. (Not for one moment saying I agree with them!) They can refuse service under the trespass to property act - non compliance with a requirement of the store..i.e. if the store states 'no entry without a mask' and you enter.. and then refuse to wear a mask - even with an exemption.. (for Ontario: https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/90t21 )

1. Enter premises when entry prohibited
2. Engage in prohibited activity on premises

Re: Masks
 

I disagree with your interpretation, though obviously not with you.
a few extracts from the Human rights organization page

• "People with disabilities might be expected to verify their Code-related accommodation needs, depending on the situation.
• Organizations should only request and share medical information in a way that intrudes as little as possible on a person’s privacy, and does not go beyond what is necessary to accommodate the person’s needs.
• An inability to access or use a mask or other equipment, or to follow a health and safety procedure, must not lead to automatic negative consequences such as employee discipline or termination, complete denial of service or eviction from housing.
• No one should experience harassment or other discriminatory treatment based on a Code ground because they are unable to wear a mask, or choose to wear, or not wear, a mask, or require someone else to wear a mask based on advice from public health officials."

clearly tgis store hasn't putvenoughtgouggt into accommodations, nothing new about that though.

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Yes, all very well in theory - and I have studied it extensively - however.. I can only go on what a friend experienced - he has an exemption LETTER from his doctor, cannot wear a mask - was refused service and told to leave the premises of a store.. - then the police were called and a ticket issued ' for trespass' (with lifelong 'ban' ". Engage in prohibited activity on premises" - despite the human rights code!

So be aware...

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Be aware - Beware. I never realised where that word came from until now.

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Agggh, my typos!I thought I had fixed them and it's too late now.

interesting about the ticket. I'd have put in a Human Rights complaint, which takes forever. I've had stores threaten me with the police about the service dog but when I encourage them too do so they havent yet. I also keep a copy of the relevant section of the AODA with me.

COVID, it winds everybody up

Re: Masks
 

We've had stores refusing entry to anyone that's been vaccinated!

A store should be able to refuse service for whatever reason imo. If the policy is you must wear a mask, then if you can't wear a mask, then shop somewhere that allows that.

We refuse curbside pick up, as the business owner doesn't want her staff in that close contact with other people. It's a keeping the staff safe issue. Some people are very scared about covid.

If a landlord bars someone from the pub because they were drunk, can that person take them to court for not being allowed in with other drunk ones citing being discriminated against others?

Re: Masks
 

He had a copy of the exemption letter from his GP, a copy of the Human Rights Section and the Bylaw for the City -- the store wasn't interested and neither were the police, police told him the store had a right to refuse him entry without a mask - and issued him with a trespass ticket. He has submitted a Human Rights complaint.

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No because being drunk is not a protected class of discrimination. Having a disability is and frankly its disappointing you think stores should be able to deny service to people with disabilities who are unable to meet their "store policies" that are not accommodating to those with disabilities. Unfortunately whether the stores like it or not they have a legal duty to accommodate.

Re: Masks
 

That is the operative bit "they have a legal duty to accommodate" = that accommodation can include making arrangements for the person to collect 'instore or curbside' at a time and date specifieid; an arrangement (accommodation) to enter the store at a designated time; etc., even shopping online and having items delivered is an accommodation according to the local police force... as in they are 'accommodating your need to obtain items from that store by giving you an opportunity to obtain them by an alternativie means"!

Re: Masks
 

oh you are deliberately misunderstanding what I wrote. I did not say a store has the right to refuse someone with a disability. I should imagine it was some sort of jobsworth denying entrance. That jobsworth has probably had enough of people faking not being able to wear a mask and they are more than likely burnt out with people complaining. ALSO that person may have been doing what management told them to.

I am saying that a store should be able to deny persons not meeting their policies. If someone cannot wear a mask and they know the store policy , they can always call ahead and explain and ask for an exemption, they can order online for pick up or they can have someone shop for them. We have places here, no mask, no entry, no exceptions. If my niece was here shopping with me, I would move along to the next store and spend my money there OR make arrangements to purchase the items I want in a different way. I wouldn't be going around boohooing.


we recently had a customer wanting curbside pick up, we don't do curbside pick up, she said but my Mum won't come inside, the website says you do curbside. I had to explain, not all franchises are doing curbside, ours isn't and I'm sorry we don't. Now that customer had the option of getting food delivered, or paying by phone or online, and just picking up or physically coming into the store. She ended up doing the latter.

For the record, I have never turned a customer away for not having a mask, even though it is mandated by the government and the city, I have never even asked if they would like a mask. For those that have said oh I forgot my mask, I have said oh no worries. My manager would probably have a conniption. I suppose being surrounded by so many red necks I am no longer surprised by the mentality of those around me and am more used to moving along.

Re: Masks
 

This is interesting, a comprehensive list with each area and the requirements. Several of the Ontario regions state "There is no need to turn away people not wearing a mask".

https://www.retailcouncil.org/corona...ing-retailers/

this is from the Hamilton Face Coverings and Masks bylaw
"

• Every operator shall take reasonable steps to ensure that no member of the public is permitted entry to, or otherwise remains within, the establishment unless the member of the public is wearing a face covering in a manner which covers their mouth, nose, and chin. This requirement shall not apply to members of the public that state that they fall within an exemption of this By-law or appear to fall within one of the exemptions.
• Every operator shall ensure that any person who refuses to comply with the requirements of this By-law is promptly asked to leave their establishment and is reported to authorized staff upon failure to comply with this direction.

Re: Masks
 

Seems to me that if we are moving away from the "mask mandate" then there should be universal acceptance that it is no longer a must do BUT should an individual feel safer wearing one then it's ok too. I can see there being many more interactions now between businesses and public as some will no doubt still ask customers to wear one and some of those customers may not be happy. Also those wearing them may get comments and or those not wearing them. By removing the specific mandate we will be leaving it wide open to the publics own thoughts and the businesses that want the public to visit them.
Now Tamm has come out and said masks aren't required for 2 shot people BUT they may be a good idea in crowded settings or if you have immune issues. I can see it getting very confusing for some and frustrating too for those businesses that want to maintain a safe environment for customers and staff yet are eager to get back to normality and not have to reprimand people for not following orders.

Re: Masks
 

As of July 1st Alberta is lifting restrictions. No masks, no reduced capacity etc. It seems a bot bizarre to me to do everything at once but Stampede is just around the corner and that must go ahead.

currently we are one of the only my restaurants in town that is still taking names and phone numbers for contact tracing. We have yet to hear from the owner or head office what our protocols will be.

I think it should be no capacity limitations but masks. But Kenney promised the best summer ever...

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I am wondering if BC will drop mask mandate next week. We seemed to have met the requirements the province set as goal for step 3.

"The criteria for moving to Step 3 is at least 70% of the 18+ population vaccinated with dose 1, along with low case counts and declining COVID-19 hospitalizations."

Step 3 masks go from mandated to recommended, so will be interesting to see how businesses react.

Step 3 will also allow people to return more normal life.

• Return to usual for indoor and outdoor personal gatherings
• Sleepovers

• Increased capacity at both indoor and outdoor organized gatherings with a COVID-19 Safety Plan in place
• Fairs and festivals can operate with a COVID-19 Safety Plan in place

• Canada-wide recreational travel ( this one was never enforced, nobody was ever stopping people at the airport.)

• No group limit for indoor and outdoor dining
• Liquor service restrictions lifted
• Casinos and nightclubs can operate with a limited capacity

Businesses must operate based on a new sector COVID-19 Safety Plan.

• Return to normal sport competitions with an updated COVID-19 Safety Plan in place
• Increased outdoor and indoor spectators allowed.

If cases stay low through the summer, we may see masks be declared a personal choice from recommended in step 3.


Makes sense to go at it in a step, mandated to recommended to personal choice over a couple months to see if reduced mask use will lead to spikes.



​​​​​​

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Yes. That's why I posted it ' https://britishexpats.com/forum/mapl.../#post13020505

Re: Masks
 

duh, I thought it seemed familiar

Re: Masks
 

I would be the same as you regarding the bottom bit... Just move along. The odd person not wearing it isn't going to change the 95% that do wear it.

As said there will be a lot of issues when the provincial mandate ends and certain stores try to continue enforcing it. I feel like the mandate will be in place a bit longer for this reason for indoor public places. Which is fine, it is probably better we keep wearing them. Apologies for misunderstanding, it read like you agreed with stores barring entry for people with legitimate disabilities that prevent them from wearing a mask. That's what the whole grievance is about.

It's one thing to choose not to wear a mask - I do that sometimes and I just shop online or refrain from going out if i'm feeling annoyed with covid and don't want to deal with masks, screening, or contact tracing. That's my choice. Your example of calling ahead or making accommodations is perfect for that. My sister doesn't have the choice TO wear a mask if she wanted to - her disability prevents her from doing so. She should not be discriminated against because some store jobsworth doesn't feel "comfortable." She is uncomfortable all her life with her disability, they can keep their distance and stay away from her if they are uncomfortable for the 10 minutes she is going to go in and shop.

FWIW, despite potential side effects and the fact that she doesn't understand what COVID even is, she has had her first dose of the vaccine and is waiting on the second.

Re: Masks
 

No more masks for us in BC :thumbsup: recommended, but not mandatory after July 1st.

https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/c...art#step-three

Re: Masks
 

I hope stores follow and make them optional, there will be times when I would want to wear one, but there are times like in this heat where wearing a mask is rather unpleasant.

Re: Masks
 

I noticed today that the Canadian Tire in Kelowna has a large sign "no mask no service" at door AND a security guard on duty??? This would have seemed the norm 6 months ago but 2 days before the end of mandate?
I am curious if that will change come July.

Re: Masks
 

Got my barnet cut today and neither the Barber or I were wearing masks.
Talk about living life on the edge :lol:

Re: Masks
 

Ha ha yeah it seems strange alright. We carry one just in case but so far everywhere seems a mix. Some stores have all staff wearing them some not and Boston Pizza yesterday was odd seeing all the servers without masks but nowhere so far has tried to stop anyone from entering without which of course is their right should they choose.

Re: Masks
 

We are wearing them for another 2 weeks. I'm happy with that. Was in Wal-Mart on Friday. Probably 50/50 customers were wearing masks. Busy places I will wear, less populated I won't. It's quite odd.

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If I ever watch a movie in a packed Cinema I will still wear one, even 5 years down the road from now. This Pandemic has definitely opened my eyes into how fast airborne viruses spread in enclosed indoor areas with good HVAC systems.

Re: Masks
 

I hear ya. We often used to think it was odd when when saw Asians wondering around Toronto wearing masks. Now it doesn’t seem so odd. :o

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So if I am the only one wearing a mask then who am I protecting?

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Well if you feel sick or have a cold, then you are protecting those around you.

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Everybody else, just in case you've picked up a touch of the dreaded lurgy despite being vaccinated. If you were asymptomatic you wouldn't know without constant testing.

Re: Masks
 

But where does it all stop? I've managed 60 plus years of my life without ever thinking about wearing a mask for normal activities yet now it is common place even after many mandates have been lifted and of course personal choice is fine for those that prefer to wear one. The whole reason we have vaccinations is to curb the spread, lessen the seriousness of the illness and reduce strain on our healthcare systems. Once this has been achieved the plan was always to get back to near normality. We seem to have a certain "fear factor" that's crept in where some people are very concerned about crowded places and people without masks and this has obviously been driven by the constant media coverage and the many precautions and restrictions put in place by our health professionals. Yesterdays UK news had teachers unions shouting the odds about the risks teachers face and how students should all still wear masks. Then some medical doctor was quoted as saying masks should remain we cannot let our guard down now. Of course Boris along with other leaders around the world are trying to do what's right but also stick to their promises best they can but all the time the nay Sayers and doomsday folk start telling us its too much too soon and we are heading for the next wave it doesn't help the general publics morale.

Re: Masks
 

+1
Government will always be moving the goalposts, there will always be "another wave" on the way, each time we get close to a target the government changes it so they have an excuse to continue restrictions.

Re: Masks
 

Yes, there's been a Pandemic. We didn't have one previously. Do you think that might have something t do with it? ;)
Absolutely. But that first part - curb the spread - has that been achieved or does the spread of the Delta variant in the UK suggest not?
So nothing to do with how right from the very start 'herd immunity' was abandoned in the UK because it spread uncontrollably with people dying and how we were told very early on that there would be variants as the virus spread and how we now know that there is a variant spreading more dramatically than previously despite the protection offered by the vaccines.

You call it a fear factor I call it a let's not be hasty factor. Why would you not want to exercise a little caution and accept that while Covid spreads it throws up variants the effects of which are unknown as yet other than speeding up the spread? That's insanity.

Open things up again by all means but what's wrong with a bit of transition where mask wearing in certain situations continues?
Given the way BJ has handled Covid so far he'd be the very last politician any sensible person would listen to.
Heading for the next wave? Seriously?

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/british...5263f354a.jpeg

Re: Masks
 

If people who questioned the need for precautions at the start of the pandemic don't believe in the necessity of protecting against vaccine-resistant variant strains there isn't much point in trying to convince them.

Re: Masks
 

True enough but there is a point in putting the alternative case for others in case they don't see it. That graph is particularly shocking.

Re: Masks
 

I think most western countries are split on the "it's too soon" to open up argument.

On the one hand you have the people whose job involves sitting in front of a computer all day who have had the luxury of working from home, (perhaps they even bought a puppy during lockdown) and their quality of life has improved.
Now they are beginning to realize that in the next few months they could be called back to work and have to deal with the rush hour commute, and work 8hrs in their crappy office cubicle. These are the people that seem to be making the most noise regarding "it's too soon"

Then you have the non office workers, small business owners, construction, retail staff etc who are saying enough is enough. My business closed for 3 months, I spent $$$ on plexi glass, then we did some renos inside, plus one year of mask wearing and you guys want it extended?

I see it from both sides, doing my job from home has been a blast, not having to drive to work in the winter was amazing. However, my Wife works in retail and she has had it rough. Dealing with Karen's on a daily basis since March 2020 has been tough on her. Lots of arguments, fights, customers getting banned etc all over not wanting to wear a facking mask.

Now customers have the right to choose if they wear a mask or not is the best thing ever for retail staff.

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Calgary has ditched their mask bylaw.
https://calgary.ctvnews.ca/calgary-c...ylaw-1.5496922

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https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/british...fc38e4c4a.jpeg

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https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/british...d5a981efe1.jpg

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:rofl:

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Hopefully this shows up (Twitter link).

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LOL
I was folding clean laundry the other night and I almost put my Daughters knickers (if you can call them that) in the re-reusable mask pile :lol: Now that would have been awkward.