Alan2005

Wrong. Belief in things that never happened and/or things that don't exist makes you mad. e.g. if you think there is a heaven then you are mentally ill as there is no such place. Sure you can function in society well enough, but there is still something wrong with you.

iamthecreaturefromuranus

"if you think there is a heaven then you are mentally ill as there is no such place"

Can you prove that?

Alan2005

Faith? Faith in what? Things that don't exist? I bet you'd think somebody that believed in father christmas (and I mean really believed) was nuts? admit it - you would.

My "beliefs" reflect observable reality. If you think that's "extreme" or "zealot like" that's your prerogative of course.

Alan2005

It was a logical deduction I made when I was 7.

There is no soul. There is only quantum, chemical and electrical processes going on in your brain. When you die those processes cease and that is it. accept it - you'll be happier for it.

iamthecreaturefromuranus

I have absolutely no interaction with religion at all. I'm not in the least bit religious, but I'm also not 'anti-religion'. The thing that I always find striking, in any discussion on these boards revolving around religion, is just how extreme, zealous and indeed bigoted, the views of the Atheist crowd are.

It really is quite odd.

iamthecreaturefromuranus

Logical deduction isn't proof.
You can't prove that it doesn't exist can you? You can have no more proof than people who say it does exist... and you never will have.

Alan2005

You are entitled to your views. My opinions of religious people are based on observations of how they behave around the world and the things they do and the justifications they use. I am intolerant of intolerance - this is rational. Hating gay people because god says so is not rational. You see the difference?

iamthecreaturefromuranus

See the difference.. of course.

But making claims that anybody following a religion is mad/insane isn't rational either... and then extending that claim, to suggest that kids would be better off staying in foster homes, than being fostered by a religious family, is well, insane.

Alan2005

I can't prove that there aren't orcs and elves out of tolkein either. Still, my proof was proof enough for me and that is all I need. You can twist this around and say this reflects faith, but faith in my ability to reason is not the same as blind faith in magical kingdoms of the dead.

Alan2005

It's completely rational. It's a binary choice as I said.

Personally I think generally people don't really believe and just go along to get along because it's expected of them. This is rational - and most "religious' people fit into this category.

iamthecreaturefromuranus

I can't prove any of that either, but you're saying that you're 100% certain of something that, by the very nature of the claims for it, you can never have real proof about. Balance of probabilities and modern scientific belief would obviously come down on the side of it not existing..... but 500 years ago you would have got a very different view.

You have to be, conveniently, dead before you can be 100% certain.

iamthecreaturefromuranus

It's a binary choice for you. I would claim that there are billions out there who would disagree with you.

jimf

I believe thats one of Gert Wilders favourite phrases.

Although I couldn't consider myself a believer I'm happy to respect those that do. It takes a certain level of conceit to consider those that do believe to be inferior or ill in some way. Are you seriously suggesting that the couple in the court case hate all gay people?

iamthecreaturefromuranus

Messiah complex?

bcworld

There is a campaign running in the UK at the moment to get people to think more about the religion question for Census 2011. I know people who would tick a religion box who are really of no religion, it's just something people do. My mum used to give money to the church, never went there and certainly didn't believe, it was just something you did.

http://census-campaign.org.uk/what-i...ing-christian/