Originally Posted by bodgerx

6 years is a little over the top for London. 70% of cases completed within 35 months according to the CIC...

Originally Posted by Andrew Miller

You are a novice here and looks like you didn't browse enough past posts to get at least a minimum grasp on processing reality, so I will explain it for the 100th or so time...

Processing times statistics on CIC website show times for total processing (start to visa) for cases already completed (visas issued) in reported 12 months period, not for cases submitted now.

Current AOR letters sent by CHC London to applicants who submitted simplified application ask not to expect anything for at least 49 months. Then (or much, much later) applicant will receive request for full application package with all supporting documents, will get 120 days for it and London will after that take another 120 days or so to complete processing. So, you have already at least 57 months and only assuming that there will be visas and processing resources left over after processing cases with arranged employment and already beyond any control existing backlog.

You need to know that current backlog of applications worldwide exceeds 10 years of available visa quotas (assuming current average 50% refusal rate). But those cases have second processing and visa quotas priority.

First priority, all processing resources and first visas from annual quotas are given to applications with arranged employment and to PNP cases. Only after visas and resources are left over then the backlog cases are processed with second priority.

Now take a deep breath, think about it, do the math, read past posts and especially discussions on the topic and you will understand that without arranged employment your application may not be looked at for another 5 to 8 years if not much longer.

Originally Posted by batty-x-ray

But its not always that straightforward to get a job here. I applied in 2004 to the place I am now working parttime at. They had been strugglng understaffed for 2 years, even though my application was in and the post would have filled all the criteria for a +ve LMO. They just didnt want to go down that route. I had the same experience with my application to other hospitals. So while its vaulable to point out that is a quicker way to get here I dont think its right to berate those who havent been able to get arranged employment.

Originally Posted by Andrew Miller

If employer doesn't want or cannot apply for LMO then maybe will apply for AEO that doesn't require any advertising nor proof that no Canadian was found.

If employer doesn't want to do it then look for another one - is is all numbers game. The more employers you talk to the better your odds are.

Of course not everyone will be able to find arranged employment, but so far those who managed to get it grow in numbers so fast that some HRSDC offices are getting more strict in approving LMO applications.

If persistency and focus won't work then maybe it is time to re-think the whole idea of moving to Canada. What PR will do here without a job?

Originally Posted by Andrew Miller

You are a novice here and looks like you didn't browse enough past posts to get at least a minimum grasp on processing reality, so I will explain it for the 100th or so time...

Processing times statistics on CIC website show times for total processing (start to visa) for cases already completed (visas issued) in reported 12 months period, not for cases submitted now.

Current AOR letters sent by CHC London to applicants who submitted simplified application ask not to expect anything for at least 49 months. Then (or much, much later) applicant will receive request for full application package with all supporting documents, will get 120 days for it and London will after that take another 120 days or so to complete processing. So, you have already at least 57 months and only assuming that there will be visas and processing resources left over after processing cases with arranged employment and already beyond any control existing backlog.

You need to know that current backlog of applications worldwide exceeds 10 years of available visa quotas (assuming current average 50% refusal rate). But those cases have second processing and visa quotas priority.

First priority, all processing resources and first visas from annual quotas are given to applications with arranged employment and to PNP cases. Only after visas and resources are left over then the backlog cases are processed with second priority.

Now take a deep breath, think about it, do the math, read past posts and especially discussions on the topic and you will understand that without arranged employment your application may not be looked at for another 5 to 8 years if not much longer.

Originally Posted by Andrew Miller

You are a novice here and looks like you didn't browse enough past posts to get at least a minimum grasp on processing reality, so I will explain it for the 100th or so time...

Processing times statistics on CIC website show times for total processing (start to visa) for cases already completed (visas issued) in reported 12 months period, not for cases submitted now.

Current AOR letters sent by CHC London to applicants who submitted simplified application ask not to expect anything for at least 49 months. Then (or much, much later) applicant will receive request for full application package with all supporting documents, will get 120 days for it and London will after that take another 120 days or so to complete processing. So, you have already at least 57 months and only assuming that there will be visas and processing resources left over after processing cases with arranged employment and already beyond any control existing backlog.

You need to know that current backlog of applications worldwide exceeds 10 years of available visa quotas (assuming current average 50% refusal rate). But those cases have second processing and visa quotas priority.

First priority, all processing resources and first visas from annual quotas are given to applications with arranged employment and to PNP cases. Only after visas and resources are left over then the backlog cases are processed with second priority.

Now take a deep breath, think about it, do the math, read past posts and especially discussions on the topic and you will understand that without arranged employment your application may not be looked at for another 5 to 8 years if not much longer.

Originally Posted by markhelen

could be you any more condescending?

Mark

Originally Posted by bodgerx

Yes, that's exactly what I thought.

Yes, I get it, it takes a long time.

My plan always was to obtain a job while waiting. Yes, the current stats for past processing times don't indicate FUTURE processing times. I guess I was using that as a rule-of-thumb for future applications, but things have clearly gone pear-shaped since then...

I don't need to do any "math" - I already knew that obtaining a valid job was the best chance of expediting PR. But thanks anyway Andrew.

Originally Posted by Andrew Miller

Application Guides as well as CIC website's notes are not the law - if you read all carefully you'll find the clear disclaimers in guides as well as on website advising you to look into the law (IRPA) and it's Regulations for legal answers.

Whatever guide and CIC site tell you applies to processing, not to pass mark and not to selection decision, as PMM already pointed out.

Cases will be processed against selection criteria set up by IRPA's Regulations in force at time of application. That is all, nothing about pass mark or making selection decision.

And at this time you cannot show us any place in IRPA and it's Regulations where it states that pass mark is 67 points (or any other number of points for that matter). Regulations in section 76:

http://www.canlii.org/ca/regu/sor2002-227/sec76.html

clearly state the following:

Number of points

(2) The Minister shall fix and make available to the public the minimum number of points required of a skilled worker, on the basis of

(a) the number of applications by skilled workers as members of the federal skilled worker class currently being processed;

(b) the number of skilled workers projected to become permanent residents according to the report to Parliament referred to in section 94 of the Act; and

(c) the potential, taking into account economic and other relevant factors, for the establishment of skilled workers in Canada.

Where it states in Regulations what the pass mark is???? Nowhere.

As you read the above you see that Minister shall fix and make available to the public the minimum number of points required as set by the above. And this means change pass mark from time to time accordingly to above factors. And apply new pass mark retroactively (as per R77) to all still pending applications.

This is what "Applications will be processed according to the rules and regulations in effect at the time you submit your application" means exactly - and remember that rules at the time of your application clearly state that pass mark is subject to change (R76) and that it will be applied retroactively to all pending cases (R77).

IRPA and it's Regulations state nowhere what the pass mark is and they don't state anywhere that pass mark is to be locked-in at the time of application. R76 and R77 clearly state the opposite.

Thus, changing pass mark and applying it to still pending cases (regardless what was the pass mark at the time of application) will be well in accordance with the statement you tried to interpret the way you wanted to understand it.

Everyone wants to interpret what s/he reads the way s/he wants to see it. Nothing wrong with having hopes. But if you want legal interpretation read the law.

Section 77 of IRPA's Regulations is the famous (or infamous, depending from point of view) retroactivity clause that has been already challenged numerous times since 2002 in courts and upheld by courts each time.

Any change in pass mark has already been applied retroactively in the past (Sep 2003 - it is the proof you are looking for) to all still pending applications submitted since 2002-01-01 and will be applied retroactively to all still pending applications at the time of future change(s). If anyone tells you otherwise s/he is a liar, ignorant or doesn't understand the law.

Originally Posted by mclauchlan35

Hi Andrew

Do you think if they do change the passmark they will apply it to all pending applications or From a certain date i.e 01/01/2006.


Regards
Danny

Ps apologies if you have already stated this.