British citizenship for my children

Old Jan 5th 2009, 1:51 am
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Default British citizenship for my children

Apologies for posting this in the 'moving back home' thread because it's not entirely related to returning to the UK, well not for me and not for the next 16+ years at least

My wife and I are both British citizens and Australian permanent residents, in Oct 2007 we welcomed into the world our twin girls. They are Australian citizens because they were born to British parents where reside in Australia as permanent residents.

Now we've not immediate plans to return to the UK, however I would like to secure my childrens dual citizenship to ensure they've got the option should they/we ever need it.

From what I understand they are entitled to British citizenship, as both parents are British Citizens (both my wife and I were bork in UK to British parents) born overseas. But what I don't understand is do we just apply for British passports for them and that's it? Or do we need to register them as British citizens (form mn1? Please tell me I don't have to pay >$1100 each to register them!).

We're planning a trip to UK later this year, so getting them both Australian and British passports could be helpful for skipping the queues at immmigration

What is the easiest/cheapest way to ensure they get their rightful dual-citizenship

Thanks in advance for any advice/information.

Gary
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Old Jan 5th 2009, 2:13 am
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Default Re: British citizenship for my children

Originally Posted by gfrost75 View Post
Apologies for posting this in the 'moving back home' thread because it's not entirely related to returning to the UK, well not for me and not for the next 16+ years at least

My wife and I are both British citizens and Australian permanent residents, in Oct 2007 we welcomed into the world our twin girls. They are Australian citizens because they were born to British parents where reside in Australia as permanent residents.

Now we've not immediate plans to return to the UK, however I would like to secure my childrens dual citizenship to ensure they've got the option should they/we ever need it.

From what I understand they are entitled to British citizenship, as both parents are British Citizens (both my wife and I were bork in UK to British parents) born overseas. But what I don't understand is do we just apply for British passports for them and that's it? Or do we need to register them as British citizens (form mn1? Please tell me I don't have to pay >$1100 each to register them!).

We're planning a trip to UK later this year, so getting them both Australian and British passports could be helpful for skipping the queues at immmigration

What is the easiest/cheapest way to ensure they get their rightful dual-citizenship

Thanks in advance for any advice/information.

Gary
Your kids are British Citizens by descent.You do not have to register them.To establish their British nationality ou would provide evidence of linkage to you or your wife.Ie Long birh cert

Hope this helps
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Old Jan 5th 2009, 2:30 am
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Default Re: British citizenship for my children

We registered the birth of our boys with the US embassy. They now have British birth certificates, handy if they ever let the passports run out and loose them. Then when we were ready to travel to UK with them we got them UK passports.
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Old Jan 5th 2009, 2:54 am
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Default Re: British citizenship for my children

Originally Posted by Mummy in the foothills View Post
We registered the birth of our boys with the US embassy. They now have British birth certificates, handy if they ever let the passports run out and loose them.
Consular birth registration is convenient, however is not available for births in Australia. British passport is the only way to prove citizenship.
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Old Jan 5th 2009, 4:17 am
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Default Re: British citizenship for my children

When I was at the British HC the other day we asked if my granddaughter could get a British passport and surprisingly they said she could! Her dad was born in Aus but he was registered at the BHC back in 1982 when he was born. Apparently this is enough for her to get a passport - I think the consular registration was just a short window of opportunity which he managed to slot into.

We have to take her birth certificate, his passport, his consular registration document, medicare card with their family on it and I hope that is it! With two British born parents you should have no problems. They wont be able to pass their citizenship on to their kids though unless they happen to be living in UK when those kids are born. I think it is about $190 for a kid's passport these days.
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Old Jan 5th 2009, 7:00 am
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Default Re: British citizenship for my children

My daughter just received her british passport last summer (July)when we were in the UK (for only 3 wks). It was fast actually. I'm Canadian (no british parents) and hubby's british so we just applied to get our baby's british passport. We just needed to show her birth cert. (eventhough she was born in Canada) and hubby's infos. That's all
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Old Jan 5th 2009, 9:08 pm
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Default Re: British citizenship for my children

Ok thanks for all your help. So passport it is nice and easy

I actually didn't realise that as the girls were born outside of UK they would be citizens by decsent and therefore their children/my grandchildren would not be citizens unless born in the UK.

That is right isn't it? If their children are born in the UK (should they have children of course), then they would be British citizens? Otherwise if born outside of UK then the father would need to be British for the British citizenship to continue down the line?

Thats a far away scenario (they are only 14 months old) but just interesting to know so I've got it clear in my mind.
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Old Jan 6th 2009, 12:41 am
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Default Re: British citizenship for my children

Originally Posted by quoll View Post
When I was at the British HC the other day we asked if my granddaughter could get a British passport and surprisingly they said she could! Her dad was born in Aus but he was registered at the BHC back in 1982 when he was born. Apparently this is enough for her to get a passport - I think the consular registration was just a short window of opportunity which he managed to slot into.
I am not sure if this advice was correct. Did they put it in writing?

Prior to 1983, High Commissions could register children as British citizens (this moved to the Home Office in 1983) and this person (her father) would have been registered as a Citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies by birth.

However, the father would have held Right of Abode in the U.K. only through his parents or grandparents. As a result, due to section 14 of the British Nationality Act 1981, on 1 January 1983 he would have become a British citizen by descent.

Unless his own father or mother was in U.K. recruited "Crown Service" when he was born in 1982.

So it is not clear why the High Commission helpline thinks he can pass on his status.

Did he live in the U.K. for 3 years or more and is the granddaughter less than 12 months old? If so, there is eligibility for British citizenship but requires Home Office registration.
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Old Jan 6th 2009, 3:46 am
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Default Re: British citizenship for my children

I would check out the British Home Office website. I downloaded the necessary forms to apply for British citizenship and a British passport for my daughter (born in the USA - adopted at birth, to one USA parent and one British parent) using this website. We had to go through a longer process because of the adoption - essentially a petition to the Home Office where the decision was at their discretion. It was approved. The laws changed the year she was born - 1998 - it would have been an easier process prior to 1998.

In my opinion you're doing them a favour by taking the effort to apply for dual citizenship while it's available. Who knows what changes there will be to the laws in the future.

Good luck.
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Old Jan 6th 2009, 4:19 am
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Default Re: British citizenship for my children

Originally Posted by Manx View Post
I would check out the British Home Office website. I downloaded the necessary forms to apply for British citizenship and a British passport for my daughter (born in the USA - adopted at birth, to one USA parent and one British parent) using this website. We had to go through a longer process because of the adoption - essentially a petition to the Home Office where the decision was at their discretion. It was approved. The laws changed the year she was born - 1998 - it would have been an easier process prior to 1998.
There was no change to the law in 1998. You may be referring to some changes which took effect in 2003.

It wasn't "easier" before 1998, for what it's worth. Even now, unless adoption qualifies as a Hague Convention adoption, the normal route to British citizenship for children adopted overseas by British citizens is registration as a British citizen under section 3(1) of the British Nationality Act 1981.

This is "discretionary" but in practice is approved if policy requirements are met.

By the way, if your adopted daughter's natural parents are American (ie not British) and she is registered under section 3(1) of the 1981 Act (check her citizenship certificate) then it means she is British otherwise than by descent.
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Old Jan 6th 2009, 4:57 am
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Default Re: British citizenship for my children

I'm a bit confused as my daughter had a baby in Australia in August then moved back to the UK a few months later as she didnt settle.

She tried to register the baby and was told that she can't she has to apply for a Bitish visa and could only stay in the UK with him for 6 months. After that time she has to leave the UK with him whilst afore- mentioned visa is granted???

The baby is born of British parents with British Grandparents. I reckon she's talked to the wrong person.

Where does she need to go to organise his citizenship, birth certificate etc.? She is now considering moving back as she feels she made a mistake going back!!

She would need to sort this out before she came over.
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Old Jan 6th 2009, 5:01 am
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Default Re: British citizenship for my children

Originally Posted by tracey.d View Post
I'm a bit confused as my daughter had a baby in Australia in August then moved back to the UK a few months later as she didnt settle.

She tried to register the baby and was told that she can't she has to apply for a Bitish visa and could only stay in the UK with him for 6 months. After that time she has to leave the UK with him whilst afore- mentioned visa is granted???

The baby is born of British parents with British Grandparents. I reckon she's talked to the wrong person.

Where does she need to go to organise his citizenship, birth certificate etc.? She is now considering moving back as she feels she made a mistake going back!!

She would need to sort this out before she came over.
There are at least four different scenarios on this thread, so there's likely to be lots of confusing responses.

However ...

Was your daughter born in the United Kingdom. If so, just apply to the Passport Office for a British passport for the child => problem solved.
http://www.ips.gov.uk/passport/index.asp

Or was she born in Australia? If so, where was the baby's father born? And when was the child born?
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Old Jan 6th 2009, 7:41 am
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Default Re: British citizenship for my children

Originally Posted by JAJ View Post
I am not sure if this advice was correct. Did they put it in writing?

Prior to 1983, High Commissions could register children as British citizens (this moved to the Home Office in 1983) and this person (her father) would have been registered as a Citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies by birth.

However, the father would have held Right of Abode in the U.K. only through his parents or grandparents. As a result, due to section 14 of the British Nationality Act 1981, on 1 January 1983 he would have become a British citizen by descent.

Unless his own father or mother was in U.K. recruited "Crown Service" when he was born in 1982.

So it is not clear why the High Commission helpline thinks he can pass on his status.

Did he live in the U.K. for 3 years or more and is the granddaughter less than 12 months old? If so, there is eligibility for British citizenship but requires Home Office registration.
No he didnt put it in writing and I must admit I was surprised but the chap on the desk did say that because he had the registration certificate he was classified as British other than by descent. I certainly queried it and was told which documents I needed to bring with me. As he had the father's (my son's) documents right there in front of him he certainly knew that he was born here and registered here.

If they say it is a no go then I have lost nothing except a set of photos really and she will have more options for it. It was easy for DS to get his passport though, he was put on mine when he was a few weeks old and got his own some time later.

Did his citizenship status actually change retrospectively then in 1983?
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Old Jan 6th 2009, 2:50 pm
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Default Re: British citizenship for my children

Hi JAJ
You're probably right. I'm not an expert. I thought it had changed in 1998 - I can't remember why now. It must have been something I read. Anyway, everyone we dealt with either by email or phone, was most helpful, and it was worth doing.
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Old Jan 7th 2009, 1:20 am
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Default Re: British citizenship for my children

Originally Posted by quoll View Post
No he didnt put it in writing and I must admit I was surprised but the chap on the desk did say that because he had the registration certificate he was classified as British other than by descent. I certainly queried it and was told which documents I needed to bring with me. As he had the father's (my son's) documents right there in front of him he certainly knew that he was born here and registered here.

If they say it is a no go then I have lost nothing except a set of photos really and she will have more options for it. It was easy for DS to get his passport though, he was put on mine when he was a few weeks old and got his own some time later.

Did his citizenship status actually change retrospectively then in 1983?
Prior to 1983, people were Citizens of the United Kingdom and Colonies (CUKC). The CUKC population was divided between those who had Right of Abode in the United Kingdom (ROA) - those connected up to grandparent with the United Kingdom, Channel Islands and Isle of Man - and those who did not, usually people connected with former colonies.

On 1 January 1983, the CUKC population was split up as follows:

1. Those with ROA became British citizens (with one exception that applied in very few cases).
2. Those connected to a British territory became British Dependent Territories citizens (later renamed British overseas territories citizens).
3. Any that did not fall into (1) or (2) became British Overseas citizens.

Regarding those who became British citizens (group 1):

- Those who were CUKC by descent became British citizens by descent.
- A lot of CUKCs by birth or naturalisation also became British citizens by descent if their claim to ROA was not through birth or naturalisation in the United Kingdom itself, or Channel Islands/Isle of Man.
- There were exemptions for those with parents in "Crown Service"

Quoll : your son was registered as a CUKC in 1982 - I presume under section 7 of the British Nationality Act 1948 (check the certificate) - but a section 7 registration done by a High Commissioner after 28 October 1971 is not considered "registration in the United Kingdom". Hence your son had his ROA claim not from his own registration but from his own parent being born in the U.K.

And as a result of all that it appear that he became a British citizen by descent on 1 January 1983.

You haven't told us yet if he ever lived in the United Kingdom. If so, perhaps his daughter could be registered as British on that basis. Nor have you said if Crown Service is involved.



You should understand that being issued a passport by mistake does not make someone automatically into a British citizen. You may wish to read this section of the Nationality Instructions, chapter 6:
http://www.bia.homeoffice.gov.uk/sit...ns/nichapter6/

6.3.8 Cases sometimes come to light where, due to official error, people have been consularly registered while ineligible for such registration or wrongly issued with British passports or certificates of entitlement to the right of abode. As a result they might have lost age- or time-limited entitlements to citizenship. So that they are not disadvantaged by the official error we should be ready in such cases to construe the application as an undetermined application for citizenship and process it accordingly.

6.3.9 This policy ... is intended primarily to benefit people who had, but no longer have, an avenue to registration under the minor or other registration provisions of the British Nationality Act 1948 or the British Nationality Act 1981 and have been led to believe that they are British or have a UK right of abode. Although we should act reasonably in the circumstances of each individual case, the policy should not normally apply where:

• a realistic avenue to citizenship is still open, or
• at the time of the error, the person would clearly not have been eligible for the grant of citizenship (as would be the case, for instance, with an adult who was unable to meet the unwaivable requirements for naturalisation or registration)

but any discretion should normally be exercised in the person's favour.

6.3.10 The policy should not apply, either:

• where there is reason to believe that the passport, certificate of entitlement or consular birth registration was obtained by deception, or
• where the person could reasonably have known that no such claim existed.




I suggest you go back to the consulate and ask for confirmation of the claim to citizenship in writing.

Last edited by JAJ; Jan 7th 2009 at 1:22 am.
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