joydot

both neth and suisse acclimatise their migs with substantial thought and consideration. they also stipulate serious but logical language acquisition rules. at daughters 1st school in central london maybe 5% spoke english as a first language - it would take canada one hell of a long time to get there - and this in a country where they still debate over latin being taught as a second language and no serious attempts were made ensuring new arrivals could communicate. the french language thing in canada is charming - not overly useful - but charming. cricket on the other hand is useless for anything other than laundry commercials lol...

Jingsamichty

British children, like most children, have two eyes and two ears.

Pretty much all they read and hear about in the UK is constant moaning, criticism, negative attitudes, demonisation, blame, distrust and the "Britain's gone to the dogs" syndrome.

The "British snarly attitude" has become so all-pervading that it's what young people think is normal.

We reap wot we sow, innit.

rae

while i accept perfectly some of the responses... stats can be skewed, persons/organisations have their own agendas, findings may only include a small part of the populace, there are perfectly nice schools in the uk offering a great education, there is one thing i find odd, the notion that if this does not directly affect you it does not matter. surely it matters that the country is clearly failing its children, this is reflected in recent UN and UNICEF polls and surveys also, i am sure they are easily googled. you can't be cynical about everyone and everything, someone somewhere must be accurate.

i was unsure where to post this, returning back to the uk, for those wobbling like myself, looking for info that may sway them?
general chat, political opinions, maple leaf off topic? it applies to many areas i suppose.
i did not expect people from the uk to defend the education system there so robustly, it must, must be a consideration for those with children that they could be better educated elsewhere.

JAJ

A survey result is not a good reason to move to Canada.

What might be more productive is to think about which country would be a better place - in economic and social terms - to spend the rest of your life. And for your children, and grandchildren.

The trend towards authoritarianism in Britain since 1997 should worry anyone who wants to live in an open and free society. Especially as there is no guarantee that a different government would do anything to reverse this.

And if you decide Canada is for you, then are you prepared to make the personal sacrifices necessary to make it work. (many find out, to their cost, that they are not).

rae

sorry i don't see your point, unless its that due to poor attitude of the children the system fails. don't all kids have bad attitudes some of the time, they certainly did when i went to school, myself included.
i think this is where that supposedly highly trained person at the front of the class steps in, supported by local and national government.

joydot

yes, there are good schools everywhere, but access isnt always easy or possible - esp in the uk. maybe try a different part of canada before returning to the uk - provinces can be very different??? my ontario-raised friend left calgary for ontario and ended up back in calgary 3 years later... happy as now

rae

quite, this whole thread for info and interest only. it cannot be relied upon anymore than it should be casually discounted out of hand as malicious or inaccurate. food for thought, nothing more.

rae

actually its the education primarily that keeps us here, which in comparison to our experience in the uk is light years apart. the personal sacrifice as mentioned coming to the fore. we will see what/who wins. i know what it should be morally and ethically, does not make it any easier at times though.

Jingsamichty

The other way around, actually. Kids reflect the attitude of society in general, which for a very long time indeed has just been one of cynicism, carping, dumbing down and blame.

rae

so if the general attitude is poor, the kids attitude is poor and this is attributed to poor performance and partly the results of this survey. i still contend then that a teacher should be sufficiently equipped to deal with this. i hardly think teaching teenagers with bad attitudes would be somewhat of a surprise, come on.

joydot

ah jings, here i am not sure. data shows most kids are coping well all things considered. at the end of the day - how much can we ask of them considering what goes on around them?

the guards posted at holland park school gates were a result of diabolical leadership both at school and bureaucrat level. it was painful to watch the inappro delegation of responsibility. and i believe one of the worst school heads of all time is still smugly in his post.

Cape Blue

Indeed, but I am not sure the report had a great deal to say about their education, as I mentioned before the report assessed things like infant mortality - if your kids are already here they are likely to be past that issue. It assessed housing - if you are likely to have a decent house then the report does not relate to your kid.

What the report really says is that the UK has a higher wealth disparity than elsewhere in Europe and that this can be evidenced by a larger population of poor people that frequently have attributes that disadvantage their kids.

Poverty, infant mortality, obesity, housing, non-working parents etc are what this report is measuring, not the ability of middle class kids from a stable background to succeed in the UK.

Yes, it is a shame that the UK has this disparity and it impact negatively on those experiencing it, but in reality it has very little if any impact on the average BE members kids and their future. Certainly this report does not produce evidence of the reason to leave the UK for ones kids.

rae

the last line would depend on your personal circumstances. if you met one of the criteria you outline, but had the chance to move due to family say, then i am sure it would be very applicable.
the report measures a lot of things, the individual points could be contentious and argued endlessly for and against, the problem is its not the first or only one.

Jingsamichty

Basically, most kids are good kids.

Most teachers are decent enough.

If you believe some of the stats, British education has never been better, with 99% getting A's and record numbers going to university.

If you believe other stats, British kids leave school not being able to spell their own names or count to 100.

"24th out of 26th" is utterly, utterly meaningless.

montreal mike

what if the UK had swapped places with the netherlands?

would 1st out of 26 also be equally meaningless?