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Tenancy agreements

Tenancy agreements

Old May 30th 2020, 1:59 am
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Default Tenancy agreements

Hey all

Really feeling a bit demoralised today.

As I mentioned in another post, going through a really nasty break up.

We shared an apartment (both names on the lease) and I'm trying to get my name off seeing as she's basically banned me from going there. But after speaking with both the Landlords and tenants board, and also the customer service line of the company that owns the apartments, I'm under the impression that I can't simply remove my name without her consent. And there's no way she'll give me that, seeing as if she does she'll be charged the new going rate for the units (several hundred dollars more than currently), and she wishes to keep living there.

She is very unpredictable and threatening as of late. Still holding my mail and several of my possessions as hostage. I have been advised by quiet a few people that know her that it would be VERY unwise to leave my name on the lease of a place I'm not living in but still liable for. But I'm not sure what options I have to get out?

Surely there must be a tonne of legal precedent for this? I'm certain lots of couples leasing apartments break up and problems ensue, especially if its not amicable. I have to imagine there is a system to remove yourself if the one partner refuses to allow it? I mean what if she just decides to stay there forever, my name stays on the lease for ever? seems absurd surely.

I will add the important note that we are well past our year long initial lease commitment and are now considered month to month.

Any input appreciated,

CRAY

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Old May 30th 2020, 9:59 am
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Default Re: Tenancy agreements

Seeing as we don't know where you are I suggest google searches with stuff like how do I have my name removed from a lease in X location. You will probably get a number of hits but look at those with official Province websites or the actual act itself.
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Old May 30th 2020, 2:30 pm
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Default Re: Tenancy agreements

I think you should consult a lawyer about your situation. If your ex knows that you have done so, she might become more reasonable.
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Old May 30th 2020, 4:00 pm
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Default Re: Tenancy agreements

As you are both on the lease your partner cannot dictate that you leave - and you may not be tied to a lease if there has been domestic violence /abuse... so that may be worth looking into.. If it came down to it, as the apartment is on a month to month basis now you have the ability to give notice to the landlord of vacating - 60 days in Ontario - and your ex will have to move out... problem solved. The landlord may go back to them and ask if they wish to continue renting.... but that isn't your problem.

With regards to your belongings, you need some legal advice - personally I would send a letter by recorded delivery (i.e. signed for) stating that you require your belongings to be available for collection / returned to you by xyz date - listing the belongings, so that there is a record. If any of it came from the UK and was on a 'goods to follow' / 'accompanying' list - or you have receipts for them if you purchased them here, so much the better for proving they are yours not jointly purchased items.

There is part of the residential tenancies act which covers abuse -- use Ctrl+F (find) and input the word 'abuse' - https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/06r17 you could perhaps explain to the landlord about the situation rather than saying 'hey, we've split up, I want to get off the lease"... saying "I need to explain why the relationship has ended and why I had to move out, I was living under threat of violence by (insert name) and it had become an unsafe environment" etc., ...... but do get legal advice if you can, you should be able to get a fixed fee phone interview - or use one of the Community Legal Services - https://211ontario.ca/211-topics/government-legal/ (input the town/city and it will bring up what is available)

Hope things improve.

Do get a redirect on your mail - it's not expensive
https://www.canadapost.ca/cpc/en/per...FfGqxQId9eIKyw
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Old May 30th 2020, 4:14 pm
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Default Re: Tenancy agreements

Originally Posted by Former Lancastrian View Post
Seeing as we don't know where you are I suggest google searches with stuff like how do I have my name removed from a lease in X location. You will probably get a number of hits but look at those with official Province websites or the actual act itself.
This was my first port of call, plus calling the landlord and tenants board and also the customer service line for the corporation that owns the building. The options I got were:
  • Negotiate with the other tenant (very unlikely based on her past behaviour)
  • Negotiate with the landlord (very unlikely, its a large Canada wide corporation as opposed to a single "landlord" and they refer to standard policy on any matters like this. Which is if that there are any significant changes to the lease they make the tenants sign a new one and charge them the current market rental value of the property. All tenants have to agree to this, again unlikely.
  • File an N15 form, which is basically me stating I left because of domestic or sexual abuse ( which is actually somewhat true in my opinion, but I'm really reluctant to take this action as I'm not really even sure what constitutes abuse these days)
  • There may be other options I'm not aware of yet...

Originally Posted by Snowy560 View Post
I think you should consult a lawyer about your situation. If your ex knows that you have done so, she might become more reasonable.
I really didn't want to have to resort to this, but its looking like the only option. The main problem is that if it becomes some kind of legal war with her and her family I'm basically broke, unemployed due to covid and have no family support network around. In other words she has a lot more resources than me, and more importantly she's significantly more vicious. I have planned to give a couple of the free legal clinics around town a call Monday so hopefully that might lead to something.

Fear has played a huge role in completing tasks in the last few months. That's often an overlooked factor in situations like this when people looking in from the outside say why didn't you just do x or call y etc.
For example, when I first decided to leave she found out I had called the super of our building to ask for advice on our situation, and how best to proceed. She flew in to a wild rage, screaming things like "how dare you talk to someone else about us" and "are you stupid, they might evict us" etc. I'm loosely paraphrasing there, with significantly less curse words than were used at the time of course, but you get the idea.
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Old May 30th 2020, 4:17 pm
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Default Re: Tenancy agreements

Originally Posted by CRAY View Post
Hey all

Really feeling a bit demoralised today.

As I mentioned in another post, going through a really nasty break up.

We shared an apartment (both names on the lease) and I'm trying to get my name off seeing as she's basically banned me from going there. But after speaking with both the Landlords and tenants board, and also the customer service line of the company that owns the apartments, I'm under the impression that I can't simply remove my name without her consent. And there's no way she'll give me that, seeing as if she does she'll be charged the new going rate for the units (several hundred dollars more than currently), and she wishes to keep living there.

She is very unpredictable and threatening as of late. Still holding my mail and several of my possessions as hostage. I have been advised by quiet a few people that know her that it would be VERY unwise to leave my name on the lease of a place I'm not living in but still liable for. But I'm not sure what options I have to get out?

Surely there must be a tonne of legal precedent for this? I'm certain lots of couples leasing apartments break up and problems ensue, especially if its not amicable. I have to imagine there is a system to remove yourself if the one partner refuses to allow it? I mean what if she just decides to stay there forever, my name stays on the lease for ever? seems absurd surely.

I will add the important note that we are well past our year long initial lease commitment and are now considered month to month.

Any input appreciated,

CRAY
Hi Cray, I'm sorry that you're going through such a rough patch, these things are never easy.

I would echo Snowy's advice to seek some legal advice. With your former partner acting so unreasonably, plus your concerns from a previous thread about filing taxes, I really do think that you need some good advice as to what you can and can't do to make sure your best interests are protected. If finances are an issue do you have any no or low cost community legal centres or similar in your area that you could approach?

It's easy to become overwhelmed at times like this, everything just seems so hard and sometimes there doesn't seem to be any way out of the tangle of issues that need to be fixed. As well as getting some professional advice on your options, it might be a good idea to have a chat to your doctor if you're feeling really stressed and overwhelmed.

Good luck, I hope there are much better days ahead for you.

Edit: I hadn't read your latest post before posting mine, sorry if I've echoed anything already said

Last edited by spouse of scouse; May 30th 2020 at 4:22 pm.
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Old May 30th 2020, 4:32 pm
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Default Re: Tenancy agreements

Originally Posted by CRAY View Post
This was my first port of call, plus calling the landlord and tenants board and also the customer service line for the corporation that owns the building. The options I got were:
  • Negotiate with the other tenant (very unlikely based on her past behaviour)
  • Negotiate with the landlord (very unlikely, its a large Canada wide corporation as opposed to a single "landlord" and they refer to standard policy on any matters like this. Which is if that there are any significant changes to the lease they make the tenants sign a new one and charge them the current market rental value of the property. All tenants have to agree to this, again unlikely.
  • File an N15 form, which is basically me stating I left because of domestic or sexual abuse ( which is actually somewhat true in my opinion, but I'm really reluctant to take this action as I'm not really even sure what constitutes abuse these days)
  • There may be other options I'm not aware of yet...



I really didn't want to have to resort to this, but its looking like the only option. The main problem is that if it becomes some kind of legal war with her and her family I'm basically broke, unemployed due to covid and have no family support network around. In other words she has a lot more resources than me, and more importantly she's significantly more vicious. I have planned to give a couple of the free legal clinics around town a call Monday so hopefully that might lead to something.

Fear has played a huge role in completing tasks in the last few months. That's often an overlooked factor in situations like this when people looking in from the outside say why didn't you just do x or call y etc.
For example, when I first decided to leave she found out I had called the super of our building to ask for advice on our situation, and how best to proceed. She flew in to a wild rage, screaming things like "how dare you talk to someone else about us" and "are you stupid, they might evict us" etc. I'm loosely paraphrasing there, with significantly less curse words than were used at the time of course, but you get the idea.
It sounds as if you should consider moving to another area once you have this sorted. First thing I would concentrate on is getting your belonging back.. You can request a police officer accompanies you to collect your belongings if you are at risk of abuse / violence. Then you can move to another area (well away from where she and her family live) and put a redirect on your mail, followed by giving notice on the apartment.
Hang in there......

Last edited by Siouxie; May 30th 2020 at 4:35 pm.
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Old May 30th 2020, 6:24 pm
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Default Re: Tenancy agreements

Many thanks for the advice, and I really appreciate all that information, I typed my last response as some of you posted yours I guess, so didn't have chance to read before I posted. It also just feels good to have some support. Even if just verbally.

I knew even at the time I didn't HAVE to leave when she told me to. But I had basically been relegated to an old sofa in the spare room by then, and was being woken periodically through the night to be screamed at, then getting up for work at 5am, so my will to endure it really dwindled fast. And the 60 days notice thing is currently the most likely option I'll take. But 60 days is a long time for her to become 'upset' about events and cause problems.

I did call the local police detachment and they mentioned about the option of a civil standby to help me get my stuff back. Not sure how I'd prove I own some of the expensive stuff I bought on kijiji though.

I would like to add that I don't think she is a 'bad' person if there is such a thing, but I'v become more and more convinced by people that her behaviour is very indicative of something like BPD. The more I try get control of my life back the more she tries to escalate with aggression/threats etc to maintain control of me. But I'm no psychologist, just guess work. And her parents/family are actually really nice people for the most part to be honest, she's just banned me from talking to them. So I'm assuming I have been bad mouthed rotten by now.

And I am considering moving, but it's a hard decision. I liked my job and have been informed I will be immediately re-employed when they open again, and some of my best friends are here now. I don't have access to a car anymore so that will make a move more difficult. There's also the factor that I still care about her a lot. I just don't want to be controlled by her is all.
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Old May 30th 2020, 8:12 pm
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Default Re: Tenancy agreements

Originally Posted by CRAY View Post
Many thanks for the advice, and I really appreciate all that information, I typed my last response as some of you posted yours I guess, so didn't have chance to read before I posted. It also just feels good to have some support. Even if just verbally.

I knew even at the time I didn't HAVE to leave when she told me to. But I had basically been relegated to an old sofa in the spare room by then, and was being woken periodically through the night to be screamed at, then getting up for work at 5am, so my will to endure it really dwindled fast. And the 60 days notice thing is currently the most likely option I'll take. But 60 days is a long time for her to become 'upset' about events and cause problems.

I did call the local police detachment and they mentioned about the option of a civil standby to help me get my stuff back. Not sure how I'd prove I own some of the expensive stuff I bought on kijiji though.

I would like to add that I don't think she is a 'bad' person if there is such a thing, but I'v become more and more convinced by people that her behaviour is very indicative of something like BPD. The more I try get control of my life back the more she tries to escalate with aggression/threats etc to maintain control of me. But I'm no psychologist, just guess work. And her parents/family are actually really nice people for the most part to be honest, she's just banned me from talking to them. So I'm assuming I have been bad mouthed rotten by now.

And I am considering moving, but it's a hard decision. I liked my job and have been informed I will be immediately re-employed when they open again, and some of my best friends are here now. I don't have access to a car anymore so that will make a move more difficult. There's also the factor that I still care about her a lot. I just don't want to be controlled by her is all.

If it's month to month, wouldn't you just be able to give proper notice that your moving and end the tenancy?
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Old May 31st 2020, 3:28 pm
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Default Re: Tenancy agreements

Originally Posted by Jsmth321 View Post
If it's month to month, wouldn't you just be able to give proper notice that your moving and end the tenancy?
I think the notice is 60 days as Siouxie said. Which is inconvenient, but a solid option in absence of anything better.

One thing though, I was under the impression that I thought all tenants have to agree to terminate a lease? That was part of my initial concern, that she simply wouldn't agree, then I'd have to get a lawyer or something.
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Old May 31st 2020, 5:35 pm
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Default Re: Tenancy agreements

Originally Posted by CRAY View Post
I think the notice is 60 days as Siouxie said. Which is inconvenient, but a solid option in absence of anything better.

One thing though, I was under the impression that I thought all tenants have to agree to terminate a lease? That was part of my initial concern, that she simply wouldn't agree, then I'd have to get a lawyer or something.
This may be of use - if you fill out the forms to state that you are in an violent / abusive situation, the other tenants on the lease retain their tenancy.. but your name would be removed.
It's against the law for the landlord (or the superintendent) to tell anyone what you have written.. so your ex wouldn't be given the information.
Look towards the bottom of this --- then fill out the 2 forms below (open in new tabs, no download necessary to see them)
LTB | Brochure: How a Tenant Can End Their Tenancy
http://www.sjto.gov.on.ca/documents/...ctions/N15.pdf
this is the other form you would need http://www.sjto.gov.on.ca/documents/...0Statement.pdf

Ending a tenancy early: You are a victim of sexual or domestic violence

If you or a child living with you is a victim of sexual or domestic violence, you can end your tenancy with 28 days' notice if you believe you or the child may be harmed if you don't leave the unit. You can give this notice any time during your tenancy.
If you are in a joint tenancy and the other tenants don't sign the notice or you choose not to tell them about it, the tenancy will continue for those tenants.
https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/06r17#BK60 read 47:2 (1 / 1a) and (2a) - and the rest of the section - the full act says "Abuse" - so not necessarily violence


Otherwise, I believe either member of a joint tenancy agreement can give notice, but you might want to check
http://www.sjto.gov.on.ca/documents/...Tenancies.html
Hope that might help... but get your stuff out asap!

Last edited by Siouxie; May 31st 2020 at 5:52 pm.
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Old May 31st 2020, 6:04 pm
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Default Re: Tenancy agreements

From the sound of it this person isn't suddenly going to become happy go lucky and calm. So, regardless of how unpleasant they may become if you give notice.... the only way to get out the other side of this is to start the process. Good luck.
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Old Jun 2nd 2020, 2:33 am
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Default Re: Tenancy agreements

Blown away by the responses on here, can't thank you guys enough for rallying round to help. Isolation is a terrible thing, even in the absence of Corona!

Those links are excellent Siouxie. I have been looking at the sections you recommended and have some direction now. I'm sure it will get worse before it gets better, but at least I have some places to start as you mentioned unobscure..

I'll try keep you guys updated if anything develops.

Thankyou
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Old Jun 2nd 2020, 2:46 am
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Default Re: Tenancy agreements

Originally Posted by CRAY View Post
Blown away by the responses on here, can't thank you guys enough for rallying round to help. Isolation is a terrible thing, even in the absence of Corona!

Those links are excellent Siouxie. I have been looking at the sections you recommended and have some direction now. I'm sure it will get worse before it gets better, but at least I have some places to start as you mentioned unobscure..

I'll try keep you guys updated if anything develops.

Thankyou
Please do. All the best.
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Old Jun 10th 2020, 9:27 pm
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I have started the ball rolling on several of the issues I brought up in this thread. Thanks to the information provided by you fine people. Not out of the woods yet, but progress.

I will update as they conclude and give a review of my experience with the processes, so hopefully others that may be reading this can benefit.

I do have one quick question however, if anyone can input....

Do I have any legal obligation to provide my ex spouse my current address if she was my sponsor and is still under the obligations of the sponsorship agreement? She is pressuring me to give her it, citing that she may need it "if asked by immigration". But I cannot see any benefit to her having it, and a LOT of downsides to providing an abusive and aggressive ex my current residence, considering I left out of fear. Is there any reasonable cause for her to have my address? Or does it simply sound like another method of manipulation.

Kind regards
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